It is certainly confusing, and I am certainly not going down all these rabbit holes!! but I do want to understand the present influences, back to Christ.

Bottom line? SO the Jewish religion does not accept the Old Testament of the Bible as its history and teaching? And prophesy? I always thought the OT was the "Jewish Bible."

To Christianity, the Old Testament is the Old Covenant. Superceded by the New Covenant created by Jesus Christ and documented by the New Testament. The Jewish People are no longer the Chosen People because they rejected that -- many times with idols and then by rejecting their Messiah Jesus Christ.

Many Jews converted to Christianity, many did not. God opened Salvation to the gentiles as well.

More now than before our conversation, I view Israel as a nation state carved out of geography by the powers that were, for secular reasons, which has nothing to do with the Chosen People or those who lived in Judea at the time of Christ and before.

Thanks fren.

P.S. SO the descendants of Abraham were the Chosen People. Destined to receive the Messiah, the Only Begotten Son of the Father, the Savior! SOME of them were the first to accept Him! His apostles and disciples. It was a bit later they realized their mission was to the gentiles too, and indeed to preach to all peoples of the world! Which many missionaries did and are still doing!

So with all the prophecy etc. the other descendants of Abraham, the jewish people / religion who rejected their special heritage, their special place in history, to reject their own Messiah, they are by definition apostates? Jesus slapped down the Pharisees. What are we to conclude?

I conclude: those of the Chosen People who did not accept Christ are apostates of their own history and faith. How can one view it otherwise?

It is certainly confusing, and I am certainly not going down all these rabbit holes!! but I do want to understand the present influences, back to Christ.

Bottom line? SO the Jewish religion does not accept the Old Testament of the Bible as its history and teaching? And prophesy? I always thought the OT was the "Jewish Bible."

To Christianity, the Old Testament is the Old Covenant. Superceded by the New Covenant created by Jesus Christ and documented by the New Testament. The Jewish People are no longer the Chosen People because they rejected that -- many times with idols and then by rejecting their Messiah Jesus Christ.

Many Jews converted to Christianity, many did not. God opened Salvation to the gentiles as well.

More now than before our conversation, I view Israel as a nation state carved out of geography by the powers that were, for secular reasons, which has nothing to do with the Chosen People or those who lived in Judea at the time of Christ and before.

Thanks fren.