Do the Jesus believers actually believe this? Like God is going to return and teleport those he believes worthy to heaven or someplace similar? What happens to this Earth? Does it turn into Hell for the evil? Is this all just a test?
I just don't see how believing Jesus is God could be a requirement to get into heaven. What if I'm living a great life in a remote village in the middle of nowhere and live my entire life doing Good and never even hear about Jesus. Would I be condemned like everyone else? This is why I can never get behind X figure actually being God. God is everywhere and everything. Maybe God avatared into Jesus at some point but to act like God is Jesus seems insane because by that logic we're all God which I think is probably more correct.
I mean no disrespect by this. Like who was God for all of time before Jesus was born? Was it still Jesus?
I'll try to offer some answers but some of your questions may be better answered by resources like https://gotquestions.org
I can say that, yes, Christian believers do believe that Jesus will return, He said He would, that's what having faith is about.
Entering heaven or the presence of God requires perfect holiness which no human can achieve by themselves, we are all sinners which is why we need salvation through Jesus Christ who lived a holy life of sacrifice to make a Way for us to be reconciled to God.
According to the Bible, people are judged based on their level of knowledge so if you had never heard of Jesus per se, the evidence of God's existence in creation and your own conscience would be the basis by which you are judged.
It is difficult for finite mortal beings such as us to understand the eternal, infinite God. He is described as Father, Son(Jesus) and Holy Spirit, three persons in one being that has always existed. An imperfect metaphor may be to consider that you are mind, body and spirit. Your mind is you, your body is you, and your spirit is you but your mind is not your body and your body is not your spirit. It is important to understand the relational nature of God because it explains how God is love from before the creation of the world.
Tldr: we all fall short of perfection, but through faith in Jesus' sacrifice on the cross, we can have access to a loving relationship with our Creator God
people are judged based on their level of knowledge>
I can totally understand that. I'm not anti-Jesus at all (I'm really open to almost anything) I just believe differently I guess. I want a good outcome in the afterlife but at this time I just don't believe Jesus was actually God but I really resonate with what you're saying about Mind, Body, and Spirt. I think bringing those into alignment would bring you to God. A lot of yoga and meditation is all about that.
Maybe there are different ways to find God. I know Christianity says that's incorrect but why should there be one option? That seems like human created gatekeeping which I see all religions as. If a person can meditate and "find God" it doesn't mean that's the end of the story imo. You still have to be a good person and work on yourself in this realm and seek Truth and Knowledge.
For me, spirituality personally means self development, finding and connecting with Source (God), developing spirt, understanding Good and Evil and doing your best to align with Good. I try to pray daily now and ask God to help me be a more loving person and to help humanity and give the Good people on Earth the strength to fight the Evil of this world.
Understood. My personal view is that love is other-centered. Jesus is a role model of radical other-centeredness: God entering our world as a defenseless baby, living a life of poverty and service to others including paying the price for the sins of the world to offer free salvation to all who believe.
If you are interested in learning more about Jesus, I highly recommend The Case for Christ by Lee Strobel, it's an easy read by a journalist who started out trying to debunk Christianity and became a believer.
God bless.
THIS is Jesus speaking of the Rapture or Harpadzo. This is different from His second coming to stand on the earth as King of Kings because when that happens, every eye will see Him and He is going to destroy all the armies of the earth. (Rev. 19:11-21)
I think you may be thinking of Luke 17:20-21 about the kingdom of God being within?
The context of this verse is Jesus speaking to His disciples about going to the Father and preparing a place for them. His disciples were Galileans, so the local wedding tradition of the groom leaving his betrothed to prepare a place in his father's house and the bride making herself ready for the wedding (the timing of which was decided by the groom's father) is likely implied here. This interpretation dovetails with the prophecies at the end of Revelation and there are several videos available about Galilean Wedding Tradition in Bible times if you are interested.
Pre-trib rapture fans (I grew up Baptist, so I believed it too) have to hippity-hop and pull short passages out to build their eschatology. NO WAY anyone of normal intelligence could generate "secret pre-trib rapture" on their own reading without theology schools etc....
But ... "Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man; but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost" (II Peter 1:20-21)
We DO have one entire chapter, Matthew 24, where JESUS Himself provides the eschatology.
Why? Because Jesus' disciples, His friends, are asking Him, SPECIFICALLY, "what happens to us? What happens at the end?"
"And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto Him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming and of the end of the world?" (Matt. 24: 3)
The end-time events described by Jesus in response to the disciples' questions is the eschatology taught by the most influential preachers in our history--like Jonathon Edwards, Charles Spurgeon, etc...There was NO pre-trib rapture theology before the 1820s. John Nelson Darby of the Plymouth Brethren and the Scofield (Westcott and Hort). A Scottish Catholic mystic, Margaret MacDonald is also "credited" with generating pre-trib via her "dreams and visions" between 1815 and 1820. Darby visited her in the 1820's.
Interesting that Jesus never mentions a secret rapture in the entire chapter, even though He is describing the very beginnings of the end times' tribulations through the end. Read the entire chapter carefully and literally.
First mention of removing Christians from the Earth:
"And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all of the tribes of earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory." (Matt 24:30)
"And he shall send his angels with the sound of a great trumpet, and they shall gather together the elect, from one end of heaven to the other" (Matt 24:31)
Why don't we go straight to Jesus? Why does He have the ANGELS gather the elect? Because He's on His way down to Earth, rolling up His sleeves to whup arse.
Jesus laid it ALL out for His disciples when they asked Him about "the end". We don't need to infer, analyze, or draw comparisons. He didn't "forget" the secret rapture. It's just NOT THERE.
^^^And all God’s children said....🙏🙏🙏
Commentary https://dailyverse.knowing-jesus.com/John-14-3
Do the Jesus believers actually believe this? Like God is going to return and teleport those he believes worthy to heaven or someplace similar? What happens to this Earth? Does it turn into Hell for the evil? Is this all just a test?
I just don't see how believing Jesus is God could be a requirement to get into heaven. What if I'm living a great life in a remote village in the middle of nowhere and live my entire life doing Good and never even hear about Jesus. Would I be condemned like everyone else? This is why I can never get behind X figure actually being God. God is everywhere and everything. Maybe God avatared into Jesus at some point but to act like God is Jesus seems insane because by that logic we're all God which I think is probably more correct.
I mean no disrespect by this. Like who was God for all of time before Jesus was born? Was it still Jesus?
I'll try to offer some answers but some of your questions may be better answered by resources like https://gotquestions.org
I can say that, yes, Christian believers do believe that Jesus will return, He said He would, that's what having faith is about.
Entering heaven or the presence of God requires perfect holiness which no human can achieve by themselves, we are all sinners which is why we need salvation through Jesus Christ who lived a holy life of sacrifice to make a Way for us to be reconciled to God.
According to the Bible, people are judged based on their level of knowledge so if you had never heard of Jesus per se, the evidence of God's existence in creation and your own conscience would be the basis by which you are judged.
It is difficult for finite mortal beings such as us to understand the eternal, infinite God. He is described as Father, Son(Jesus) and Holy Spirit, three persons in one being that has always existed. An imperfect metaphor may be to consider that you are mind, body and spirit. Your mind is you, your body is you, and your spirit is you but your mind is not your body and your body is not your spirit. It is important to understand the relational nature of God because it explains how God is love from before the creation of the world.
Tldr: we all fall short of perfection, but through faith in Jesus' sacrifice on the cross, we can have access to a loving relationship with our Creator God
I can totally understand that. I'm not anti-Jesus at all (I'm really open to almost anything) I just believe differently I guess. I want a good outcome in the afterlife but at this time I just don't believe Jesus was actually God but I really resonate with what you're saying about Mind, Body, and Spirt. I think bringing those into alignment would bring you to God. A lot of yoga and meditation is all about that.
Maybe there are different ways to find God. I know Christianity says that's incorrect but why should there be one option? That seems like human created gatekeeping which I see all religions as. If a person can meditate and "find God" it doesn't mean that's the end of the story imo. You still have to be a good person and work on yourself in this realm and seek Truth and Knowledge.
For me, spirituality personally means self development, finding and connecting with Source (God), developing spirt, understanding Good and Evil and doing your best to align with Good. I try to pray daily now and ask God to help me be a more loving person and to help humanity and give the Good people on Earth the strength to fight the Evil of this world.
Understood. My personal view is that love is other-centered. Jesus is a role model of radical other-centeredness: God entering our world as a defenseless baby, living a life of poverty and service to others including paying the price for the sins of the world to offer free salvation to all who believe.
If you are interested in learning more about Jesus, I highly recommend The Case for Christ by Lee Strobel, it's an easy read by a journalist who started out trying to debunk Christianity and became a believer. God bless.
Amen!
I believe in a literal rapture of the bride of Christ before seven years of tribulation/new world order. John 14:1-3 is my blessed hope!
Come, Lord Jesus! Maran atha!🙏
Is your name written in God's Book of Life? You can still make it there if you become one of His children.
THIS is Jesus speaking of the Rapture or Harpadzo. This is different from His second coming to stand on the earth as King of Kings because when that happens, every eye will see Him and He is going to destroy all the armies of the earth. (Rev. 19:11-21)
Not in the way you think...
It's not visible. Christ within.
The great awakening.
I think you may be thinking of Luke 17:20-21 about the kingdom of God being within?
The context of this verse is Jesus speaking to His disciples about going to the Father and preparing a place for them. His disciples were Galileans, so the local wedding tradition of the groom leaving his betrothed to prepare a place in his father's house and the bride making herself ready for the wedding (the timing of which was decided by the groom's father) is likely implied here. This interpretation dovetails with the prophecies at the end of Revelation and there are several videos available about Galilean Wedding Tradition in Bible times if you are interested.
Pre-trib rapture fans (I grew up Baptist, so I believed it too) have to hippity-hop and pull short passages out to build their eschatology. NO WAY anyone of normal intelligence could generate "secret pre-trib rapture" on their own reading without theology schools etc....
But ... "Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man; but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost" (II Peter 1:20-21)
We DO have one entire chapter, Matthew 24, where JESUS Himself provides the eschatology.
Why? Because Jesus' disciples, His friends, are asking Him, SPECIFICALLY, "what happens to us? What happens at the end?"
"And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto Him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming and of the end of the world?" (Matt. 24: 3)
The end-time events described by Jesus in response to the disciples' questions is the eschatology taught by the most influential preachers in our history--like Jonathon Edwards, Charles Spurgeon, etc...There was NO pre-trib rapture theology before the 1820s. John Nelson Darby of the Plymouth Brethren and the Scofield (Westcott and Hort). A Scottish Catholic mystic, Margaret MacDonald is also "credited" with generating pre-trib via her "dreams and visions" between 1815 and 1820. Darby visited her in the 1820's.
Interesting that Jesus never mentions a secret rapture in the entire chapter, even though He is describing the very beginnings of the end times' tribulations through the end. Read the entire chapter carefully and literally.
First mention of removing Christians from the Earth:
"And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all of the tribes of earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory." (Matt 24:30)
"And he shall send his angels with the sound of a great trumpet, and they shall gather together the elect, from one end of heaven to the other" (Matt 24:31)
Why don't we go straight to Jesus? Why does He have the ANGELS gather the elect? Because He's on His way down to Earth, rolling up His sleeves to whup arse.
Jesus laid it ALL out for His disciples when they asked Him about "the end". We don't need to infer, analyze, or draw comparisons. He didn't "forget" the secret rapture. It's just NOT THERE.
No.