It should have been made clear BEFORE Harris was allowed to assume the VP title that a person must have at least one US citizen parent at the time of birth just to be a US citizen at all, never mind the question of natural born.
But SCOTUS never clarifies the Constitution until something happens to make them do it.
The fact that nothing happened to challenge Harris's qualification at the time establishes that it's now accepted: being born on US soil is sufficient for a person to run for president or VP if they meet the age requirement, etc. That would now have to be reversed after her 4-year term. While highly unlikely, I would strongly favor that reversal; no one born of two foreigners should ever be president of the USA.
Law of Nations, 1758 law book defines "natural born citizen"
by Mountain Publius Goat on Fri Dec 12, 2008 1:43 am
Law of Nations, 1758 law book defines "natural born citizen"
Legal scholars and studiers of the founding of our country and the framers of our
Constitution reference this book as a core, contemporaneously written legal reference book, The Law of Nations, used by the framers of our Constitution. It was written in 1758 and was used as a college text book in America from c1770 on. Ben Franklin received three copies of the French edition from the editor Dumas in 1775 for use by
Franklin and the Continental Congress. It has a section #212, in Book 1 Chapter 19
thereof, which deals with defining "natural born" citizenship. Here is the link to the book
at Amazon. I just ordered mine.
http://www.amazon.com/LAW-NATIONS-Natural-Law-
Paper/dp/0865974519/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1229063894&sr=8-1
Quote of section 212, Chapter 19, Book 1, Law of Nations, by Vattel, written in 1758:
"§ 212 - Citizens and Natives. The citizens are the members of the civil society; bound to
this society by certain duties, and subject to its authority, they equally participate in its
advantages. The natives, or natural-born citizens, are those born in the country, of parents
who are citizens. As the society cannot exist and perpetuate itself otherwise than by the
children of the citizens, those children naturally follow the condition of their fathers, and
succeed to all their rights. The society is supposed to desire this, in consequence of what
it owes to its own preservation; and it is presumed, as matter of course, that each citizen,
on entering into society, reserves to his children the right of becoming members of it. The
country of the fathers is therefore that of the children; and these become true citizens
merely by their tacit consent. We shall soon see whether, on their coming to the years of
discretion, they may renounce their right, and what they owe to the society in which they
were born. I say, that, in order to be of the country, it is necessary that a person be born of
a father who is a citizen; for, if he is born there of a foreigner, it will be only the place of
his birth, and not his country. "
The Law of Nations, Vattel, 1758, Vol.1, Chapter 19, Section 212, as per the
original French edition
Vattel Section 212 in French edition. JPG (138.52 KB) Viewed 312 times
Section 212, Chapter 19, Book 1,The Law of Nations, Vattel, 1758, (1797 English
translation), defines the meaning of "natural born citizen".
Citizenship Terms used in U.S. Constitution
ConstitutionalCitizenshipTermsChart 1001x1107 JPG (183.6 KB) viewed 609
times
Note the emphasis where it says. "... natural born citizens, are those born in the country of
parents who are citizens." ... note it says parents, not parent. And later on the father's
citizenship too is mentioned as being crucial, not so much as the mother's. And the last
sentence, "I say, that, in order to be of the country, it is necessary that a person be born of
a father who is a citizen; for, if he is born there of a foreigner, it will be only the place of
his birth, and not his country." This contemporaneous legal reference and scholarly book
used as a college textbook in the 1700s is relevant to the thinking of our framers when
they wrote the U.S. Constitution. And this applies to Obama's case today in several ways.
I sure hope the Justices are reading this book lately when it comes to determine the
framer's intent for the meaning of "natural born citizen" in our Constitution. Certainly
with the facts as we know them about Obama, and common sense, and reading this quote
from the 250 year old book tells me that Obama is NOT a natural born citizen of the
USA. First, both his parents were not citizens of the USA, only one was. Second, the one
who was a citizen of the USA was not his father. Third, where Obama was actually born
has not been conclusively proven beyond any doubt.
Atty Apuzzo of NJ blog:
http://puzo1.blogspot.com/2009/03/natural-born-citizen-discussion-thread.html
Atty Taitz of CA blog:
http://drorly.blogspot.com/2008/12/law-of-nations-or-principles-of-law-of.html
Atty Donofrio of NJ blog:
http://naturalborncitizen.wordpress.com/2008/12/11/natural-born-citizen-defined-by-
14th-amendment-framers-and-in-treatise-relied-on-by-scalia/
Atty Berg of PA blog:
http://www.obamacrimes.com
(original link no longer active and has been taken over by some foreign entity)
http://www.obamacitizenshipfacts.info
(no longer active – see https://obamacitizenshipfacts.blogspot.com/2019/ )
Mountain Publius Goat
P.S. A simple, downloadable, printable chart defining the various types of citizenship
terms used in the U.S. Constitution:
http://www.scribd.com/doc/11737124/
Last edited by Mountain Publius Goat on Wed Jan 14, 2009 2:42 pm
Some links checked and updated Sat May 13, 2023 9:49 pm
"The American people will never knowingly adopt Socialism. But under the name of
liberalism they will adopt every fragment of the Socialist program,
until one day America will be a Socialist nation without knowing how it happened."
Norman Thomas
Mountain Publius Goat
Posts: 895
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Location: The Mountains of Pennsylvania
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https://cdrkerchner.wordpress.com/2020/07/23/u-s-senator-kamala-harris-is-not-a-natural-born-citizen-of-usa-not-eligible-to-be-president-and-cinc-or-vp/
By the way, Google no longer shows such analyses. I had to use Yandex to find this.
Thanks Arch! Yeah, I use Yandex often too.
It should have been made clear BEFORE Harris was allowed to assume the VP title that a person must have at least one US citizen parent at the time of birth just to be a US citizen at all, never mind the question of natural born.
But SCOTUS never clarifies the Constitution until something happens to make them do it.
The fact that nothing happened to challenge Harris's qualification at the time establishes that it's now accepted: being born on US soil is sufficient for a person to run for president or VP if they meet the age requirement, etc. That would now have to be reversed after her 4-year term. While highly unlikely, I would strongly favor that reversal; no one born of two foreigners should ever be president of the USA.
The Founders didn't think they needed to clarify this as the typical English usage of the time settled the matter.
Nicely formatted: http://www.kerchner.com/protectourliberty/goatsledge/20081212%20Law%20of%20Nations.pdf
Rough copy paste:
Law of Nations, 1758 law book defines "natural born citizen" by Mountain Publius Goat on Fri Dec 12, 2008 1:43 am Law of Nations, 1758 law book defines "natural born citizen" Legal scholars and studiers of the founding of our country and the framers of our Constitution reference this book as a core, contemporaneously written legal reference book, The Law of Nations, used by the framers of our Constitution. It was written in 1758 and was used as a college text book in America from c1770 on. Ben Franklin received three copies of the French edition from the editor Dumas in 1775 for use by Franklin and the Continental Congress. It has a section #212, in Book 1 Chapter 19 thereof, which deals with defining "natural born" citizenship. Here is the link to the book at Amazon. I just ordered mine. http://www.amazon.com/LAW-NATIONS-Natural-Law- Paper/dp/0865974519/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1229063894&sr=8-1 Quote of section 212, Chapter 19, Book 1, Law of Nations, by Vattel, written in 1758: "§ 212 - Citizens and Natives. The citizens are the members of the civil society; bound to this society by certain duties, and subject to its authority, they equally participate in its advantages. The natives, or natural-born citizens, are those born in the country, of parents who are citizens. As the society cannot exist and perpetuate itself otherwise than by the children of the citizens, those children naturally follow the condition of their fathers, and succeed to all their rights. The society is supposed to desire this, in consequence of what it owes to its own preservation; and it is presumed, as matter of course, that each citizen, on entering into society, reserves to his children the right of becoming members of it. The country of the fathers is therefore that of the children; and these become true citizens merely by their tacit consent. We shall soon see whether, on their coming to the years of discretion, they may renounce their right, and what they owe to the society in which they were born. I say, that, in order to be of the country, it is necessary that a person be born of a father who is a citizen; for, if he is born there of a foreigner, it will be only the place of his birth, and not his country. "
The Law of Nations, Vattel, 1758, Vol.1, Chapter 19, Section 212, as per the original French edition Vattel Section 212 in French edition. JPG (138.52 KB) Viewed 312 times Section 212, Chapter 19, Book 1,The Law of Nations, Vattel, 1758, (1797 English translation), defines the meaning of "natural born citizen". Citizenship Terms used in U.S. Constitution ConstitutionalCitizenshipTermsChart 1001x1107 JPG (183.6 KB) viewed 609 times Note the emphasis where it says. "... natural born citizens, are those born in the country of parents who are citizens." ... note it says parents, not parent. And later on the father's citizenship too is mentioned as being crucial, not so much as the mother's. And the last sentence, "I say, that, in order to be of the country, it is necessary that a person be born of a father who is a citizen; for, if he is born there of a foreigner, it will be only the place of his birth, and not his country." This contemporaneous legal reference and scholarly book used as a college textbook in the 1700s is relevant to the thinking of our framers when they wrote the U.S. Constitution. And this applies to Obama's case today in several ways. I sure hope the Justices are reading this book lately when it comes to determine the framer's intent for the meaning of "natural born citizen" in our Constitution. Certainly with the facts as we know them about Obama, and common sense, and reading this quote from the 250 year old book tells me that Obama is NOT a natural born citizen of the USA. First, both his parents were not citizens of the USA, only one was. Second, the one who was a citizen of the USA was not his father. Third, where Obama was actually born has not been conclusively proven beyond any doubt. Atty Apuzzo of NJ blog: http://puzo1.blogspot.com/2009/03/natural-born-citizen-discussion-thread.html Atty Taitz of CA blog: http://drorly.blogspot.com/2008/12/law-of-nations-or-principles-of-law-of.html Atty Donofrio of NJ blog: http://naturalborncitizen.wordpress.com/2008/12/11/natural-born-citizen-defined-by- 14th-amendment-framers-and-in-treatise-relied-on-by-scalia/ Atty Berg of PA blog: http://www.obamacrimes.com (original link no longer active and has been taken over by some foreign entity) http://www.obamacitizenshipfacts.info (no longer active – see https://obamacitizenshipfacts.blogspot.com/2019/ ) Mountain Publius Goat P.S. A simple, downloadable, printable chart defining the various types of citizenship terms used in the U.S. Constitution: http://www.scribd.com/doc/11737124/ Last edited by Mountain Publius Goat on Wed Jan 14, 2009 2:42 pm Some links checked and updated Sat May 13, 2023 9:49 pm "The American people will never knowingly adopt Socialism. But under the name of liberalism they will adopt every fragment of the Socialist program, until one day America will be a Socialist nation without knowing how it happened." Norman Thomas Mountain Publius Goat Posts: 895 Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2008 12:56 am Location: The Mountains of Pennsylvania Private message E-mail