I would argue you do NOT need an engineering degree to be an engineer. You spend so much time in classes like advanced math, learning about other disciplines you don't care about, and of course all the fluff of a "rounded university education."
My view is there should be a 2-year fundamentals covering the basics, including some math theory but not sorting through ridiculous equations/calc/etc - computers for that, but need to know what you're calculating at least type of thing, then apprenticeship type deal in discipline you want to work in actually on the job.
Edit: I realize I'm not really answering the comment but off on a tangent. Yes, from a "worthwhile you'll probably have a job" standpoint they are worth getting vs most that are truly worthless.
Depends on the type of engineering you want to do. You need way more than basic math to do, for instance, the aerospace type engineering, or electrical engineering.
Maybe. I still say engineering degrees are vastly bloated things where you learn a ton about stuff you don't need to know about. E.g. you don't really need a chemistry class to get that corrosion is basically dissimilar metals plus an electrolyte. Who cares about the exact reactions and solving them and stuff type of thing. I still say a couple years of the fundamentals then specialize on the job is still best.
Edit - something like basic concepts/terminology (things like what "stress" "current" etc mean), basic classes in each area (circuits, statics/dynamics, materials, manufacturing processes), enough math to get what math needs done... Don't waste time with classes like diff EQ where you just solve hardass equations, who cares. Example: 2 weeks of thermo is enough to understand what you need to know about it for most things without learning every damn possible cycle and doing all kinds of complicated crap that you'll probably never use let alone remember.
Engineering education should focus on learning how things work generally and how to learn more/research/etc, not having you come out as some kind of generalist who could do almost anything in it but after your first job you simply most likely won't.
The Degree is a certificate that states you passed a baseline knowledge bar in Engineering. That’s it.
It’s really just Step 0 in your path towards a profession in Engineering.
Are there better ways to learn the fundamentals? Yes.
Any kid with willpower will find a way to learn all this stuff, and seek teachers/mentors, etc.
All the best students I was surrounded by were already freakin smart before they walked into class. They already knew the material, had a grasps of the concepts and were just there to get the ‘paper’ so they can move on.
Yep, rankles me to no end you need the paper that in some ways means over-trained, in others irrelevantly-trained, in others programmed/brainwashed (just being on a campus for 4 years these days has much implicit this as well) etc.
So what do you do when the computers are down and you have to do calculations manually? That is the stupidity that dumbs us all down.......relying on computers rather than your brain.
I would argue you do NOT need an engineering degree to be an engineer. You spend so much time in classes like advanced math, learning about other disciplines you don't care about, and of course all the fluff of a "rounded university education."
My view is there should be a 2-year fundamentals covering the basics, including some math theory but not sorting through ridiculous equations/calc/etc - computers for that, but need to know what you're calculating at least type of thing, then apprenticeship type deal in discipline you want to work in actually on the job.
Edit: I realize I'm not really answering the comment but off on a tangent. Yes, from a "worthwhile you'll probably have a job" standpoint they are worth getting vs most that are truly worthless.
Depends on the type of engineering you want to do. You need way more than basic math to do, for instance, the aerospace type engineering, or electrical engineering.
Maybe. I still say engineering degrees are vastly bloated things where you learn a ton about stuff you don't need to know about. E.g. you don't really need a chemistry class to get that corrosion is basically dissimilar metals plus an electrolyte. Who cares about the exact reactions and solving them and stuff type of thing. I still say a couple years of the fundamentals then specialize on the job is still best.
Edit - something like basic concepts/terminology (things like what "stress" "current" etc mean), basic classes in each area (circuits, statics/dynamics, materials, manufacturing processes), enough math to get what math needs done... Don't waste time with classes like diff EQ where you just solve hardass equations, who cares. Example: 2 weeks of thermo is enough to understand what you need to know about it for most things without learning every damn possible cycle and doing all kinds of complicated crap that you'll probably never use let alone remember.
Engineering education should focus on learning how things work generally and how to learn more/research/etc, not having you come out as some kind of generalist who could do almost anything in it but after your first job you simply most likely won't.
The Degree is a certificate that states you passed a baseline knowledge bar in Engineering. That’s it.
It’s really just Step 0 in your path towards a profession in Engineering.
Are there better ways to learn the fundamentals? Yes.
Any kid with willpower will find a way to learn all this stuff, and seek teachers/mentors, etc.
All the best students I was surrounded by were already freakin smart before they walked into class. They already knew the material, had a grasps of the concepts and were just there to get the ‘paper’ so they can move on.
Yep, rankles me to no end you need the paper that in some ways means over-trained, in others irrelevantly-trained, in others programmed/brainwashed (just being on a campus for 4 years these days has much implicit this as well) etc.
So what do you do when the computers are down and you have to do calculations manually? That is the stupidity that dumbs us all down.......relying on computers rather than your brain.
Horse shit