Hello all if anyone is good with logical thinking and great with math and science I need your help. I have an idea that deals with electrolysis, steam, turbines, and other crap that I need to get out of my head for some reason my brain thinks it possible. Please dm me so we make my brain STFU! Also, nothing illegal.
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Ask away,a lot of us,may know different parts.....
Copied for your pleasure:)
Okay, let's go over my assumptions.
Electrolysis makes hho, hho expansion from water is ~1800x. So 10 gallons would be 18k liters of gas. This unburnt hho is basically a cold unburnt steam. Once burnt another expansion (don't know amount) will occur as the particles heat up.
Correct or incorrect so far?
Incorrect.
Electrolysis of water converts H20 into H2 gas and O2 gas. It does not make steam. Steam is simply an H20 molecule in the hot gas phase. The equation is 2 H2O + energy -> 2 H2 + O2.
HHO is just another way of writing H2O.
When you put the generated hydrogen gas (H2) and oxygen (O2) together in a reaction vessel and give it an ignition source, such as an electric spark or flame, you will get a big reaction that converts 2 H2 + O2 -> 2 H20 + all the energy you put in during the electrolysis phase. That will be steam and it will expand outward to fill the volume according to the ideal gas law PV = nRT. (n is the number of moles of gas, which is constant for a specific volume of water converted by electrolysis, and R is the ideal gas constant.) The dependent variables are pressure, volume and temperature. Given any 2 you can calculate the third.
In the end, if you collect all the steam and let it cool back down to room temperature, it will condense back into the original amount of liquid water, and all the energy you put during the electrolysis phase will be left as waste heat.
You can not beat the laws of thermodynamics. There is no such thing as perpetual motion.
Karpens Pile.
http://blog.hasslberger.com/2011/01/karpens_pile_producing_energy-print.html
Looks correct. Did you have a question though?
Working on it.
If my last thought was correct what happens if I burn the hho in a sealed tube and turn it into superheated steam and run a generator, not indirect heating as they boil water now but the flame directly in a steel tube. Would the flame stay lit or would the steam pressure blow the hho back to the generator.
It would be hot as hell. Like a torch if you could light it. Also you cannot create energy. You would use more in the electrolysis process etc. then you would create in the end. Laws of thermodynamics. I'm just a noob at chemistry though.
Ya ya laws pft, ok here's more fun. What if I floated the hho through a water filled pipe to the top of a mountain where I run it through a turbine and then condensed it to water and have all that potential energy just waiting? My brain thinks I could "beat" the law with free work done by floating a bubble to the top of a mountain. And here is where I need proven wrong.
I think the problem with that is you need to move the water into place beforehand. That will require energy. When you float any bubbles upwards then you will lose some of that potential energy because there was a bubble at the bottom and now there is water so that piece of potential energy is lost.
You will also need to force the bubble into the water somehow. More energy required.
Yes the water would be placed beforehand. Which you will use energy.
I'm confused how energy is lost can you eli5 that part? When creating hho I could set a passive pressure release valve into the pipe where it takes no more energy to force the hho bubbles into the elevation pipe. In the elevation pipe yes water will move around but I have no work involved other then setup to get the bubble to the top. I guess the inlet would have to be greater then all the water pressure in the elevation pipe, should be possible but very dangerous to have hho at a high pressure.
Your key would be to burn the HHO in a piston type setup, but inject steam right after detonation.
This creates superheated steam, using the HHO to hit the superheated stage. This way you can use the expansion hydraulics of water with lesser caloric requirements for the burn.
Hope that makes sense
Piston engines are horrible at energy efficiency.
Sounds pretty much how a steam turbine works.
You could drive a generator or direct drive something else. I think all this research was done 100 + years ago.
Okay, let's go over my assumptions.
Electrolysis makes hho, hho expansion from water is ~1800x. So 10 gallons would be 18k liters of gas. This unburnt hho is basically a cold unburnt steam. Once burnt another expansion (don't know amount) will occur as the particles heat up.
Correct or incorrect so far?
Also what happened to direct message on here...
Sir this is a Wendy's.
Funny shit right there