Most people will say they think they're a good person, but this movie is God treating Jesus as if He was any of us. The scariest thing in the world for sinners is that God is good and just.
The Bible says there is none who seeks after Him and none who does good, yet God subjected his own Son to this for us, knowing that almost everyone would reject the free gift. It's a love we can't empathize with, a love that exceeds our capacity. I can't imagine even an eternity will be enough to fully comprehend it.
I know this sounds... Weird, but I truly think Passion is going to be a rare Date Night movie soon for me and the Missus. Both never seen it, both probably perfectly aligned for a viewing.
This is false and implies God and Christ are two different people. God is Christ and Christ is God, God can not treat Himself different. God did humble Himself in taking on our humanity. This was sin and God conquered death, it was simply humans doing human things because their humanity was tainted by sin.
Yes, they're the same in the sense that we have three parts: soul, body, and spirit. God does too: Soul(Father), body(Jesus), and spirit(Holy Spirit).
What we suffer in our lives is the wrath of man and the wrath of Satan, permitted by God. What Jesus suffered on the cross was the wrath of God through the hands of men. Therefore, Jesus takes all of God's wrath, paying the whole price. If we suffered any it'd be an incomplete gift/justification.
God isn't treating himself inconsistently, as His wrath is because of us, not Jesus. Jesus chooses to take the cup of wrath in the garden as our last Adam, a kinsman redeemer as in Ruth. It is God's righteousness given to us through Jesus Christ.
This premise shouldn't be awkward, as God's Words are given to us through the words and writings of men via the Holy Spirit, so His wrath can come through men as well and be paid by His body via Jesus Christ. Also, Jesus and the Father did interact as separate entities while still both being God. Jesus prayed, did His Father's will, resisted temptation using scripture, etc.
No! This theology is wrong! Christ didn't suffer the "wrath" of God. Also the Trinity isn't "body soul spirit" it is just the Trinity we can not grasp the understanding of the Trinity it just is. God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit.
This theology is very Roman Catholic, so I am going to assume you are Roman Catholic, it is teaching the satisfaction theory of atonement. When in reality this isn't what happened. Christ lived a perfect life as a man and as such He was the only one who could overcome Death (death was the punishment given to us in the Garden) Christ did what we couldn't, there is no "pouring out of wrath" by the Father.
Also, I have never heard of this ridiculous notion of the "wrath of man and wrath of Satan" no we suffer a fallen nature because of what happened in the Garden when Eve and Adam sinned. While we are a fallen nature we have the free will to choose not to sin, we always have a choice to avoid temptations. And there is no wrath of Satan anything Satan does is allowed by God.
I am not Roman Catholic. What are Christians "saved" from? We're saved from the power of sin now, the penalty of sin at judgment, and the presence of sin in eternity.
We're saved from Hell. God's judgment. God's wrath. Jesus suffering from our wrath accomplishes nothing - our wrath is corrupt and full of sin and doesn't necessitate fulfilling. God's wrath is pure and righteous, however, and it must be paid for God to be just. Thankfully, He is merciful and provided One who could pay an eternal sin debt in an afternoon so we don't have to spend an eternity burning trying to satisfy God's wrath towards us.
I disagree with you on most of these other topics as well, but the gospel message is really all that's worth debating at this point. I think we've both presented our beliefs and I'll leave it at that.
Jesus is the word made flesh, the word that made everything comes from God. Jesus is the son and the word, the word and the son that God made.
I cannot get my head around what God did for us, his children. The love he has for us is beyond comprehension, to give up his son who is the word to give us eternal life? It passeth all understanding.
God did not "make" the Son, the Son and the Father are both God the Son and the Father have both existed always and will always exist They have no beginning and no end They just are. "I am that I am"
From the Heavenly Father, his first born Son, Jehovah>Jesus Christ. The God that inspired the Prophets fulfilled their prophecies at Gethsemane and Golgotha and indeed did make ALL things new.
Most people will say they think they're a good person, but this movie is God treating Jesus as if He was any of us. The scariest thing in the world for sinners is that God is good and just.
The Bible says there is none who seeks after Him and none who does good, yet God subjected his own Son to this for us, knowing that almost everyone would reject the free gift. It's a love we can't empathize with, a love that exceeds our capacity. I can't imagine even an eternity will be enough to fully comprehend it.
Very Graceful words, pede. Thanks.
I know this sounds... Weird, but I truly think Passion is going to be a rare Date Night movie soon for me and the Missus. Both never seen it, both probably perfectly aligned for a viewing.
I watched it with mine. it will bring you closer together through Christ.
Not weird at all. It humbles the heart, and humble hearts are a good thing in relationships. I hope it's a blessing for both of you.
This is false and implies God and Christ are two different people. God is Christ and Christ is God, God can not treat Himself different. God did humble Himself in taking on our humanity. This was sin and God conquered death, it was simply humans doing human things because their humanity was tainted by sin.
Yes, they're the same in the sense that we have three parts: soul, body, and spirit. God does too: Soul(Father), body(Jesus), and spirit(Holy Spirit).
What we suffer in our lives is the wrath of man and the wrath of Satan, permitted by God. What Jesus suffered on the cross was the wrath of God through the hands of men. Therefore, Jesus takes all of God's wrath, paying the whole price. If we suffered any it'd be an incomplete gift/justification.
God isn't treating himself inconsistently, as His wrath is because of us, not Jesus. Jesus chooses to take the cup of wrath in the garden as our last Adam, a kinsman redeemer as in Ruth. It is God's righteousness given to us through Jesus Christ.
This premise shouldn't be awkward, as God's Words are given to us through the words and writings of men via the Holy Spirit, so His wrath can come through men as well and be paid by His body via Jesus Christ. Also, Jesus and the Father did interact as separate entities while still both being God. Jesus prayed, did His Father's will, resisted temptation using scripture, etc.
No! This theology is wrong! Christ didn't suffer the "wrath" of God. Also the Trinity isn't "body soul spirit" it is just the Trinity we can not grasp the understanding of the Trinity it just is. God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit.
This theology is very Roman Catholic, so I am going to assume you are Roman Catholic, it is teaching the satisfaction theory of atonement. When in reality this isn't what happened. Christ lived a perfect life as a man and as such He was the only one who could overcome Death (death was the punishment given to us in the Garden) Christ did what we couldn't, there is no "pouring out of wrath" by the Father.
Also, I have never heard of this ridiculous notion of the "wrath of man and wrath of Satan" no we suffer a fallen nature because of what happened in the Garden when Eve and Adam sinned. While we are a fallen nature we have the free will to choose not to sin, we always have a choice to avoid temptations. And there is no wrath of Satan anything Satan does is allowed by God.
Weird, you'd think by now everyone would interpret the Bible the exact same way ;)
I am not Roman Catholic. What are Christians "saved" from? We're saved from the power of sin now, the penalty of sin at judgment, and the presence of sin in eternity.
We're saved from Hell. God's judgment. God's wrath. Jesus suffering from our wrath accomplishes nothing - our wrath is corrupt and full of sin and doesn't necessitate fulfilling. God's wrath is pure and righteous, however, and it must be paid for God to be just. Thankfully, He is merciful and provided One who could pay an eternal sin debt in an afternoon so we don't have to spend an eternity burning trying to satisfy God's wrath towards us.
I disagree with you on most of these other topics as well, but the gospel message is really all that's worth debating at this point. I think we've both presented our beliefs and I'll leave it at that.
I read a really great book recently.
Michael Reeves Delighting in the Trinity: An Introduction to the Christian Faith
Short, lively, and very enjoyable that will teach you things about the Trinity you never knew were so wonderful! I highly recommend.
Jesus is the word made flesh, the word that made everything comes from God. Jesus is the son and the word, the word and the son that God made.
I cannot get my head around what God did for us, his children. The love he has for us is beyond comprehension, to give up his son who is the word to give us eternal life? It passeth all understanding.
God did not "make" the Son, the Son and the Father are both God the Son and the Father have both existed always and will always exist They have no beginning and no end They just are. "I am that I am"
And the word?
From the Heavenly Father, his first born Son, Jehovah>Jesus Christ. The God that inspired the Prophets fulfilled their prophecies at Gethsemane and Golgotha and indeed did make ALL things new.