...Biden said. “When my lawyers were clearing out my office at the University of Pennsylvania, they set up an office for me, secure office in the capital when I, for four years after being vice president, I was a professor at Penn. They found some documents in a box, you know, a locked cabinet, or at least a closet...
...Biden said that when he was briefed about the lawyer’s discovery, he was “surprised to learn that there are any government records that were taken there to that office.” “But I don’t know what’s in the documents,” Biden claimed.....
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/798
...(a) Whoever knowingly and willfully communicates, furnishes, transmits, or otherwise makes available to an unauthorized person, or publishes, or uses in any manner prejudicial to the safety or interest of the United States...
My "armchair lawyer" thinking:
•Biden admits to knowingly allowing other persons besides himself to access/move docs.
•Biden admits to his office being used to facilitate misplaced classified docs.
•Biden admits that he had no knowledge of other persons moving docs to that location. That is a tacit admission that he did not (could not) know if the docs that left his possession were being moved/handled by authorized personnel, or not.
From my point of view, it seems clear that Biden is looking to throw one or more of his lawyers under the bus- or more likely one of their employees, for "accidentally" moving classified docs. My contention is that it was still Biden's legal responsibility to safeguard those documents, regardless of if he had legal authority (he didn't) to take those docs, or not.
Biden's public statement require legal action to be taken immediately, without need for determining (wasting time) whether or not he had any authority to possess the docs in the first place.
So in my armchair lawyer opinion, I say rush the play call, and run the ball straight up the middle, right now, and gain ground while the dems are still disoriented from Joe fumbling the ball. We need to know who had possession of those docs, besides Biden. This demands an investigation.
I mean, the answer is YES Biden is beyond a shadow of a doubt guilty of numerous felonies by his own admissions one of which you've quoted here.
But... here's the thing. He "cooperated." You know, it was just an honest mistake and OF COURSE we IMMEDIATELY followed protocol and contacted the National Records, whom we have been working with to correct the error. National Records communicated with DoJ, who according to protocol assigned a really great counselor to review the matter... you know, actually, he's U.S. Attorney for the Northern District of Illinois John Lausch, who WAS A TRUMP APPOINTMENT so really you can see, we're taking this VERY seriously.
As President Biden has stated before, he takes documents and records very seriously, and he was SHOCKED at how IRRESPONSIBLE former game show host and ex President Trump was with the mishandling of documents after his term ended. I mean that's a serious problem and has NATIONAL SECURITY IMPLICATIONS, man, I mean c'mon!
So of course, you can see that, y'know, we've just tried to come forward AND BE TRANSPARENT ABOUT THIS, follow the protocols and collaborate with the appropriate agencies to rectify the matter. Biden's team was committed to being forthcoming because, after all, it was an HONEST MISTAKE and you see, he didn't know about them or how he got them! So like, nah, there's REALLY NO CRIME HERE!
I MEAN THIS HAPPENS A LOT AND MOSTLY, YOU KNOW, ITS AN ACCIDENT, AND WE WANT TO WORK TO FIX IT.
So in the spirit of that we just need to all calm down, because this has happened to MANY, MANY government employees and former ones before, and if we just like, y'know, OPENED MASSIVE TAXPAYER FUNDED INVESTIGATIONS every time it did, we would be throwing half of Washington in jail for FELONIES! No no no.
I mean you know, the thing is that when DoJ looks at this, they just review to kinda MAKE SURE you're not doing anything nefarious and as long as you're coming forward and not trying to hide what was found or how they got there, we pretty much let it slide most of the time.
That's my impression of [DS] Biden and the Lamestream Media's appeal to why Biden should NOT be held accountable.. how did I do?
You got the MSM narrative part down 100% correct. They are indeed setting up to play the old "no intent to commit crime gambit" just like Comey did with the HRC "matter."
But you missed the point I am trying to make in this thread.
The point I am making is that if Biden "didn't know," then he admits that the document's were in possession of someone else and moved to a location without his knowledge. Not knowing that; not being in control of those document's, is a crime in and of itself.
And that crime is a separate issue from how he illegally got possession of those document's in the first place. We need an investigation to find out who specifically moved those documents, now that Biden has claimed that he didn't put them there, and has no knowledge of them being moved there.
Ok, I see what you're saying now!
Completely right you are, and I DO think thats where it's going to end up going. where and from who did you get these? It probably won't help when a couple more sets pop up in the next few days too.
As Renegade said never underestimate Joe's ability to fuck things up. He might get them ALL caught LOL.
I posted a second and WAYYYY longer comment to cover more ground.... just ignore anything that looks like disagreement in it haha, I was just working through it and laying it all out again. You have a better handle on it than I realized when I read OP
In general though I think it's going to be very painful and embarrassing for more people than just Joe
And I was trying to point out that THEY SCREWED THEMSELVES by hyping up the whole thing with Trump and setting a new standard for docs related issues when in the past they werent treated as potentially criminal
So they have to fake that they are taking Biden's stuff as serious as Trump and that is going to lead to bad places for them by exposing the hypocrisy better than ever and making weaponization of DoJ blatantly obvious
Like usual Trump fools them into digging a grave for him and then they proceed to fall into it 😂
biden says he didnt mean to be irresponsible..but he was and the question has to be asked...if he forgot about these documents how many more are out there he forgot about?...the blaring difference between him and Trump is Trump had the power of declass and biden didnt
plus djt had his in a scif, not a filing cabinet
And that's a good point too. We now see TWO different cases where classified docs were found squirreled away where they didn't belong.
How many more classified documents are "missing" from Joe Biden's memory banks? How may other people have handled those docs; did all of those people have clearance to even see them, much less move them?
I think the 'honest mistake' narrative would work for one instance. But now there's two. It's starting to show a pattern. And that's a big problem for them.
If this is their position, which I have no doubt is the case, it reminds me of how Paul Manafort was charged, tortured, and persecuted for violating the Foreign Agent Registration Act (FARA). It wasn't ever really enforced prior to the Trump presidency, but was used unsuccessfully to leverage Manafort to 'get Trump'. The hypocrisy here was outlandish in that Manafort was targeted while Tony Podesta and his Podesta Group was actually the much bigger fish violating FARA. Manafort basically got referrals from the Podesta Group for lobbying on behalf of Ukraine. This "crime" was not properly registering under FARA, to which Tony Podesta was allowed to 'correct' the record and register after the fact, while Manafort was not allowed the same decency.
It's like helping the fire department put out the apartment fire you set. Oh, and it wasn't YOUR apartment, but those of someone you didn't like. Trump was licensed to do a control burn of his land. Such a massive difference, but leftists just don't seem to get it. Willful blindness.
Report: Joe Biden Aides Discover More Classified Documents at Separate Location 2,056 joe biden 2024Kay Nietfeld/picture alliance via Getty Images CHARLIE SPIERING11 Jan 20236,180 President Joe Biden’s aides have discovered more classified documents in his possession at a different location, according to a report from NBC News.
The report does not say where or when the new documents were discovered, but it is clear the White House is attempting to clean up Biden’s records ahead of a possible run for reelection in 2024.
The newly discovered documents are from a location separate from the private office connected to a University of Pennsylvania think tank that Biden had in Washington, DC, where the first batch of classified information was discovered.
Biden claimed Tuesday he was “surprised” that classified documents were found in his possession, repeating he was ignorant of their contents.
“I was briefed about this discovery, and surprised to learn that there are any government records that were taken there to that office,” Biden said, reacting for the first time to the news during a press event in Mexico City.
“I don’t know what’s in the documents,” he continued. “My lawyers have not suggested I not ask what documents they were.”
Biden also revealed Tuesday there were “boxes” of documents that were turned over to the archives.
The White House has stonewalled any additional information about the documents that were first discovered just days before the 2022 midterm elections.
White House press secretary Karine Jean-Pierre refused to even confirm whether Biden’s aides were searching his other properties to see if they contained classified documents.
I can hardly wait to hear the excuse for this second classified docs fumble. But, it is evidence of a pattern of behavior involving mishandled classified docs. Overwork his lawyers to death.
Now would be a nice time to see Durham pour some gasoline on this smoldering dumpster fire of an administration.
The TV will say there was no ill intent, then the normies will bleat "there was no ill intent."
It seems like the whole Biden family may have a problem with keeping up with things. Laptop, diary, and now documents. What else have they left laying around.
Keystone State?
If he's denying any knowledge they were TAKEN to that office then he's claiming someone else took them. How did this person have access to them?
That is exactly what needs to happen. "Who moved the document's, Joe?" Joe claims they are cooperating, so let's get the names right NOW of who moved the docs. The longer they delay answering the question, the more it moves towards obstruction of justice. Let's get that question asked ASAP- preferably under oath.
Who pays lawyers rates to have an office cleaned out?
I don't know, but it sounds like a very lucrative business opportunity for a Washington DC based business. Get a bunch of hefty, corn-fed lawyer types, with high level security clearances, and start up a DC based office moving company. Brilliant! But surely, I jest.
Don't call me Shirley
$1500/hr lawyers "cleaning out" his office....Yeah...mmmkay.
I'd rather turn the clock back for "legitimate" (notice the sarcasm) presidents: Reagan as president, Bush as VP. If Bush had taken classified documents while VP, which was then found out while he was president, could he then have declassified those documents to avoid getting in to any trouble?
Technically speaking, no, crimes involving classified materials are centered on the time/date of the crime. The laws that were in place at the time of the crime apply, and post changes to those laws do not retroactively affect the legality of prior crimes. That point is covered in the Cornell Law link posted in the OP.
Biden is still the best President China ever had! KEK
I'll throw a part 2 in here:
Let's count the lies!
So these documents WERE STILL CLASSIFIED when they were taken...which constitutes a felony (and explains why he has claimed no knowledge of them for plausible deniability defense)
Mike Davis does well with this one.
Every document, every time they were moved, and each place they were stored that was improperly suited to hold documents of that classification is a felony. So yeah, ALOT. I said yesterday this was the beginning of the end for them. Its nice to feel a little vindication!
Alright now compare to Trump:
It's not often I agree with Newt or Ingraham but he is starting to peel back what is REALLY underneath all this.
To your post:
Hmmm... no, I don't think so. The lawyers 'discovered them' because Biden already was aware of their existence and having his attorneys present and on-site at the time of "discovery" dissuades from any charges, since their contention will be they "immediately contacted blah blah and followed protocols" ASAP once they knew. That's why lawyers were moving boxes, to help him cover his (or someone else's) ass.
It's been suggested that this could involve Hunter somehow and it wouldn't surprise me; he was after all doing most of the legwork when it came to the influence peddling grift. Didn't it say somewhere in his laptop he was comfortable providing the Chinese with "anything, except military stuff" or something like that?
Oh, you're absolutely right but it won't stick. Hence hiring the lawyers to "find" the docs so they could immediately do what you're supposed to do if/when this happens. Hence leaking the story directly to MSM to assure a positive spin (only once House Republicans started their committees and this was going to be discovered ANYWAY) and give the American people a dog-and-pony show "investigation by a TRUMP APPOINTED D.A. OOH LA LA so we can claim there is no Two-Tier justice system.
Hence so we can cover my son's ass because he left this crap everywhere when he didn't SELL THEM to the CCP or another interest foreign gov. Hence so we can memory hole this problem quicker so that people forget when a whole bunch of worse shit surfaces soon from the numerous investigations. You get the idea.
He will be held responsible about as much as he has for anything else. Dude is pure teflon.... but not in the "cool" Gotti way. In the lame Sonny Gravano way.
Oh but don't you see? Legal action is already underway the DoJ is looking into this matter! Who else is there to charge him? Now of course you could ask why there is no Special Prosecutor especially since they got one sniffing Trump's ass right now and this thing will likely continue to widen and become EXTREMELY EXPLOSIVE I think, at which point Garland WILL FEEL THE HEAT and may appoint one under political pressures to do so.
Because this is going to move WAY past Biden and onto Renegade, Dana the lawyer, Susan Rice and MANY others. You may get a BIG home run and find a whole clandestine industry of these jerks that were selling our state secrets, on paper, to the highest bidder. As I mentioned before: who could have declassified them? How would they have gotten into Biden's hands in the first place?
It really is starting to feel like a new part in the script here... getting back to that 'watching a movie' period of time again. Predicting:
That's just my guess, and whew, this is getting long... I'm always the TLDR guy, for better or worse though! One last thing -that was mentioned by sane, rational folks during the Mar-a-Lago debacle a few months ago.
It DIDN'T have to be this way. The whole issue set of archives, documents, declassification powers was BROUGHT FORWARD BY THEM.
It's common knowledge they OVERUSE the Classified stamp in Washington. As the various 17 agencies have become increasingly arrogant and unaccountable, they started to label anything and everything as classified.
One effect of over classifying was it created more of these situations in recent years. Sometimes accidents DO happen - after all, we're talking about pieces of paper here. In a person's workday they will be walking around holding them, sticking into folders to read later and so on. Shit happens. I have a bad habit of folding and sticking into my pocket - would you make pocketing a lighter a felony? You get the idea. Things make it out sometimes. Benign things get labeled secret.
So there usually has been a kind of unwritten rule to not strictly enforce and punish. Once in a while they might look a little closer just to get situational awareness and make sure you aren't doing this all the time and there isnt something bad going on. So mostly it stands as more of a workplace policy - try not to do it, but if you mess up once or twice you'll get a reprimand, not handcuffs.
So they are actually telling the truth when they come out and say this type of thing happens and it's usually NO BIG DEAL provided you comply, contact the Nat'l Records etc. This explains what we are seeing with Biden, already in progress. They will treat him with the usual banality reserved for this issue. Because "you can trust him," which is the same implicit treatment that anyone in Washington would receive from DoJ when this comes up.
EXCEPT ORANGEMAN! No, for him they applied this impossibly strict and completely ludicrous standard. Everyone with legal expertise and experience in D.C. found the whole thing absolutely laughable! It was just another way to bust his balls, silly, but annoying. UNTIL THE RAID. Simply put they turned not a big deal into VERY BIG DEAL.
The result is this: A RAISED PROFILE. Garland came out himself and said it! They took the matter seriously. They changed expectations: not just for Trump but for everyone! If you were handling classified documents in your job while they happened, you got a lump in your throat and started organizing your desk again. DoJ was telling all of us to GET SERIOUS about this. They would not tolerate classified items being places they shouldn't belong, nor would they play games about compliance. When the Librarian speaks you better listen! Look what happened to Trump.
And now after all their puppets in the media droning on about grave seriousness, psyching themselves and us up.... Can't we just go back to how things were? That's the ask from them. They want to just admit fault, show something that vaguely matches Trump and let the wind blow it away like always. That's exactly why you're hearing "honest mistake" - it was always treated like that.
Biden's document kerfuffle has the distinction of being FAR WORSE than Trump's. With DJT they were clutching at straws and trying to mix up the normal rules with the Presidential ones. All that droning on about proper SCIFs, who had access, nuclear secrets!
Now its hey man chill out, it was just an accident.
That's why it will come out in committee. There won't be anything criminal. But it will be the BEST SHOW of the complete hypocrisy, rules for thee not for me, the have your cake and eat it too. One standard for Trump and one for everyone else. More than just Biden too - a LOT OF PEOPLE are going to smell like shit once this all gets out in public. I hope they take Garland's job for it.... and it could DEFINITELY happen, with how awfully they are trying to apply the law.
Sorry this got long. It deserves attention though and its a complex topic.
"and surprised to learn that there are any government records that were taken there to that office,”
So, he wouldn't be surprised if they were taken someplace else? Time to search everywhere.
He shouldn't have made them available to be seen, or touched, by anyone. Lawyer, staffer, anyone. This is all on him.
Maybe
I held a secret clearance for 17 years. When you sign your briefing, you sign agreeing that the penalty for each violation (one side of one sheet of paper with classified information) is a $10,000 fine AND 10 years in federal prison for each violation. Two pieces of paper, classified info on both sides: $40,000 fine and 40 years in prison.
The fact that this does not apply to some people, is infuriating. I remember being so petrified to leave any classified waste out and not locked in the safe, removable hard drives, printed material, not locked in the safe. Not signing the safe and having a 2nd witness sign. Complete chain of custody. We all took it so seriously and took such care of classified materail.
Watch the pen??? 👀
I have a question... Can the Vice President have classified documents in his possession? Just trying to understand if this is more than it is.
A VP can take classified docs only while in office, and only if authorization is granted for them to do so.
But, a VP cannot keep classified docs after they have left office, and they most certainly cannot allow any unauthorized person's to handle classified docs in any circumstance.
Joe claims he didn't know those docs were moved. Assuming that Joe is telling the truth about that- which he probably is not, that means it's time to find out who did move the docs; on who's orders; and who checked their eligibility for seeing/handling those docs, considering Joe claims he knew nothing about any of this.
Hmmm, could it be that they had these Biden docs before they plotted and planned to raid Trump and find documents. So now when the info is released, they could say, BUT BUT Trump.......
He is playing the, I have no idea how these files got there angle. He thinks that by not showing intent he will be safe like Hillary and her server.
And I sure hope eventually she isn't safe either, if she still even is....
Excellent post
But hey…. They were in my garage… locked next to my corvette…. A corvette man, i mean seriously…. A corvette…
then the FBI takes it all as evidence. holds out presenting it because " ongoing investigation " as long as they can then loses the evidence. This play will be just another injustice of our system to get people upset enough to accept what must really be done.
Follow the pen...
Many of us laughed Brunson off on day one.
Many of us said it's important for Kari to keep fighting.
Many of us laugh at a handshake telling us what to do or think.
u/#glowie