It's a combination of both. Let's not mence words. MANY religious people don't get their moral code from the Bible or what a priest says. A lot of it comes from social pressures and community norms. That's exactly why you have inner city gang bangers who murder people on Saturday and go to church on Sunday. They believe in god they just choose to ignore the parts that aren't convenient to their chosen way to make money.
EVERYONE chooses their own path. If you think otherwise you're a fool. I am a more moral person that 90% of the "Christians" I've met in my life. I don't steal. I don't do drugs. I help people when I can, etc etc. There are a few things the bible says I shouldn't do that I don't believe in because the truth is they hurt no one so I ignore those rules. IE the ban on premarital sex. I don't even believe in marriage. Why? Because its based entirely on social norms created by religion. Why should I hold myself to rules and norms created by a false god? That isn't a moral issue anyway. Its a religion issue.
But yes many things come from what the majority agrees on. IE not having sex with anyone under 18. Don't get me wrong I'm no pedo, but up until around 100 to 150 years ago it was the norm for woman the get married and have kids at 15 or 16. The idea we have to wait for some arbitrary age defined by puritanical minded Christians is just silly. Its has little to nothing to do with a moral code and everything to do with an arbitrary rule.
That said I want to be clear... people who seek out prepubescent children or people who abuse their authority, entrap or enslave weak defenseless young people, etc... those people should be dealt with harshly. However, should a man over 18 be lucky enough to meet some 16 year old that was actually mature enough and wanted a relationship with them the arbitrary rules we put in place make that crime. They literally criminalize love. Talk about immoral. Although recently many states have made Romeo and Juliet laws to fix exactly this problem. However, they put age caps on it which is yet again arbitrary. They act like a 30 year old can't actually fall in love with a 17 year old and vice versa. Like its is completely impossible.
People like Epstein should be crushed because they are just abusing young women. However, the way they leave no room for the possibility of a real bond is in itself criminal if you asked me. And no I'm not talking about those retards in NAMBLA who want to be with 10 year olds. Fuck those retards. Or the idiots trolling for 13-14 years olds on the internet.
I hold myself to the given laws of a particular state because that is the sane thing to do and I have some self control. Its one of my biggest points about Epstein. That idiot had hundreds of millions of dollars. He could have setup shop in any state. MANY states have an age of consent that is 17 or even 16.
All that idiot had to do is buy a mansion on the GA coast and he could round up, abuse, and pay all the 16+ year old girls he liked. It wouldn't have been illegal. It was never about that though. He could have just as easily made a point of being with 18 year olds in FL. No the whole point was he felt he was above the law. He felt like he could do anything he wanted to anyone he wanted and no one could stop him. Is what he did moral? I'd say no, mainly because of his intent which was to use and abuse them.
There is a reason they have whole classes devoted to morality etc. Truth is we could never discus it all here. There is one other truth though... most of those classes have been perverted by Marxists to the point were the class itself is immoral. They now teach people to be evil. That's the root of many of our problems today. We allow these lunatics to teach our children and just hope they don't corrupt them.
The idea that a proper moral center can ONLY come from god is so utterly ridiculous its laughable. Fact of the matter is for decades there were atheists that went all in on "secular humanism". It was peace at all costs. Which is actually why we are in the mess we are in. Tons of people in Europe went down that road. Some consider that to be a more moral path than Christianity.
Nothing has to lead to might over right. You've missed the whole point of morality if you believe that is the only other path to follow. Let's face facts Christians spent hundreds of years murdering innocent people in the name of god. They repressed science and are pretty much entirely responsible for the dark ages. Witch trails? Flat earth?
Things like the printing press and other inventions and scientific discoveries eventually moved us past that even with the powers that be trying to prevent it.
I think you are the one being dishonest with yourself. Lose the dogma.
The idea that a proper moral center can ONLY come from god is so utterly ridiculous its laughable.
God wrote the moral law on our heart, that's in the Bible.
AGAIN I ASK: where do YOU derive your morality from? Do others have to share your morality? No? So then what is wrong with a man raping a child? To him, that is morally fine. To you, you don't think so. Oh well! No universal standard by which to judge others!
"You shouldn't rape"
Why?
"Because you are taking something from that person"
Who says that is wrong?
"Uh uh...I do?"
Try that in the hood. I fucking DARE you.
Where do YOU derive your morality from? And if I don't, why should you decide for me? You aren't God.
Group morality generally comes from some form of physical punishment or social punishment. If I rape a woman the police will arrest me. Those police don't arrest me because they feel like it or because they individually are judging me. They arrest me because a law was made. Because everyone agreed rape is a bad thing.
You seem to constantly miss my point. You accuse me of deriving my morality from myself like that is a bad thing. EVERYONE DOES THAT! Just because they might or might not use the bible as a frame of reference does not remove the personal responsibility of the individual from the equation. I don't decide for you. You decide for yourself. YOU KNOW there are consequences to things like left or rape. Yes, a community as a whole often decides those consequences but in the end you choose what you do.
The entire problem with the hood right now is no one takes responsibility for what they do. More importantly no one around them holds them responsible. All socially enforced morality is gone. Thus they devolve into might makes right. Those are Christians. You seem to think this sort of thing only happens to non-Christians. Only atheists can devolve into might makes right chaos. Yet I could site a dozen examples of Christians doing exactly that. A strong moral center doesn't come only from the bible. It comes from people being taught how to be moral from an early age, having good role models, and having strong bonds with those are you etc.
The bible is just a book written by men. Its nothing special. There is no god.
It's a combination of both. Let's not mence words. MANY religious people don't get their moral code from the Bible or what a priest says. A lot of it comes from social pressures and community norms. That's exactly why you have inner city gang bangers who murder people on Saturday and go to church on Sunday. They believe in god they just choose to ignore the parts that aren't convenient to their chosen way to make money.
EVERYONE chooses their own path. If you think otherwise you're a fool. I am a more moral person that 90% of the "Christians" I've met in my life. I don't steal. I don't do drugs. I help people when I can, etc etc. There are a few things the bible says I shouldn't do that I don't believe in because the truth is they hurt no one so I ignore those rules. IE the ban on premarital sex. I don't even believe in marriage. Why? Because its based entirely on social norms created by religion. Why should I hold myself to rules and norms created by a false god? That isn't a moral issue anyway. Its a religion issue.
But yes many things come from what the majority agrees on. IE not having sex with anyone under 18. Don't get me wrong I'm no pedo, but up until around 100 to 150 years ago it was the norm for woman the get married and have kids at 15 or 16. The idea we have to wait for some arbitrary age defined by puritanical minded Christians is just silly. Its has little to nothing to do with a moral code and everything to do with an arbitrary rule.
That said I want to be clear... people who seek out prepubescent children or people who abuse their authority, entrap or enslave weak defenseless young people, etc... those people should be dealt with harshly. However, should a man over 18 be lucky enough to meet some 16 year old that was actually mature enough and wanted a relationship with them the arbitrary rules we put in place make that crime. They literally criminalize love. Talk about immoral. Although recently many states have made Romeo and Juliet laws to fix exactly this problem. However, they put age caps on it which is yet again arbitrary. They act like a 30 year old can't actually fall in love with a 17 year old and vice versa. Like its is completely impossible.
People like Epstein should be crushed because they are just abusing young women. However, the way they leave no room for the possibility of a real bond is in itself criminal if you asked me. And no I'm not talking about those retards in NAMBLA who want to be with 10 year olds. Fuck those retards. Or the idiots trolling for 13-14 years olds on the internet.
I hold myself to the given laws of a particular state because that is the sane thing to do and I have some self control. Its one of my biggest points about Epstein. That idiot had hundreds of millions of dollars. He could have setup shop in any state. MANY states have an age of consent that is 17 or even 16.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of_consent_in_the_United_States
All that idiot had to do is buy a mansion on the GA coast and he could round up, abuse, and pay all the 16+ year old girls he liked. It wouldn't have been illegal. It was never about that though. He could have just as easily made a point of being with 18 year olds in FL. No the whole point was he felt he was above the law. He felt like he could do anything he wanted to anyone he wanted and no one could stop him. Is what he did moral? I'd say no, mainly because of his intent which was to use and abuse them.
There is a reason they have whole classes devoted to morality etc. Truth is we could never discus it all here. There is one other truth though... most of those classes have been perverted by Marxists to the point were the class itself is immoral. They now teach people to be evil. That's the root of many of our problems today. We allow these lunatics to teach our children and just hope they don't corrupt them.
Right.
That's how Nazis and Communism happen.
So go ahead and say it:
"I come up with my own morality"
Which does nothing for the world because that still leads to MIGHT OVER RIGHT.
Biblical morality, the 10 Commandments, lead to RIGHTS over might.
Don't be intellectually dishonest with yourself.
The idea that a proper moral center can ONLY come from god is so utterly ridiculous its laughable. Fact of the matter is for decades there were atheists that went all in on "secular humanism". It was peace at all costs. Which is actually why we are in the mess we are in. Tons of people in Europe went down that road. Some consider that to be a more moral path than Christianity.
Nothing has to lead to might over right. You've missed the whole point of morality if you believe that is the only other path to follow. Let's face facts Christians spent hundreds of years murdering innocent people in the name of god. They repressed science and are pretty much entirely responsible for the dark ages. Witch trails? Flat earth?
Things like the printing press and other inventions and scientific discoveries eventually moved us past that even with the powers that be trying to prevent it.
I think you are the one being dishonest with yourself. Lose the dogma.
Whatever you say, Satan.
LOL! You do understand for this to be an insult... for me to care I have to believe in satan, which I don't. SMH... some people just don't get it.
God wrote the moral law on our heart, that's in the Bible.
AGAIN I ASK: where do YOU derive your morality from? Do others have to share your morality? No? So then what is wrong with a man raping a child? To him, that is morally fine. To you, you don't think so. Oh well! No universal standard by which to judge others!
"You shouldn't rape"
Why?
"Because you are taking something from that person"
Who says that is wrong?
"Uh uh...I do?"
Try that in the hood. I fucking DARE you.
Where do YOU derive your morality from? And if I don't, why should you decide for me? You aren't God.
Group morality generally comes from some form of physical punishment or social punishment. If I rape a woman the police will arrest me. Those police don't arrest me because they feel like it or because they individually are judging me. They arrest me because a law was made. Because everyone agreed rape is a bad thing.
You seem to constantly miss my point. You accuse me of deriving my morality from myself like that is a bad thing. EVERYONE DOES THAT! Just because they might or might not use the bible as a frame of reference does not remove the personal responsibility of the individual from the equation. I don't decide for you. You decide for yourself. YOU KNOW there are consequences to things like left or rape. Yes, a community as a whole often decides those consequences but in the end you choose what you do.
The entire problem with the hood right now is no one takes responsibility for what they do. More importantly no one around them holds them responsible. All socially enforced morality is gone. Thus they devolve into might makes right. Those are Christians. You seem to think this sort of thing only happens to non-Christians. Only atheists can devolve into might makes right chaos. Yet I could site a dozen examples of Christians doing exactly that. A strong moral center doesn't come only from the bible. It comes from people being taught how to be moral from an early age, having good role models, and having strong bonds with those are you etc.
The bible is just a book written by men. Its nothing special. There is no god.