Transcript Part 5:
Mr. Jekielek:
Yes, when people learned that you were using these products.
Ms. Hazan:
First of all, we had threats when we started the hydroxychloroquine protocol. People hated Trump, especially. I’m a Malibu physician and I have a lot of Malibu clients. The first thing I would say is, “Look, I’m going to put you on hydroxychloroquine.” My patients that hated him would say, “No, I’d rather die than take hydroxychloroquine.” That was the first thing they said to me.
I said, “Wait a minute, you’d rather die because you don’t like a person and you don’t like the drug?” I thought, “Why did we make this drug political?” Now I’m going to have to work harder at trying to save this patient.” That was one of the problems, really trying to convince patients.
People were really scared of taking hydroxychloroquine. I remember with one guy it was two o’clock in the morning. He started desaturating, and he was really scared of taking the drug.
That’s when my anger during the pandemic came up. I was nice to the majority of my patients because I would say, “Look, take the drug or die. I can’t help you.” You get to this point as a physician where you’re trying to save someone, but they’re so anxious. It’s like they’re drowning and they’re pulling you with them as they’re drowning and you’re trying to save them.
That’s how I felt during the pandemic. I was tough with them to save their lives. They were so thankful afterwards. One guy couldn’t breathe and I literally told him, “Look, tomorrow you’re going to be dead. There’s nothing I can do about it.” I didn’t want to be mean, but I meant to make them understand the gravity of this, to snap them out of that trend of fear.
Because that’s what it is. It’s like that fear factor where you’re blocked, you’re frozen, and somebody has to shake you up and say, “Take this right now and do it.” This guy, the next day, he could breathe better. All my patients were like, “This stuff really works.”
I said, “Yes, it works.” What are you going to do? It was a difficult time. Our office was hammered with phone calls with threats. “You’re killing people, and how dare you give this?” It was just a crazy time.
Mr. Jekielek:
You still seem to have a robust practice.
Ms. Hazan:
My patients come to me because they’ve seen like 10, 20 doctors, and they basically want to get into the clinical trial world. It’s patients with Crohn’s disease who have tried every biologic and now they’re stuck. They’re still having the disease. They’re still having rectal bleed. Those are the people that come to me. The people that say, “Can we explore something else? Can you figure out a way outside the box to treat me?”
That’s what I am. That’s what I have been with pharma, even, guiding them through protocols over the years. Discovering on the frontline that something wasn’t working and how we can amend the protocol to make it work. That was my role doing all these clinical trials for all these years and I’ve been trained by all these pharmaceutical companies. Surely, I know what I’m doing.
Mr. Jekielek:
That’s very interesting. Basically, your entire practice is outside the box?
Ms. Hazan:
Entirely. That’s who I am as a physician too. I’m not one to follow the guidelines. I’m one to work with the regulatories. I basically work with the FDA. It’s that kind of relationship where they give me 25 pages of documents and I give them back and we have this relationship. It’s a respectful relationship. I like the FDA watching over things.
The FDA is overworked, understaffed, and overwhelmed. There’s just too much to do. Think about the probiotics I just told you about. There is no way the FDA is watching all these yogurts at Whole Foods or Ralph’s. They have to watch everywhere. These vitamins that have arsenic, there’s no way the FDA is going to be watching that.
There’s a lot of products out there that are just coming out in every direction, especially now that we’re in the probiotic world. A lot of people are just starting their probiotics and say, “Here’s a yogurt with a new bacteria, and because we don’t have the money to put it through a clinical trial, let’s just put it out as a nutritional product.”
Well, is that going to kill me? Is that bacteria good for me? Is that bacteria compatible with me? We’re entering a dangerous world with all these nutraceuticals and nutrients. There’s no way that an agency can overlook all of that.
Mr. Jekielek:
What happened with these patents that you filed in the end?
Ms. Hazan:
I still have them. In fact, here’s one. Here’s my beautiful little patent. This is the patent of azithromycin, vitamin C, vitamin D, and then hydroxychloroquine with showing the virus in there and then how the virus disappears. That was our reason for getting it, but also showing the data at the beginning. That’s how we got it.
I created them and then I realized somewhere along the line that because this was so political and so looked at, and I didn’t want my research to be jeopardized. People tried to buy these patents and I said, “No, I don’t feel comfortable selling them because I don’t want people saying, ‘Oh, well, she created these patents and now she’s selling them.’”
I basically created them. I have them. I’m not convinced that they should be a product, to be quite honest, because I feel that what I did during the pandemic was really the art of medicine.
I really feel that it was not a one pill solution. It was not a one formula. Sure, the formula, the concept of hydroxy/Z-Pak, vitamin C, D and zinc was great for a certain population. The population that probably has a destroyed microbiome to begin with. I’m not sure that for the healthy young population that was the solution.
Probably it’s the same thing with giving a prophylaxis. I’m thinking vitamins and boosting your microbiome is probably the best option to staying healthy. Certainly, I’ve been the guinea pig on that. I’ve flown, I’ve gone to Zimbabwe, I’ve gone to Paris, I’ve spoken at different places, like Malaysia.
All I’ve really been doing is my vitamins and my foods and my diet and trying to stay steady, balanced, and happy. That’s really the best defense that we can have to fight the next virus that’s coming.
Ultimately, there will always be a population that has something in their microbiome that is stronger. Think about the resilient microbiome. The person that eats 10,000 calories and doesn’t gain a pound, or the person that eats junk food and is healthy and is able to be a marathon runner. There is something to that resilient microbiome, and that resilience goes with surviving COVID, but also resilience in possibly surviving complications of vaccines.
I think on both sides. We need to figure out who has the resilient microbiome and what do they have that nobody else has, so that we can learn from them, rather than, “Let’s continue with the same method of just vaccinating everyone or giving medications to everyone.” Let’s figure out how, when you have a problem, to treat the problem. Treat the population that’s at high risk, and then the population that’s healthy, leave them healthy.
Do not confuse the two populations. The mistake we made in this pandemic, to get back to your question, and we were wrong. What we were wrong is we generalized, we globalized. We thought everybody was equal in their microbiome. We’re not.
We’re all different. Africans have a different microbiome than Americans. They probably would have been fine with COVID because there is diversity in Africa. If you look at the Amish population versus a person in New York, it’s a completely different microbiome.
I treated people in the Amazon jungle during the pandemic. Very few people were sick with COVID. They were all fine, and there was no point in going into the Amazon jungle to vaccinate them. They were living in the environment. What’s going to kill you in the Amazon jungle is a tree falling.
We make the mistake that we need to have everybody be like us and have the same pill and have the same formula, but we don’t realize that everybody has a different culture, a different food intake, a different stress level, and a different temperament. All that, in my opinion, plays a role in your microbiome.
Transcript Part 5: Mr. Jekielek: Yes, when people learned that you were using these products.
Ms. Hazan: First of all, we had threats when we started the hydroxychloroquine protocol. People hated Trump, especially. I’m a Malibu physician and I have a lot of Malibu clients. The first thing I would say is, “Look, I’m going to put you on hydroxychloroquine.” My patients that hated him would say, “No, I’d rather die than take hydroxychloroquine.” That was the first thing they said to me.
I said, “Wait a minute, you’d rather die because you don’t like a person and you don’t like the drug?” I thought, “Why did we make this drug political?” Now I’m going to have to work harder at trying to save this patient.” That was one of the problems, really trying to convince patients.
People were really scared of taking hydroxychloroquine. I remember with one guy it was two o’clock in the morning. He started desaturating, and he was really scared of taking the drug.
That’s when my anger during the pandemic came up. I was nice to the majority of my patients because I would say, “Look, take the drug or die. I can’t help you.” You get to this point as a physician where you’re trying to save someone, but they’re so anxious. It’s like they’re drowning and they’re pulling you with them as they’re drowning and you’re trying to save them.
That’s how I felt during the pandemic. I was tough with them to save their lives. They were so thankful afterwards. One guy couldn’t breathe and I literally told him, “Look, tomorrow you’re going to be dead. There’s nothing I can do about it.” I didn’t want to be mean, but I meant to make them understand the gravity of this, to snap them out of that trend of fear.
Because that’s what it is. It’s like that fear factor where you’re blocked, you’re frozen, and somebody has to shake you up and say, “Take this right now and do it.” This guy, the next day, he could breathe better. All my patients were like, “This stuff really works.”
I said, “Yes, it works.” What are you going to do? It was a difficult time. Our office was hammered with phone calls with threats. “You’re killing people, and how dare you give this?” It was just a crazy time.
Mr. Jekielek: You still seem to have a robust practice.
Ms. Hazan: My patients come to me because they’ve seen like 10, 20 doctors, and they basically want to get into the clinical trial world. It’s patients with Crohn’s disease who have tried every biologic and now they’re stuck. They’re still having the disease. They’re still having rectal bleed. Those are the people that come to me. The people that say, “Can we explore something else? Can you figure out a way outside the box to treat me?”
That’s what I am. That’s what I have been with pharma, even, guiding them through protocols over the years. Discovering on the frontline that something wasn’t working and how we can amend the protocol to make it work. That was my role doing all these clinical trials for all these years and I’ve been trained by all these pharmaceutical companies. Surely, I know what I’m doing.
Mr. Jekielek: That’s very interesting. Basically, your entire practice is outside the box?
Ms. Hazan: Entirely. That’s who I am as a physician too. I’m not one to follow the guidelines. I’m one to work with the regulatories. I basically work with the FDA. It’s that kind of relationship where they give me 25 pages of documents and I give them back and we have this relationship. It’s a respectful relationship. I like the FDA watching over things.
The FDA is overworked, understaffed, and overwhelmed. There’s just too much to do. Think about the probiotics I just told you about. There is no way the FDA is watching all these yogurts at Whole Foods or Ralph’s. They have to watch everywhere. These vitamins that have arsenic, there’s no way the FDA is going to be watching that.
There’s a lot of products out there that are just coming out in every direction, especially now that we’re in the probiotic world. A lot of people are just starting their probiotics and say, “Here’s a yogurt with a new bacteria, and because we don’t have the money to put it through a clinical trial, let’s just put it out as a nutritional product.”
Well, is that going to kill me? Is that bacteria good for me? Is that bacteria compatible with me? We’re entering a dangerous world with all these nutraceuticals and nutrients. There’s no way that an agency can overlook all of that.
Mr. Jekielek: What happened with these patents that you filed in the end?
Ms. Hazan: I still have them. In fact, here’s one. Here’s my beautiful little patent. This is the patent of azithromycin, vitamin C, vitamin D, and then hydroxychloroquine with showing the virus in there and then how the virus disappears. That was our reason for getting it, but also showing the data at the beginning. That’s how we got it.
I created them and then I realized somewhere along the line that because this was so political and so looked at, and I didn’t want my research to be jeopardized. People tried to buy these patents and I said, “No, I don’t feel comfortable selling them because I don’t want people saying, ‘Oh, well, she created these patents and now she’s selling them.’”
I basically created them. I have them. I’m not convinced that they should be a product, to be quite honest, because I feel that what I did during the pandemic was really the art of medicine.
I really feel that it was not a one pill solution. It was not a one formula. Sure, the formula, the concept of hydroxy/Z-Pak, vitamin C, D and zinc was great for a certain population. The population that probably has a destroyed microbiome to begin with. I’m not sure that for the healthy young population that was the solution.
Probably it’s the same thing with giving a prophylaxis. I’m thinking vitamins and boosting your microbiome is probably the best option to staying healthy. Certainly, I’ve been the guinea pig on that. I’ve flown, I’ve gone to Zimbabwe, I’ve gone to Paris, I’ve spoken at different places, like Malaysia.
All I’ve really been doing is my vitamins and my foods and my diet and trying to stay steady, balanced, and happy. That’s really the best defense that we can have to fight the next virus that’s coming.
Ultimately, there will always be a population that has something in their microbiome that is stronger. Think about the resilient microbiome. The person that eats 10,000 calories and doesn’t gain a pound, or the person that eats junk food and is healthy and is able to be a marathon runner. There is something to that resilient microbiome, and that resilience goes with surviving COVID, but also resilience in possibly surviving complications of vaccines.
I think on both sides. We need to figure out who has the resilient microbiome and what do they have that nobody else has, so that we can learn from them, rather than, “Let’s continue with the same method of just vaccinating everyone or giving medications to everyone.” Let’s figure out how, when you have a problem, to treat the problem. Treat the population that’s at high risk, and then the population that’s healthy, leave them healthy.
Do not confuse the two populations. The mistake we made in this pandemic, to get back to your question, and we were wrong. What we were wrong is we generalized, we globalized. We thought everybody was equal in their microbiome. We’re not.
We’re all different. Africans have a different microbiome than Americans. They probably would have been fine with COVID because there is diversity in Africa. If you look at the Amish population versus a person in New York, it’s a completely different microbiome.
I treated people in the Amazon jungle during the pandemic. Very few people were sick with COVID. They were all fine, and there was no point in going into the Amazon jungle to vaccinate them. They were living in the environment. What’s going to kill you in the Amazon jungle is a tree falling.
We make the mistake that we need to have everybody be like us and have the same pill and have the same formula, but we don’t realize that everybody has a different culture, a different food intake, a different stress level, and a different temperament. All that, in my opinion, plays a role in your microbiome.