I've done classic debate in high school, and my career demanded the ability to make technical presentations and field hardball questions, so my standard is fairly high. I did not think this was a particularly stellar debate. Trump was on his toes and hit hard punches, although not necessarily on the specific topic under discussion. My perfectionist tendencies get annoyed with that, but Trump is a street fighter who picks his punches and I cannot gainsay him. He was watching Biden like a hawk, and didn't mind if his face projected deadly intent and disdain for the proceedings. As for Biden, I was actually surprised that he was able to hold it together as long as he did. But in his case, it was mostly platitude salad and mythical gaslighting. I couldn't tell if he believed his own gaslighting, or just didn't care what he threw out. His tendency to waver on target got more pronounced toward the end. On the whole, balancing style and content, I think Trump was more effective at punching, but that there was poor engagement with the debate questions. (Biden very conspicuously was losing his cool toward the end.)
What really surprised me was the reaction of the CNN panel at the end, a chorus of "O woe is us." Seasoned veteran Biden loyalists like Van Jones and David Axelrod declared it a disaster, and floated the idea that "Now is the time for Biden to consider stepping aside," because he was so clearly past his shelf life. One observer said basically, "Who is this Joe Biden? We were told he was going to save the world, and he is just miserable. Somebody in the Democrat Party has been lying to us and needs to be held to account." The general sentiment was that there was no way that Biden could pull a victory out of this header. Watching this dismayed reaction, commiseration, and self-deluded myth-making was more engrossing than the debate.
I don't think any of this was scripted. That's just a fantasy. Biden was carefully executing his talking points, so maybe you could say he was "scripted," but that is not the point. He was just continuing the "narrative." Trump was clearly operating as an impromptu speaker, exploiting the turn of events and the terrain. The panel at the end was a shocker, because I would not have expected such candor to be expressed to a national audience. They were oblivious to the fact they had an audience, and were all wrapped up in a group autopsy. I would have expected seasoned operatives, such as they were, to be more circumspect and elliptical in anything said publicly, if they had such deep-reaching misgivings. How does it help the Democrat cause to show the nation all the doubts and flaws? I've never seen the like.
Maybe Biden was just the copper penny in the fusebox.
I agree that President Trump wasn’t as precise in his refuting biden’s accusations. I was thinking of my Mom watching who doesn’t like DJT and the impact that could have on her and people like her who will never do the research. However we know the Dems want joe gone and it sounds like the narrative has started.
This is exactly what bothered me, too. Trump’s performance was great… for anyone who already knows and loves him. Not so much for those who despise him based on fake media outrage.
Trump had several great opportunities to clear up much of the disinformation people have about him.
He seized some of these opportunities, such as the lie that Trump called soldiers “suckers and losers”, by appealing to logic and reason (“how does that even make sense, and where is the corroborating evidence?”).
Federally banning birth control pills was tackled head on as a state’s rights issue that is being handled by the courts, and Trump has made no such move to ban Federally.
But in too many other instances, Biden tee’d Trump up to refute media disinformation with similar appeals to logic and facts, and Trump whisked past them as though his audience already knew the details.
“Good people on both sides” wasn’t explained as the unifying statement it was meant to be, appealing to the fact that there were ordinary citizens protesting both in favor of and against a statue.
His immigration plan wasn’t explained as respecting the legal process and protecting controlled, legal immigration while getting rid of the criminals and gangs.
His economic policies weren’t explained for empowering normal citizens the way we know they do. Economically, most of the focus was on how poor things are under Biden, not how much better they were under Trump.
He conducted himself well, rarely appeared too aggressive, and presented himself as a leader. But he didn’t do enough to speak to the people who only know him via CNN banter.
Frankly, he does a better job speaking to outsiders at his rallies, taking more time to show himself as the funny, kind, enigmatic, and prescient leader he is. This was his opportunity to show the country this side of him, and instead we saw… a guy that seems Presidential and better than Biden.
Which is… fine. But I want the country to realize that Trump isn’t just a tolerable leader, or a lesser of two evils. I want them to realize he’s a great leader, and exactly what we need. This was his last chance to do that pre-election, and it didn’t land that way.
I disagree. Trump brought his "resting tolerant face" and was the adult in the room. His opponent was angry and was probably being prompted to be that way, but his anger LOOKS evil; he can't help it.
Whatever drugs they gave him will have repercussions. Remember the SOTU and his extra flubs afterward? It's cruel to treat anyone that way. I think the drugs are accelerating his dementia and it should be obvious to all.
I've done classic debate in high school, and my career demanded the ability to make technical presentations and field hardball questions, so my standard is fairly high. I did not think this was a particularly stellar debate. Trump was on his toes and hit hard punches, although not necessarily on the specific topic under discussion. My perfectionist tendencies get annoyed with that, but Trump is a street fighter who picks his punches and I cannot gainsay him. He was watching Biden like a hawk, and didn't mind if his face projected deadly intent and disdain for the proceedings. As for Biden, I was actually surprised that he was able to hold it together as long as he did. But in his case, it was mostly platitude salad and mythical gaslighting. I couldn't tell if he believed his own gaslighting, or just didn't care what he threw out. His tendency to waver on target got more pronounced toward the end. On the whole, balancing style and content, I think Trump was more effective at punching, but that there was poor engagement with the debate questions. (Biden very conspicuously was losing his cool toward the end.)
What really surprised me was the reaction of the CNN panel at the end, a chorus of "O woe is us." Seasoned veteran Biden loyalists like Van Jones and David Axelrod declared it a disaster, and floated the idea that "Now is the time for Biden to consider stepping aside," because he was so clearly past his shelf life. One observer said basically, "Who is this Joe Biden? We were told he was going to save the world, and he is just miserable. Somebody in the Democrat Party has been lying to us and needs to be held to account." The general sentiment was that there was no way that Biden could pull a victory out of this header. Watching this dismayed reaction, commiseration, and self-deluded myth-making was more engrossing than the debate.
I don't think any of this was scripted. That's just a fantasy. Biden was carefully executing his talking points, so maybe you could say he was "scripted," but that is not the point. He was just continuing the "narrative." Trump was clearly operating as an impromptu speaker, exploiting the turn of events and the terrain. The panel at the end was a shocker, because I would not have expected such candor to be expressed to a national audience. They were oblivious to the fact they had an audience, and were all wrapped up in a group autopsy. I would have expected seasoned operatives, such as they were, to be more circumspect and elliptical in anything said publicly, if they had such deep-reaching misgivings. How does it help the Democrat cause to show the nation all the doubts and flaws? I've never seen the like.
Maybe Biden was just the copper penny in the fusebox.
I agree that President Trump wasn’t as precise in his refuting biden’s accusations. I was thinking of my Mom watching who doesn’t like DJT and the impact that could have on her and people like her who will never do the research. However we know the Dems want joe gone and it sounds like the narrative has started.
This is exactly what bothered me, too. Trump’s performance was great… for anyone who already knows and loves him. Not so much for those who despise him based on fake media outrage.
Trump had several great opportunities to clear up much of the disinformation people have about him.
He seized some of these opportunities, such as the lie that Trump called soldiers “suckers and losers”, by appealing to logic and reason (“how does that even make sense, and where is the corroborating evidence?”).
Federally banning birth control pills was tackled head on as a state’s rights issue that is being handled by the courts, and Trump has made no such move to ban Federally.
But in too many other instances, Biden tee’d Trump up to refute media disinformation with similar appeals to logic and facts, and Trump whisked past them as though his audience already knew the details.
“Good people on both sides” wasn’t explained as the unifying statement it was meant to be, appealing to the fact that there were ordinary citizens protesting both in favor of and against a statue.
His immigration plan wasn’t explained as respecting the legal process and protecting controlled, legal immigration while getting rid of the criminals and gangs.
His economic policies weren’t explained for empowering normal citizens the way we know they do. Economically, most of the focus was on how poor things are under Biden, not how much better they were under Trump.
He conducted himself well, rarely appeared too aggressive, and presented himself as a leader. But he didn’t do enough to speak to the people who only know him via CNN banter.
Frankly, he does a better job speaking to outsiders at his rallies, taking more time to show himself as the funny, kind, enigmatic, and prescient leader he is. This was his opportunity to show the country this side of him, and instead we saw… a guy that seems Presidential and better than Biden.
Which is… fine. But I want the country to realize that Trump isn’t just a tolerable leader, or a lesser of two evils. I want them to realize he’s a great leader, and exactly what we need. This was his last chance to do that pre-election, and it didn’t land that way.
I disagree. Trump brought his "resting tolerant face" and was the adult in the room. His opponent was angry and was probably being prompted to be that way, but his anger LOOKS evil; he can't help it.
Whatever drugs they gave him will have repercussions. Remember the SOTU and his extra flubs afterward? It's cruel to treat anyone that way. I think the drugs are accelerating his dementia and it should be obvious to all.