Mary is the chosen daughter of the Heavenly Father, mother of the Divine Son and spouse of the Holy Spirit. She is the Queen of Heaven according to the teaching of the Catholic Church. If God honored her so highly, we need not hesitate to honor her, provided we do not give her divine honor which belongs to God alone. From on the cross, Christ gave her to us as our Mother. She is able and ever ready to help us.
Wrong, Jesus was in her womb and He cannot be associated with sin. In other words Jesus does not come from sin, He is either perfect or imperfect there is no in between.
Jesus honored her, so should we.
As a quick edit, there are several humans who were assumed into Heaven, some of us did achieve perfection but for most, it is too difficult.
You assume He placed her on a pedestal, He didn’t.
Then His brothers and His mother came, and standing outside they sent to Him, calling Him. And a multitude was sitting around Him; and they said to Him, “Look, Your mother and Your brothers are outside seeking You.” But He answered them, saying, “Who is My mother, or My brothers?” And He looked around in a circle at those who sat about Him, and said, “Here are My mother and My brothers! For whoever does the will of God is My brother and My sister and mother.”
Mark 3:31-35
While He was still talking to the multitudes, behold, His mother and brothers stood outside, seeking to speak with Him. Then one said to Him, “Look, Your mother and Your brothers are standing outside, seeking to speak with You.” But He answered and said to the one who told Him, “Who is My mother and who are My brothers?” And He stretched out His hand toward His disciples and said, “Here are My mother and My brothers! For whoever does the will of My Father in heaven is My brother and sister and mother.”
Matthew 12:46-50
He couldn’t have come from the MALE line, because He would have had the innate sin. But because the Holy Spirit utilized the female, the sin from Adam didn’t affect him.
The real question, unanswered by 2000 years of theology, is HOW it came to be that Mary's womb was sanctified, such that it belonged to God and not the Enemy.
IMO, the answer to that is embedded in the rather unusual history of women and of sons in the old testament, which shows that progressively, God laid conditions to be able to claim the womb, despite Mary being a descendent of fallen Adam and Eve.
Look at Sarah, Rebeccah, Rachel, Jacob, Esau, also Tamar, etc.
Note also, Jesus was born pure, but not perfect. He lived his life in accordance with God's direction, and grew into full perfection and maturity.
"For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings."
See that would be heresy cause someone can learn the truth yes but Jesus IS truth.
He is either God or He is not. Catholics and Christians believes He is the way and the Truth. No man can be what He is.
Basically Mary and the foster father Joseph were as close to sinless as humanly possible which is why God chose them to raise Jesus. They were the only ones who could do it.
Your comment about Mary being chosen by God to bear His Son is accurate, and it is indeed a great honor, but that’s the only conclusion that can be drawn from Scripture. Her being the spouse of the Holy Spirit and the Queen of Heaven are not based in Scripture at all. At no point are we instructed to pray to any human or angel, and multiple times throughout Scripture men of God and angels alike immediately reject any attempt to worship and pray to them. Also, Jesus did not give Mary to the church collectively as a mother, he gave her to John as a mother so that she could be taken care of (it was a lot harder back then for women to be self sufficient than today).
We are not to base our beliefs on traditions of men, especially from a “church” that denies the most basic teachings of scripture like the fact that Jesus sacrifice alone was sufficient to pay for all our sins. The Catholics deny this and teach that indulgences or other works are needed to forgive sins in addition to Christ’s sacrifice. There is no other word to describe this doctrine than heresy.
"Teachings of the Catholic Church" Friend, you may want to study the origins and history of the Catholic Church before you put all your eggs in her basket.
NOBODY will enter Heaven because of the teachings of the Catholic Church, Jesus said himself "No man may come unto me unless it's granted him from the Father"
No pope, no Bishop, no priest, no Nun, and Mother Mary herself will get a single soul into the Eternal Kingdom of God.
Read chapters 17 & 18 of the book of Revelations, Why would Jesus be exhorting his people to leave a world wide organization that claims to represent Jesus "come out of her my people, so you don't share in her sins?"
Despite the revelations given to her, for most of her life, mary actually disbelieved in Jesus. She repented in the end, but the scripture is full of instances where clearly she doesn't grasp the nature of Jesus mission and value.
Jesus love for his mother never wavered, but the same cannot be said of Mary.
Meh. I count the scripture as a pretty good source.
Let's look at only a few examples.
When Jesus was 12, the family headed to Jerusalem for the sensus. Were they a rich family? With a big entourage? No, they were a humble carpenter's family.
Yet, after they left Jerusalem, for a whole day Mary failed to even realize that Jesus wasn't with them. They went back to Jerusalem to search for him. When mary finds him in the temple, she doesn't say "Of course! My son is the Messiah! This makes perfect sense!" She says, "Why have you mistreated us so badly?" When he explains to them, she doesn't get it at all.
But they did not understand what he was saying to them.
When his parents saw him, they were astonished. His mother said to him, “Son, why have you treated us like this? Your father and I have been anxiously searching for you.”
“Why were you searching for me?” he asked. “Didn’t you know I had to be in my Father’s house?” But they did not understand what he was saying to them.
So let's see. Mary had been given the revelation of Jesus conception and birth, but here, after 12 years, she's already forgotten all about it.
Another episode. Jesus is teaching a spreading his message. He is drawing massive crowds now, but his family think he's bonkers.
Then Jesus entered a house, and again a crowd gathered, so that he and his disciples were not even able to eat. When his family heard about this, they went to take charge of him, for they said, “He is out of his mind.”
So, here we are. Mary received the revelations, and Joseph too, but they did not even educate Jesus brothers and sisters that he is the Messiah? How on earth does Jesus family not even support him, or understand him, but think that instead he is a lunatic?
Later, again Jesus mother and brothers come to collect him. Does he say, Yes, my mother! My brothers! Yes, I will go with them! No, he actually places a massive judgment on them. He implies they are NOT doing the will of God, by declaring, as he often does, that those who do the will of God ARE his brother and sister and mother.
Then Jesus’ mother and brothers came and stood outside. They sent someone in to summon Him, and a crowd was sitting around Him. “Look,” He was told, “Your mother and brothers are outside, asking for You.”
But Jesus replied, “Who are My mother and My brothers?” Looking at those seated in a circle around Him, He said, “Here are My mother and My brothers! For whoever does the will of God is My brother and sister and mother.”
The implication is that his family, instead of supporting him and testifying to him, are in fact saying he's crazy, and are seeking to prevent him on the path he has chosen. Is this the will of God? Obviously not. So, you have to ask, how on earth did this situation come about?
Another instance. Jesus at the wedding in Cana
Jesus’ mother was there, 2and Jesus and His disciples had also been invited to the wedding. When the wine ran out, Jesus’ mother said to Him, “They have no more wine.”
“Woman, why does this concern us?” Jesus replied. “My hour has not yet come.”
He doesn't call her mother. He calls her "Woman". Have you ever spoken to your mother and called her "Woman". See how that goes down.
It's natural for a mother to ask her eldest son to attend to wine at a wedding, but Jesus is with his disciples and is clearly now doing his public mission. Yet, she treats him just as her own son, not as the Messiah.
There are numerous places where the scripture indicates that Mary had no idea what Jesus was doing, how his mission was to unfold, etc. When one reads the scripture not as a fairy tale, but as a oral record describing real situations, the truth about Jesus situation and the family around him appear. Israel had been prepared again and again to receive the coming Messiah. 2000 years. One has to ask why and how it was that even his own family failed to support him. How had the relationships, the understandings so broken down?
There is a gap here between Mary and the rest of Jesus family, and what Jesus is doing. Later, Mary's heart is changed. At the time of the crucifixion, she is there, together with several other women who followed Jesus. But the scriptural records shows very clearly - if one has eyes to see - that She didn't understand his mission, had even forgotten about it, and when he began it, was an element attempting to prevent him.
The Catholic religion glorified and made an icon out of Mary. This was partly because the scripture otherwise did not seem to provide many clear examples and role models for women in faith (even though there are many in the Old Testament).
Whatever the case, that image became greater than the reality, a painful difficult reality that Jesus himself was directly confronted with.
So you consider a parent panicking over the loss of their son or assuming the other parent had their son is a sin now? Haven’t you ever forgotten about anything? Do you have to confess that to God? Because your mind isn’t perfect? That sounds like nonsense dude. Come on. There is so much just totally wrong with much that you wrote, even Jesus referring to Mary as “woman” you don’t think that simply could have been a reference to the book of genesis?
I read your whole response and read the verses you quoted man, and none of them show Jesus’s parents calling him crazy lol this is what happens when people try to interpret the Bible on their own, we need structure because it prevents heresy’s such as Mary and Joseph looking to Jesus as a crazy nut lol if that was the case why on earth would the apostles look to her for advice after Jesus’ death? Or why would Mary follow Jesus every step of the way up until his dying breath? I think you need to look at the other side of things cause it might help you better understand. Even if you don’t believe you still should do your do diligence and find out. It will do you a lot of good brotha
Mary is the chosen daughter of the Heavenly Father, mother of the Divine Son and spouse of the Holy Spirit. She is the Queen of Heaven according to the teaching of the Catholic Church. If God honored her so highly, we need not hesitate to honor her, provided we do not give her divine honor which belongs to God alone. From on the cross, Christ gave her to us as our Mother. She is able and ever ready to help us.
She was human and sinful like all of us. She would be upset with people putting her on a pedestal.
Wrong, Jesus was in her womb and He cannot be associated with sin. In other words Jesus does not come from sin, He is either perfect or imperfect there is no in between.
Jesus honored her, so should we.
As a quick edit, there are several humans who were assumed into Heaven, some of us did achieve perfection but for most, it is too difficult.
You assume He placed her on a pedestal, He didn’t.
Then His brothers and His mother came, and standing outside they sent to Him, calling Him. And a multitude was sitting around Him; and they said to Him, “Look, Your mother and Your brothers are outside seeking You.” But He answered them, saying, “Who is My mother, or My brothers?” And He looked around in a circle at those who sat about Him, and said, “Here are My mother and My brothers! For whoever does the will of God is My brother and My sister and mother.” Mark 3:31-35
While He was still talking to the multitudes, behold, His mother and brothers stood outside, seeking to speak with Him. Then one said to Him, “Look, Your mother and Your brothers are standing outside, seeking to speak with You.” But He answered and said to the one who told Him, “Who is My mother and who are My brothers?” And He stretched out His hand toward His disciples and said, “Here are My mother and My brothers! For whoever does the will of My Father in heaven is My brother and sister and mother.” Matthew 12:46-50
Not being a dick but are you sure you were talking to me?
You’re actually incorrect dude.
He couldn’t have come from the MALE line, because He would have had the innate sin. But because the Holy Spirit utilized the female, the sin from Adam didn’t affect him.
The real question, unanswered by 2000 years of theology, is HOW it came to be that Mary's womb was sanctified, such that it belonged to God and not the Enemy.
IMO, the answer to that is embedded in the rather unusual history of women and of sons in the old testament, which shows that progressively, God laid conditions to be able to claim the womb, despite Mary being a descendent of fallen Adam and Eve.
Look at Sarah, Rebeccah, Rachel, Jacob, Esau, also Tamar, etc.
Note also, Jesus was born pure, but not perfect. He lived his life in accordance with God's direction, and grew into full perfection and maturity.
"For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings."
See that would be heresy cause someone can learn the truth yes but Jesus IS truth.
He is either God or He is not. Catholics and Christians believes He is the way and the Truth. No man can be what He is.
Basically Mary and the foster father Joseph were as close to sinless as humanly possible which is why God chose them to raise Jesus. They were the only ones who could do it.
Your comment about Mary being chosen by God to bear His Son is accurate, and it is indeed a great honor, but that’s the only conclusion that can be drawn from Scripture. Her being the spouse of the Holy Spirit and the Queen of Heaven are not based in Scripture at all. At no point are we instructed to pray to any human or angel, and multiple times throughout Scripture men of God and angels alike immediately reject any attempt to worship and pray to them. Also, Jesus did not give Mary to the church collectively as a mother, he gave her to John as a mother so that she could be taken care of (it was a lot harder back then for women to be self sufficient than today).
We are not to base our beliefs on traditions of men, especially from a “church” that denies the most basic teachings of scripture like the fact that Jesus sacrifice alone was sufficient to pay for all our sins. The Catholics deny this and teach that indulgences or other works are needed to forgive sins in addition to Christ’s sacrifice. There is no other word to describe this doctrine than heresy.
Sola Scriptura
"Teachings of the Catholic Church" Friend, you may want to study the origins and history of the Catholic Church before you put all your eggs in her basket.
NOBODY will enter Heaven because of the teachings of the Catholic Church, Jesus said himself "No man may come unto me unless it's granted him from the Father"
No pope, no Bishop, no priest, no Nun, and Mother Mary herself will get a single soul into the Eternal Kingdom of God.
Read chapters 17 & 18 of the book of Revelations, Why would Jesus be exhorting his people to leave a world wide organization that claims to represent Jesus "come out of her my people, so you don't share in her sins?"
Despite the revelations given to her, for most of her life, mary actually disbelieved in Jesus. She repented in the end, but the scripture is full of instances where clearly she doesn't grasp the nature of Jesus mission and value.
Jesus love for his mother never wavered, but the same cannot be said of Mary.
Lol where did you get this info? Sounds like you got a bad source.
Meh. I count the scripture as a pretty good source.
Let's look at only a few examples.
When Jesus was 12, the family headed to Jerusalem for the sensus. Were they a rich family? With a big entourage? No, they were a humble carpenter's family.
Yet, after they left Jerusalem, for a whole day Mary failed to even realize that Jesus wasn't with them. They went back to Jerusalem to search for him. When mary finds him in the temple, she doesn't say "Of course! My son is the Messiah! This makes perfect sense!" She says, "Why have you mistreated us so badly?" When he explains to them, she doesn't get it at all.
But they did not understand what he was saying to them.
So let's see. Mary had been given the revelation of Jesus conception and birth, but here, after 12 years, she's already forgotten all about it.
Another episode. Jesus is teaching a spreading his message. He is drawing massive crowds now, but his family think he's bonkers.
So, here we are. Mary received the revelations, and Joseph too, but they did not even educate Jesus brothers and sisters that he is the Messiah? How on earth does Jesus family not even support him, or understand him, but think that instead he is a lunatic?
Later, again Jesus mother and brothers come to collect him. Does he say, Yes, my mother! My brothers! Yes, I will go with them! No, he actually places a massive judgment on them. He implies they are NOT doing the will of God, by declaring, as he often does, that those who do the will of God ARE his brother and sister and mother.
The implication is that his family, instead of supporting him and testifying to him, are in fact saying he's crazy, and are seeking to prevent him on the path he has chosen. Is this the will of God? Obviously not. So, you have to ask, how on earth did this situation come about?
Another instance. Jesus at the wedding in Cana
He doesn't call her mother. He calls her "Woman". Have you ever spoken to your mother and called her "Woman". See how that goes down.
It's natural for a mother to ask her eldest son to attend to wine at a wedding, but Jesus is with his disciples and is clearly now doing his public mission. Yet, she treats him just as her own son, not as the Messiah.
There are numerous places where the scripture indicates that Mary had no idea what Jesus was doing, how his mission was to unfold, etc. When one reads the scripture not as a fairy tale, but as a oral record describing real situations, the truth about Jesus situation and the family around him appear. Israel had been prepared again and again to receive the coming Messiah. 2000 years. One has to ask why and how it was that even his own family failed to support him. How had the relationships, the understandings so broken down?
There is a gap here between Mary and the rest of Jesus family, and what Jesus is doing. Later, Mary's heart is changed. At the time of the crucifixion, she is there, together with several other women who followed Jesus. But the scriptural records shows very clearly - if one has eyes to see - that She didn't understand his mission, had even forgotten about it, and when he began it, was an element attempting to prevent him.
The Catholic religion glorified and made an icon out of Mary. This was partly because the scripture otherwise did not seem to provide many clear examples and role models for women in faith (even though there are many in the Old Testament).
Whatever the case, that image became greater than the reality, a painful difficult reality that Jesus himself was directly confronted with.
So you consider a parent panicking over the loss of their son or assuming the other parent had their son is a sin now? Haven’t you ever forgotten about anything? Do you have to confess that to God? Because your mind isn’t perfect? That sounds like nonsense dude. Come on. There is so much just totally wrong with much that you wrote, even Jesus referring to Mary as “woman” you don’t think that simply could have been a reference to the book of genesis?
I read your whole response and read the verses you quoted man, and none of them show Jesus’s parents calling him crazy lol this is what happens when people try to interpret the Bible on their own, we need structure because it prevents heresy’s such as Mary and Joseph looking to Jesus as a crazy nut lol if that was the case why on earth would the apostles look to her for advice after Jesus’ death? Or why would Mary follow Jesus every step of the way up until his dying breath? I think you need to look at the other side of things cause it might help you better understand. Even if you don’t believe you still should do your do diligence and find out. It will do you a lot of good brotha