For some people, the problem is that this morality and righteousness is not based on reality or something evidence-based.
Yes, for the most part, Christianity does nurture good behavior and is the foundation of the good western values. However, the motives for these behaviors and values is not based on anything tangible.
This idea is silly, you don't have to worship anything at all to be a good person or an altruistic person. You don't have to worship any particular god to be a good person either. Altruistic behavior even exists in other species.
Religion has done a lot of good for the world but also a lot of bad, Christianity included. So many wars and suffering. Deliberate crimes. Subjugation of vast populations. Political intrigue. Religions are full of the same failings of the non-religious because they are inhabited by human beings. And at the end of the day it is not religion that has advanced the species but dealings outside of it. For a large part of recorded history, humanity has advanced in spite of religious institutions.
I am not disagreeable - I agreed that Christianity produces great results where people do lots of good and establish a society I prefer to live in.
I was answering the question "what is the problem?"
The problem for some people is that the REASON why those who subscribe to Christianity do the good things is not based on reality but faith. Faith that they will be punished if they do not do these things. Faith that they should do the good deeds because it is God's way.
I am not claiming God doesn't exist - I don't know.
If you claim God exists, then define God, and provide evidence to support your claim. If there is sufficient evidence, I will definitely believe your claim. I am open minded.
The more I believe in God the more God reveals himself to me. I don't think someone who is a staunch atheist could ever understand. It is similar to Q- How many coincidences until mathematically impossible? The things I've seen happen I know aren't coincidences. There is more to this world than just a universe and space and planets. I do believe it's God. But I respect your recognition of a Christian society breeding a positive culture. Likewise I respect the other pillars of western culture, our logic and dedication to reason.
I beg to differ, God said exactly what to do and write in several instances. The rest is “God breathes”. No one wrote down anything he didn’t want them to and the Bible has the most and multiple source materials than any other literary work.
Anyone can claim they have the word of God. Anyone couldve claimed their word is the word of God. That's why we have reason.
You know how many times our human language changed throughout the years? You know who was in power as the Bible was spread around? You know who could've changed the meanings, the words, and context of each verse?
I guarantee you, the Bible you read and understand it today is not the Bible that was originally written.
Hell is often described this way because our feeble minds can't perceive anything more painful. Hell really is simply total separation from God and all that He is. Though we can't comprehend it, this fate is infinitely worse than 3 Trillion years burning in a lake of fire. However, the whole point of the Christian faith is that God Himself came down to us in the form of His Son Jesus, who then suffered that pain in sacrifice in our stead so that we would not have to even though we never follo God's commands to the letter.
Yet God is very forgiving. He will forgive a murderer on his death bed. He will forgive a rapist. So long as we truly seek his forgiveness, it can be given.
...given so long as we believe Jesus's death on the cross is sufficient payment for our sins. Otherwise, if God simply wipes our crimes away He's a corrupt judge. Because Jesus took our punishment, He can a transfer His righteousness to us, which preserves God's justice while also letting Him exercise His grace and mercy without hypocrisy.
For some people, the problem is that this morality and righteousness is not based on reality or something evidence-based.
Yes, for the most part, Christianity does nurture good behavior and is the foundation of the good western values. However, the motives for these behaviors and values is not based on anything tangible.
This idea is silly, you don't have to worship anything at all to be a good person or an altruistic person. You don't have to worship any particular god to be a good person either. Altruistic behavior even exists in other species.
Religion has done a lot of good for the world but also a lot of bad, Christianity included. So many wars and suffering. Deliberate crimes. Subjugation of vast populations. Political intrigue. Religions are full of the same failings of the non-religious because they are inhabited by human beings. And at the end of the day it is not religion that has advanced the species but dealings outside of it. For a large part of recorded history, humanity has advanced in spite of religious institutions.
I am not disagreeable - I agreed that Christianity produces great results where people do lots of good and establish a society I prefer to live in.
I was answering the question "what is the problem?"
The problem for some people is that the REASON why those who subscribe to Christianity do the good things is not based on reality but faith. Faith that they will be punished if they do not do these things. Faith that they should do the good deeds because it is God's way.
Except there is plenty of evidence to the existence of God. There is Zero Evidence disproving his existence.
I am not claiming God doesn't exist - I don't know.
If you claim God exists, then define God, and provide evidence to support your claim. If there is sufficient evidence, I will definitely believe your claim. I am open minded.
The more I believe in God the more God reveals himself to me. I don't think someone who is a staunch atheist could ever understand. It is similar to Q- How many coincidences until mathematically impossible? The things I've seen happen I know aren't coincidences. There is more to this world than just a universe and space and planets. I do believe it's God. But I respect your recognition of a Christian society breeding a positive culture. Likewise I respect the other pillars of western culture, our logic and dedication to reason.
The Christian behaviors and values are based in Jesus.
I think God saying it is more than tangible.
Alleged witnesses to God wrote your Bible. Not God himself.
Actually God wrote the Bible through said Witnesses.
I beg to differ, God said exactly what to do and write in several instances. The rest is “God breathes”. No one wrote down anything he didn’t want them to and the Bible has the most and multiple source materials than any other literary work.
Anyone can claim they have the word of God. Anyone couldve claimed their word is the word of God. That's why we have reason.
You know how many times our human language changed throughout the years? You know who was in power as the Bible was spread around? You know who could've changed the meanings, the words, and context of each verse?
I guarantee you, the Bible you read and understand it today is not the Bible that was originally written.
How so? The fear of punishment for eternity in Hell provides marvelous results.
Hell is often described this way because our feeble minds can't perceive anything more painful. Hell really is simply total separation from God and all that He is. Though we can't comprehend it, this fate is infinitely worse than 3 Trillion years burning in a lake of fire. However, the whole point of the Christian faith is that God Himself came down to us in the form of His Son Jesus, who then suffered that pain in sacrifice in our stead so that we would not have to even though we never follo God's commands to the letter.
It's harsh, but so is Rape, Murder, etc.
Yet God is very forgiving. He will forgive a murderer on his death bed. He will forgive a rapist. So long as we truly seek his forgiveness, it can be given.
...given so long as we believe Jesus's death on the cross is sufficient payment for our sins. Otherwise, if God simply wipes our crimes away He's a corrupt judge. Because Jesus took our punishment, He can a transfer His righteousness to us, which preserves God's justice while also letting Him exercise His grace and mercy without hypocrisy.