The universe is so large the human mind can’t really grasp its size, and somehow we’re the one and only form of intelligent life that ever came about? Despite carbon being the 4th most common element in the universe, the universe being “fine tuned” to support carbon based biological life, and the fact that a large number of terrestrial exoplanets also orbit their host stars in what’s known as the “Goldilocks zone”, where liquid water is able to exist. Okay sure. And then on top of that, the world is actually only a few thousands of years old, dinosaurs never existed (despite such well documented evidence of them), and there’s a supposedly a single, omnipotent being who started the human race from one male and female pair and loves all of us unconditionally as his “children”, but will damn us to hell for (among other things) questioning his existence when he himself provides zero proof of it. And somehow, despite being an omnipotent sky dude with no human form he was able to biologically impregnate a woman who gave birth to a man who was somehow both his son and himself.
Yeah. Sounds like a super sound line of reasoning, everything checks out!
Why would any god design his creations to have rational thought and then not expect them to use it to reason on his very existence?
For starters, I have read the Bible. Your god sounds like a sociopath, eager to destroy anything and anyone that doesn’t bend to his will (so why bother giving humanity free will to begin with), while the supposed enemy does nothing of note throughout the entire story except for attempting to give humans knowledge he felt they shouldn’t be denied.
I am far from conceited and am very aware of just how little I really know of the universe and it’s vastness. Quite honestly I find it much more humble to admit you don’t know than to assume your religion (and only your religion) knocked it out of the park in one go and is the best road map we have to an understanding of our universe and it’s creator. I mean, it’s pretty arrogant to think that your religion nailed it while others which are older by thousands of years just missed the mark entirely. And likewise it’s quite arrogant to believe that you’re so incredibly right about this (despite there existing no corroborating evidence of any sort outside of your own mythos) that anyone who disagrees with you is going to burn in hell for all eternity. Not because they were bad people who did evil things, but because they doubted the existence of a fairytale or believed in a different fairytale than yours.
Now, as for your claims about the quality of the moral code spoke by Jesus... the quality of any moral code should be determined by the kind of life it gives to its followers, how well they treat one another and the value they see in charity and selflessness. Now personally when I think of Christianity, most of what comes to mind are violent events like the crusades, the inquisition, and witch hunts. As well as less violent but still morally despicable things such as denying single payer health insurance while professing to follow Christ (only the worthy deserve care), showing unabated cruelty and hatred toward LGBTQ+, forcing unmarried mothers to give their babies up for adoption, the whole “undeserving poor”/poor people are poor because they deserve to be argument, anti homeless architecture, and using the Bible to justify domestic violence and slavery (just a couple of examples). My point is, who Jesus was doesn’t matter in the context of the validity of his moral code.
But I’m very interested to know why god was able to do “any number of things” to get around inbreeding and yet seems either completely powerless or completely ambivalent toward human suffering. Young children get cancer and die, single moms are raped and murdered, innocent people serve years in inhuman prison conditions or are put to death... where is god in all of this? I’ve often heard the argument that he doesn’t intervene because of free will and the idea that our “struggles make us stronger”. But if you have the ability and means to help someone and alleviate their pain and you choose not to do it, you’re a psychopath regardless of how you justified your lack of action.
And lastly, I’m curious how “atheist propaganda” is all fake news? Considering the fact that atheism doesn’t look to replace the belief in god with the belief in something else, nor does it attempt to control any other aspect of a person’s life, I find the very idea of an existence of “atheist propaganda” to be dubious. Because in reality, discussions on evolution, the Big Bang, or the existence of dinosaurs isn’t propaganda, it’s just reality. And it’s reality because it’s true whether you accept it or not, the evidence exists and is compelling whether or not you personally factor it into your beliefs on that subject, and said evidence can be found in a multitude of places without the need to look very hard or make large, illogical jumps in your reasoning to justify it.
I’m not interested in salvation. I’m interested in living a good and kind life filled with love and hopefully leaving a better world for my children.
The universe is so large the human mind can’t really grasp its size, and somehow we’re the one and only form of intelligent life that ever came about? Despite carbon being the 4th most common element in the universe, the universe being “fine tuned” to support carbon based biological life, and the fact that a large number of terrestrial exoplanets also orbit their host stars in what’s known as the “Goldilocks zone”, where liquid water is able to exist. Okay sure. And then on top of that, the world is actually only a few thousands of years old, dinosaurs never existed (despite such well documented evidence of them), and there’s a supposedly a single, omnipotent being who started the human race from one male and female pair and loves all of us unconditionally as his “children”, but will damn us to hell for (among other things) questioning his existence when he himself provides zero proof of it. And somehow, despite being an omnipotent sky dude with no human form he was able to biologically impregnate a woman who gave birth to a man who was somehow both his son and himself.
Yeah. Sounds like a super sound line of reasoning, everything checks out!
Why would any god design his creations to have rational thought and then not expect them to use it to reason on his very existence?
For starters, I have read the Bible. Your god sounds like a sociopath, eager to destroy anything and anyone that doesn’t bend to his will (so why bother giving humanity free will to begin with), while the supposed enemy does nothing of note throughout the entire story except for attempting to give humans knowledge he felt they shouldn’t be denied.
I am far from conceited and am very aware of just how little I really know of the universe and it’s vastness. Quite honestly I find it much more humble to admit you don’t know than to assume your religion (and only your religion) knocked it out of the park in one go and is the best road map we have to an understanding of our universe and it’s creator. I mean, it’s pretty arrogant to think that your religion nailed it while others which are older by thousands of years just missed the mark entirely. And likewise it’s quite arrogant to believe that you’re so incredibly right about this (despite there existing no corroborating evidence of any sort outside of your own mythos) that anyone who disagrees with you is going to burn in hell for all eternity. Not because they were bad people who did evil things, but because they doubted the existence of a fairytale or believed in a different fairytale than yours.
Now, as for your claims about the quality of the moral code spoke by Jesus... the quality of any moral code should be determined by the kind of life it gives to its followers, how well they treat one another and the value they see in charity and selflessness. Now personally when I think of Christianity, most of what comes to mind are violent events like the crusades, the inquisition, and witch hunts. As well as less violent but still morally despicable things such as denying single payer health insurance while professing to follow Christ (only the worthy deserve care), showing unabated cruelty and hatred toward LGBTQ+, forcing unmarried mothers to give their babies up for adoption, the whole “undeserving poor”/poor people are poor because they deserve to be argument, anti homeless architecture, and using the Bible to justify domestic violence and slavery (just a couple of examples). My point is, who Jesus was doesn’t matter in the context of the validity of his moral code.
But I’m very interested to know why god was able to do “any number of things” to get around inbreeding and yet seems either completely powerless or completely ambivalent toward human suffering. Young children get cancer and die, single moms are raped and murdered, innocent people serve years in inhuman prison conditions or are put to death... where is god in all of this? I’ve often heard the argument that he doesn’t intervene because of free will and the idea that our “struggles make us stronger”. But if you have the ability and means to help someone and alleviate their pain and you choose not to do it, you’re a psychopath regardless of how you justified your lack of action.
And lastly, I’m curious how “atheist propaganda” is all fake news? Considering the fact that atheism doesn’t look to replace the belief in god with the belief in something else, nor does it attempt to control any other aspect of a person’s life, I find the very idea of an existence of “atheist propaganda” to be dubious. Because in reality, discussions on evolution, the Big Bang, or the existence of dinosaurs isn’t propaganda, it’s just reality. And it’s reality because it’s true whether you accept it or not, the evidence exists and is compelling whether or not you personally factor it into your beliefs on that subject, and said evidence can be found in a multitude of places without the need to look very hard or make large, illogical jumps in your reasoning to justify it.
I’m not interested in salvation. I’m interested in living a good and kind life filled with love and hopefully leaving a better world for my children.