Welcome to General Chat - GAW Community Area
This General Chat area started off as a place for people to talk about things that are off topic, however it has quickly evolved into a community and has become an integral part of the GAW experience for many of us.
Based on its evolving needs and plenty of user feedback, we are trying to bring some order and institute some rules. Please make sure you read these rules and participate in the spirit of this community.
Rules for General Chat
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Be respectful to each other. This is of utmost importance, and comments may be removed if deemed not respectful.
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Avoid long drawn out arguments. This should be a place to relax, not to waste your time needlessly.
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Personal anecdotes, puzzles, cute pics/clips - everything welcome
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Please do not spam at the top level. If you have a lot to post each day, try and post them all together in one top level comment
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Try keep things light. If you are bringing in deep stuff, try not to go overboard.
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Things that are clearly on-topic for this board should be posted as a separate post and not here (except if you are new and still getting the feel of this place)
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If you find people violating these rules, deport them rather than start a argument here.
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Feel free to give feedback as these rules are expected to keep evoloving
In short, imagine this thread to be a local community hall where we all gather and chat daily. Please be respectful to others in the same way
Ooooh, that's a big question. One that I will answer with a few prefaces:
one, like all things in the universe, human beings are created with the dual characteristics of [invisible internal character] + [external visible form]. At some point in the past, humanity fell into a state of 'corruption' and ignorance (described in many scriptures/faith traditions, such as the story of Adam and Eve). Historically, the re-discovery of truth (knowledge) as the antidote to ignorance has progressed along two distinct paths - an internal (invisible) path and an external (visible) path. These are 'religion' which has been the path to re-cover the truth about our invisible internal nature (aka 'spirit') the 'world' it inhabits (the spiritual world) and 'science' which has been the path to re-cover the truth about our visible external form (aka 'body') and the world our body inhabits, aka the material universe.
Thus, one result of the 'fall' of 'Adam and Eve' was a fall into ignorance about reality (internal and external) but another result was a rift or separation created between our spirit and our flesh. Example, almost all humans desire to be better people, but to act out our lives and live as our hearts aspire to is virtually impossible. We have lived in this dysfunctional state where the inner heart of goodness has been unable to live and act out a life of pure goodness through the outer body.
Just as our spirit and flesh are destined to be re-united and the blockage between them removed aka 'sin' (this is the ultimate goal of all God-inspired faiths), our perception of internal truth recovered via religion is destined to be re-united with our perception of external truth recovered via science.
In other words, the two themes pursued by religion on the one hand and science on the other are destined to be unified. We will come to understand 'spiritual' questions etc, to a highly developed level that is logical, rational, and 'scientific', while our understanding of 'material' questions re: the nature of the material universe will interface with the miracle that is God and the spirit world.
Example: We are close to this point on one hand, with science having reached the point where we now understand that the entire material world is in fact energy, and that this energy functions according to certain rules. What we still do not grasp clearly is how our consciousness interacts with and influences that energy.
In the realm of spirit, however, for the most part, we are still working with very old information. Christianity, which developed as an expression of the message of Jesus Christ, is essentially a 2000 year old message delivered by Jesus at a level that the people of his time could grasp. So today, while the gospel has always been incredibly ground-breaking, there are myriad questions about spiritual reality that simply have not been answered, and many aspects of theology that developed based on what Jesus shared 2000 years ago are quite illogical, and incompatible with a modern, logical way of thinking.
Which leads me to my second preface, quoting St Paul.
What's Paul actually saying here. he is explaining that NOW we (talking about the faithful at that time) see only a dim reflection of reality, but at some future point 'we' will see clearly, like face to face. Now, he only knows "in part" but at some future point aka 'then', he will know fully, even as he IS KNOWN.
This is one of the most powerful scriptures. Who is Paul 'known' by? He is known by God and Jesus. He is essentially telling believers that what they understand via the gospel of Jesus is only a partial aspect of the truth and that at some future point, there must be, there will be, an upgrade into greater comprehension of the 'truth'. Just as Jesus did not contradict the Law of Moses, that upgrade will not contradict what Jesus taught us 2000 years ago, but rather, augment it and raise our understanding to a whole new level.
With all due respect to my fellow believers, the truth is that most Christians think they understand the whole picture, and never really reflect on what Paul is saying here. What Paul is saying is actually borne out by Jesus words himself: "If I have told you about earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you about heavenly things?" Also "I still have many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now". etc.
Those are two long prefaces, but I think they are important for giving context to my answer to your (great) question. To be continued.....