Thanks Steve.

My only caveat on what you write would be that in fact, humans have an aspect that is also transcendent of time and space; we are more than mere flesh. So we CAN experience and even fathom God. At least, we are designed to do so. That's proved by the reality of Jesus Christ.

However, as you point out, the issue is that God transcends time and space and matter, so yeah, OF COURSE they cannot verify, detect or evaluate God via time, space and material means.

However, the view I subscribe to is that our flesh and spirit were designed to be one, by our growing (without sin) to maturity. The problem is, Adam fell, his offspring came under Satan's control and sovereignty, in which God cannot intervene for certain reasons, so that for us, in the state of sin, our spirit and flesh have never achieved the intended unity.

Even after salvation? Well, yes. That's because the salvation through the cross is a spiritual salvation. Jesus offered up his body in our place so that our spirits could be released in order to return to God's sovereignty. But our bodies continue under Satan's rule. And that's why Christ must return; to complete the adoption process so that not only our spirits, but also our bodies are adopted back into God's lineage and removed from Satan's dominion.

When that takes place, with Both spirit and flesh restored back to God's dominion, our spirits will be able to mature fully as originally intended, and then both the realm of spirit AND the realm of flesh will come under God's sovereignty. At that point, science will evolve to include the reality of the spiritual world (which operates on natural law, God's principles, and perfectly, just as much as the material world does), and we will come to understand the reality of spirit just as clearly as we understand thru science today, the reality of atoms, molecules, particles, matter, biology, etc.

In other words, in the Kingdom of Heaven on Earth, science and faith will become perfectly united as two sides of the same coin, just as our spirit and our flesh, both under God's sovereignty, will be in harmony, with no room for sin (or the devil) to creep in and create division within us. Word will equal action, belief will equal experience.

If you read 1st Corinthians and also Romans from the perspective outlined above, it can open up and entirely new dimension of understanding, faith and then heart.

Keywords: adoption, flesh, law of sin, wretched man, etc.

Now we see but a dim reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.

Who is Paul known by? By the Father and by the Son. On that day, Paul will know fully, even as (much as) the Creator and Christ fully know him! His understanding will be raised to that level.

Thanks Steve.

My only caveat on what you write would be that in fact, humans have an aspect that is also transcendent of time and space; we are more than mere flesh. So we CAN experience and even fathom God. At least, we are designed to do so. That's proved by the reality of Jesus Christ.

However, as you point out, the issue is that God transcends time and space and matter, so yeah, OF COURSE they cannot verify, detect or evaluate God via time, space and material means.

However, the view I subscribe to is that our flesh and spirit were designed to be one, by our growing (without sin) to maturity. The problem is, Adam fell, his offspring came under Satan's control and sovereignty, in which God cannot intervene for certain reasons, so that for us, in the state of sin, our spirit and flesh have never achieved the intended unity.

Even after salvation? Well, yes. That's because the salvation through the cross is a spiritual salvation. Jesus offered up his body in our place so that our spirits could be released in order to return to God's sovereignty. But our bodies continue under Satan's rule. And that's why Christ must return; to complete the adoption process so that not only our spirits, but also our bodies are adopted back into God's lineage and removed from Satan's dominion.

When that takes place, with Both spirit and flesh restored back to God's dominion, our spirits will be able to mature fully as originally intended, and then both the realm of spirit AND the realm of flesh will come under God's sovereignty. At that point, science will evolve to include the reality of the spiritual world (which operates on natural law, God's principles, and perfectly, just as much as the material world does), and we will come to understand the reality of spirit just as clearly as we understand thru science today, the reality of atoms, molecules, particles, matter, biology, etc.

In other words, in the Kingdom of Heaven on Earth, science and faith will become perfectly united as two sides of the same coin, just as our spirit and our flesh, both under God's sovereignty, will be in harmony, with no room for sin (or the devil) to creep in and create division within us. Word will equal action, belief will equal experience.

Now we see but a dim reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.

Who is Paul known by? By the Father and by the Son. On that day, Paul will know himself even as the Creator and Christ know him!

If you read 1st Corinthians and also Romans from the perspective outlined above, it can open up and entirely new dimension of understanding, faith and then heart.

Keywords: adoption, flesh, law of sin, wretched man, etc.

Thanks Steve.

My only caveat on what you write would be that in fact, humans have an aspect that is also transcendent of time and space; we are more than mere flesh. So we CAN experience and even fathom God. At least, we are designed to do so. That's proved by the reality of Jesus Christ.

However, as you point out, the issue is that God transcends time and space and matter, so yeah, OF COURSE they cannot verify, detect or evaluate God via time, space and material means.

However, the view I subscribe to is that our flesh and spirit were designed to be one, by our growing (without sin) to maturity. The problem is, Adam fell, his offspring came under Satan's control and sovereignty, in which God cannot intervene for certain reasons, so that for us, in the state of sin, our spirit and flesh have never achieved the intended unity.

Even after salvation? Well, yes. That's because the salvation through the cross is a spiritual salvation. Jesus offered up his body in our place so that our spirits could be released in order to return to God's sovereignty. But our bodies continue under Satan's rule. And that's why Christ must return; to complete the adoption process so that not only our spirits, but also our bodies are adopted back into God's lineage and removed from Satan's dominion.

When that takes place, with Both spirit and flesh restored back to God's dominion, our spirits will be able to mature fully as originally intended, and then both the realm of spirit AND the realm of flesh will come under God's sovereignty. At that point, science will evolve ton include the reality of the spiritual world, and we will come to understand the reality os spirit just as clearly as we understand thru science today, the reality of atoms, molecules, particles, matter, biology, etc.

In other words, in the Kingdom of Heaven on Earth, science and faith will become perfectly united as two sides of the same coin, just as our spirit and our flesh, both under God's sovereignty, will be in harmony, with no room for sin (or the devil) to creep in and create division within us. Word will equal action, belief will equal experience.

Now we see but a dim reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.

Who is Paul known by? By the Father and by the Son. On that day, Paul will know himself even as the Creator and Christ know him!

If you read 1st Corinthians and also Romans from the perspective outlined above, it can open up and entirely new dimension of understanding, faith and then heart.

Keywords: adoption, flesh, law of sin, wretched man, etc.