"There is a word used in religion: "FAITH". All religions of Abrahamn are FAITH based."
I understand you want this word to mean "blind" faith, but it is anything but. Biblical faith is a trust or belief based UPON the evidence - not in spite of it. This definition of faith is hammered out very clearly within the scriptures.
I, too, have degrees in Philosophy and Religious studies, and came to the conclusion that Orthodox Christianity corresponds to the nature of Reality better than any other world religion out there. Now what?
"No one can prove the existence of any deity from any religious book is actually related to God."
This statement is patently false. One can ascertain certain qualities regarding the nature of the Cause of the universe by simply studying the nature of the universe itself - without even breaching the Bible once.
Here's a quick example:
Space, Time, Matter and Energy are all related - IOW, you can't have one without the other (Einstein proved this).
STME all came into existence at a finite point in the past (Modern cosmology proves this - the universe is not Eternal)
Whatever comes into existence must have a cause. The STME universe came into existence.
Therefore, the STME universe has a cause. And, by definition, that cause must be outside of Space, outside of Time (i.e Eternal), outside of Matter (i.e immaterial), and EXTREMELY powerful in order to bring all the energy in the universe into existence. One could argue at this point that the cause must be extremely intelligent as well, given the highly complex nature of the universe.
At this point we are getting pretty damn close to the Judeo-Christian description of "God."
Is this a mathematical proof? No. But mathematical proof is not required in almost every other aspect of life either. This is, however, a good argument with strong scientific/philosophical underpinnings. One can take this argument further to show that this cause must be the Judeo-Christian God (i.e Personal), but we can hold off at this point here for simplicity's sake.
Dont forget, too, that the overwhelming majority of the scientists who layed down the foundation for scientific inquiry during the Scientific Revolution were Bible believing Christians who believed that "doing science" was simply thinking God's thoughts after Him. This core belief is was the motivating/driving factor behind their magnificent leaps in understanding the universe we live in.
"Did you know Schopenhauer and Hegel extensively borrowed from Eastern mysticism to build up Western philosophy?"
Yup. Sure did. And the word "extensively" is debatable.
"Really? That sounds like the description of every God. Outside of the Universe and in absolute control of it. yawn all you've proved is there is a First Cause, a Prime Mover."
The Cosmological Argument actually goes beyond the concepts of Prime Mover and First Cause. This is why Aquinas took Aristotle and baptized him.
You keep using the word "prove." But I think you need to define what you mean by that word. That word can be very slippery in discussions like this and gets equivocated on quite a bit. If you wish to continue this discussion, then please define what kind of "proof" you are referring to.
"Because they were born in Christian societies."
I was born into a society that taught me certain mathematical truths. That doesn't mean that what I was taught is false. Your argument fails to demonstrate what you are implying.
Good point. Yet I get 3 day bans if I dare question beliefs in here. Food for thought.
Also, what the hell is 'forum sliding'? They tacked that on to my list of charges that 'justified' my 3 days of no free speech, and I have no idea wtf it is, so I cannot stop doing what I don't know I'm even doing.
The mods over at P-win do that. Happened to me way back and still not sure what I did (either). Not seen that here, but like Kautilya said only doomers/shills & glowies get banned here.
Sure, I searched forum sliding, but it didn't make sense. I'm a little slow at times.
Now, interesting definition of free speech. I see lots of people crying about Facebook, etc. banning them as 'taking away their free speech' and more people agreeing with them that it is a violation. Is it only when you like the content that free speech is violated? Help me out here.
"There is a word used in religion: "FAITH". All religions of Abrahamn are FAITH based."
I understand you want this word to mean "blind" faith, but it is anything but. Biblical faith is a trust or belief based UPON the evidence - not in spite of it. This definition of faith is hammered out very clearly within the scriptures.
I, too, have degrees in Philosophy and Religious studies, and came to the conclusion that Orthodox Christianity corresponds to the nature of Reality better than any other world religion out there. Now what?
"No one can prove the existence of any deity from any religious book is actually related to God."
This statement is patently false. One can ascertain certain qualities regarding the nature of the Cause of the universe by simply studying the nature of the universe itself - without even breaching the Bible once.
Here's a quick example:
Space, Time, Matter and Energy are all related - IOW, you can't have one without the other (Einstein proved this).
STME all came into existence at a finite point in the past (Modern cosmology proves this - the universe is not Eternal)
Whatever comes into existence must have a cause. The STME universe came into existence.
Therefore, the STME universe has a cause. And, by definition, that cause must be outside of Space, outside of Time (i.e Eternal), outside of Matter (i.e immaterial), and EXTREMELY powerful in order to bring all the energy in the universe into existence. One could argue at this point that the cause must be extremely intelligent as well, given the highly complex nature of the universe.
At this point we are getting pretty damn close to the Judeo-Christian description of "God."
Is this a mathematical proof? No. But mathematical proof is not required in almost every other aspect of life either. This is, however, a good argument with strong scientific/philosophical underpinnings. One can take this argument further to show that this cause must be the Judeo-Christian God (i.e Personal), but we can hold off at this point here for simplicity's sake.
Dont forget, too, that the overwhelming majority of the scientists who layed down the foundation for scientific inquiry during the Scientific Revolution were Bible believing Christians who believed that "doing science" was simply thinking God's thoughts after Him. This core belief is was the motivating/driving factor behind their magnificent leaps in understanding the universe we live in.
I digress....
"Did you know Schopenhauer and Hegel extensively borrowed from Eastern mysticism to build up Western philosophy?"
Yup. Sure did. And the word "extensively" is debatable.
"Really? That sounds like the description of every God. Outside of the Universe and in absolute control of it. yawn all you've proved is there is a First Cause, a Prime Mover."
The Cosmological Argument actually goes beyond the concepts of Prime Mover and First Cause. This is why Aquinas took Aristotle and baptized him.
You keep using the word "prove." But I think you need to define what you mean by that word. That word can be very slippery in discussions like this and gets equivocated on quite a bit. If you wish to continue this discussion, then please define what kind of "proof" you are referring to.
"Because they were born in Christian societies."
I was born into a society that taught me certain mathematical truths. That doesn't mean that what I was taught is false. Your argument fails to demonstrate what you are implying.
Good point. Yet I get 3 day bans if I dare question beliefs in here. Food for thought.
Also, what the hell is 'forum sliding'? They tacked that on to my list of charges that 'justified' my 3 days of no free speech, and I have no idea wtf it is, so I cannot stop doing what I don't know I'm even doing.
But I've never created a thread? I just reply to ones that already exist, and just pick the ones at the top of the 'new' list.
The mods over at P-win do that. Happened to me way back and still not sure what I did (either). Not seen that here, but like Kautilya said only doomers/shills & glowies get banned here.
Yes but you still had free speech for those 3 days, just not posting privileges on a single website out of billions on the internet.
And did you try entering 'forum sliding' into any search engine?
Sure, I searched forum sliding, but it didn't make sense. I'm a little slow at times.
Now, interesting definition of free speech. I see lots of people crying about Facebook, etc. banning them as 'taking away their free speech' and more people agreeing with them that it is a violation. Is it only when you like the content that free speech is violated? Help me out here.