I have heard that Zionist stooges = Jesuit stooges.. need to do some digging
btw, I made it through Ignatius' letters and was a bit amused. He keeps calling himself a newfag! kek
I didn't see anything in there which rationalizes the point we were debating last month, he just made the statements and continued onto other things (unless I missed something).
Where should I go next? Are there any writings which outline the reasoning behind the doctrine? I'd like to see how they get there if possible!
“We will prove that we worship him reasonably; for we have learned that he is the Son of the true God himself, that he holds a second place, and the Spirit of prophecy a third. For this they accuse us of madness, saying that we attribute to a crucified man a place second to the unchangeable and eternal God, the Creator of all things; but they are ignorant of the mystery which lies therein” (First Apology 13:5–6 [A.D. 151])
"Therefore the Father is Lord, and the Son is Lord, and the Father is God, and the Son is God; for He who is born of God is God."
I'd say they inheret God's nature here, as I will once again reference the very simple concept of a father having a son does not make them the same as one another, but "like father like son" applies instead. Also the authority the Father passed onto the Son after He obeyed Him fully
"We, however, as we indeed always have done... believe that there is one only God, but under the following dispensation, or as it is called, economy; that this one only God has also a Son, His Word, who proceeded from Himself, by whom all things were made and without whom nothing was made. Him we believe to have been sent by the Father into the virgin, and to have been born of her—being both man and God, the Son of man and the Son of God... We believe also in the Holy Spirit, who has been sent by Christ from the Father as the Sanctifier and Comforter, as the Teacher of the truth... who proceeds from the Father and the Son."
I agree with these 3 parts more or less. I don't really think we're at odds, perhaps only in dogmatic termonology. I would be interested in walking through the scriptures though, and yes I think I follow 'solo scriptora'. Basically what's in the scriptures is placed higher than what people say about them. The hashing out of what they mean is part of the journey on earth for a believer imo.
I might be mistaken but I thought your position was that God the Father is the only God and that Christ is a created being and not God. Unitarian vs Trinitarian.
Yes wrong, I believe Jesus is God's son not a creation. (He also is, in effect and essence, equal with God since He obeyed God 100%, though He isn't the same being as God.) Carnal example: did a father create his son or beget him. It is a mystery. Mankind was created, God breathed into him making him His son, he listened to satan ate the fruit and died and became satan's son, now through Christ he dies and becomes God's son again but this time is sealed by the Holy Ghost never to die again. It's quite a mystery but maybe rather it's just hard to explain in words. It makes sense to me though
It just hit me that maybe the word 'persons' is the confusing bit about the trinity doctrine. What if that was swapped with 'beings'? This would also lead me to a binitarian view if that's even a word, since I view the Holy Ghost as an extremity / extension of God the Father and not a separate being. I'm sure this will cause a whole new debate lol.
edit-
Christ promised us a Church, not a Bible. Though Scripture is of utmost important, the Church is what Christ promised.
I thought He promised us salvation and eternal life. He really just said "on this rock I will build my church" which is a statement of fact wrapped in a metaphor which I think needs further digging into also. And it seems I really need that St. Basil huh. Man I have so much to do kek
I have heard that Zionist stooges = Jesuit stooges.. need to do some digging
btw, I made it through Ignatius' letters and was a bit amused. He keeps calling himself a newfag! kek
I didn't see anything in there which rationalizes the point we were debating last month, he just made the statements and continued onto other things (unless I missed something).
Where should I go next? Are there any writings which outline the reasoning behind the doctrine? I'd like to see how they get there if possible!
I'd say they inheret God's nature here, as I will once again reference the very simple concept of a father having a son does not make them the same as one another, but "like father like son" applies instead. Also the authority the Father passed onto the Son after He obeyed Him fully
I agree with these 3 parts more or less. I don't really think we're at odds, perhaps only in dogmatic termonology. I would be interested in walking through the scriptures though, and yes I think I follow 'solo scriptora'. Basically what's in the scriptures is placed higher than what people say about them. The hashing out of what they mean is part of the journey on earth for a believer imo.
I'll have to look into this sola scriptura thing.
Yes wrong, I believe Jesus is God's son not a creation. (He also is, in effect and essence, equal with God since He obeyed God 100%, though He isn't the same being as God.) Carnal example: did a father create his son or beget him. It is a mystery. Mankind was created, God breathed into him making him His son, he listened to satan ate the fruit and died and became satan's son, now through Christ he dies and becomes God's son again but this time is sealed by the Holy Ghost never to die again. It's quite a mystery but maybe rather it's just hard to explain in words. It makes sense to me though
It just hit me that maybe the word 'persons' is the confusing bit about the trinity doctrine. What if that was swapped with 'beings'? This would also lead me to a binitarian view if that's even a word, since I view the Holy Ghost as an extremity / extension of God the Father and not a separate being. I'm sure this will cause a whole new debate lol.
edit-
I thought He promised us salvation and eternal life. He really just said "on this rock I will build my church" which is a statement of fact wrapped in a metaphor which I think needs further digging into also. And it seems I really need that St. Basil huh. Man I have so much to do kek
I'll have to get back to ya!