Provisionally. Colleges didn't used to be this way.
If you pitch all colleges then you may as well pitch all religions. There are lots of problems in many churches, so what, get rid of those all to?
The big Liberal Universities are for sure a problem, many many smaller ones yes, but not all. Don't throw the baby out with the bath water.
I know LOTS of good places, and a lot of kids that go for free. There are more scollarships and grants out there than people know., and a lot of them are full rides. My kids graduating class, one girl got scollarships for 12 full rides, because no one else applied. The bigger issues are:
HS students are rarely taught how to find, take advantage of financial aid opportunities.
Crap degrees & fields of study are a big part of college problems.
Business administration, IT Science, Chemistry, yes. All solid degrees.
Underwater Basket Weaving, Racial Studies, Astrology (yup, 4 yr. Degree). These need weeded out. College can be/will be good, just like government, gotta get rid of the crap floating around killing it.
My son was doing an Elec Eng degree at UCSD and they MADE him take a full language proficiency year that he couldn't do alongside his credit heavy major so had to take an extra year just to do the stupid language classes which he will NEVER use. Also a bunch of Making of Modern World crap because he was required to be in a subdivision of the university that he did not choose and was more geared toward Liberal Arts/Social Justice focus. Incredibly frustrating. SO GLAD that is over as of this summer. He's totally based and will use his skills for noble goals. So grateful. No jabs, got his religious exemption altho they pushed back... No masks.
As with most things, I think the college discussion should look to history to see why it is what it has become.
IIRC, going from memory here, way back colleges were a way for the higher class to refine their knowledge, stand out in education compared to the public who, at best, generally had elementary school education. boarding schools would specialize and refine, with academies and university about the only place you could get specialized knowledge, doctors, mathmaticians, hard sciences, philosophy, etc.
In the more recent past my childhood understanding was yes, there was crap out there, but college was there to do a few things.
Make you more well rounded as a person, exposing you to a plethora of diciplines and help you understand the many facets of life.
Teach you how to learn, more on the intellectual level, but there you go.
ancilliary, how to get a job for your chosen profession. Practicums and internships are (were?) highly encouraged.
Unfortunately, college requirements for jobs has become so prevailent, pretty much everyone is encouraged to go, which created high demands (what we saw developing in the 80's), we have tons of junk colleges with junk degrees everywhere.
Short reply, agree. Trade or 2 year degrees are excellent for most people. it is a shame higher learning has been ravaged by idiots, fools and facists/commies.
What time frame are you referring to when you say, "Colleges didn't used to be this way." You'd have to go back 50 years or more to get me to agree with that statement. And even before then, it is an, "I don't know because it was before my own experiences."
Colleges and universities make a mockery of the inflation rate. Take the inflation rate and quadruple it or even more. This has been the tuition rate of universities and colleges, since the 1970s.
As far as the scholarships and grants, yea, there out there, but not that easy to get.
Yes, I'm referring to 50+ years. Even then, however, I'm just not a fan of hyperbolic over generalizations. It is easy to say ALL colleges are crap. But it simply isn't true, even today.
Yes, scolerships are hard to get, but parents can do a lot to help with that. By helping their kids look. They are there.
"The universities are raking in huge tuition fees, which students can only pay b/c of loans. The universities are a racket, a leftist racket. They thrive whether the graduate gets a job or not, if the debt gets paid or not."
to which you responded by saying:
"Colleges didn't used to be this way."
As a rule of thumb, u/ArmyLady statement is so true. I suppose somewhere in this vast land we live there 'might' be an exception, but it would surprise me greatly. Her statement for at least the last 50 years is so true. I lived it and experienced it. My brother and my friends all lived it and experienced it. It's common knowledge to all those that went to college.
By the time I left, this conservative midwest religious college had invited Gloria Steinem and her sidekick (name I do not remember) into the main girls' dorm for a talk. Later when the U wanted donations, I wrote to the dean of students explaining why I was not contributing, she denied it happened. Maybe someone sneaked them in without the dean knowing?
I can barely read most of the Alum magazine, liberal gobby-de-gook. Army magazine is getting to be the same way, sadly.
Citing personal experience, I have also graduated from college. Most of my family has. Friends as well.
I have attended private college and university. Also attended public local colleges. Perhaps the difference is Red vs. Blue state, and also size of school.
I agree with the OP by and large. You and i also seem to agree, as per rule of thumb, that is the case, agreed.
However. Again, my caveat was do not lump ALL colleges and universities together. By going to college you should know this too.
This is why we have discernment. If that college is gonna teach you liberal garbage and they have no value, why are you going there???? There are literally thousands to choose from. Either choose a different one and move on, go to a trade school like many in my family have, or go straight to the workforce.
Likewise you can marry into money, but that discussion is for another time.
meh let's not conflate religions with churches XD churches being 501c3 and falling under the government thumb regardless of what religion they claim to follow probably isn't a bad comparison.
Provisionally. Colleges didn't used to be this way.
If you pitch all colleges then you may as well pitch all religions. There are lots of problems in many churches, so what, get rid of those all to?
The big Liberal Universities are for sure a problem, many many smaller ones yes, but not all. Don't throw the baby out with the bath water.
I know LOTS of good places, and a lot of kids that go for free. There are more scollarships and grants out there than people know., and a lot of them are full rides. My kids graduating class, one girl got scollarships for 12 full rides, because no one else applied. The bigger issues are:
HS students are rarely taught how to find, take advantage of financial aid opportunities.
Crap degrees & fields of study are a big part of college problems.
Business administration, IT Science, Chemistry, yes. All solid degrees.
Underwater Basket Weaving, Racial Studies, Astrology (yup, 4 yr. Degree). These need weeded out. College can be/will be good, just like government, gotta get rid of the crap floating around killing it.
My son was doing an Elec Eng degree at UCSD and they MADE him take a full language proficiency year that he couldn't do alongside his credit heavy major so had to take an extra year just to do the stupid language classes which he will NEVER use. Also a bunch of Making of Modern World crap because he was required to be in a subdivision of the university that he did not choose and was more geared toward Liberal Arts/Social Justice focus. Incredibly frustrating. SO GLAD that is over as of this summer. He's totally based and will use his skills for noble goals. So grateful. No jabs, got his religious exemption altho they pushed back... No masks.
Agreed.
As with most things, I think the college discussion should look to history to see why it is what it has become. IIRC, going from memory here, way back colleges were a way for the higher class to refine their knowledge, stand out in education compared to the public who, at best, generally had elementary school education. boarding schools would specialize and refine, with academies and university about the only place you could get specialized knowledge, doctors, mathmaticians, hard sciences, philosophy, etc.
In the more recent past my childhood understanding was yes, there was crap out there, but college was there to do a few things.
Make you more well rounded as a person, exposing you to a plethora of diciplines and help you understand the many facets of life.
Teach you how to learn, more on the intellectual level, but there you go.
ancilliary, how to get a job for your chosen profession. Practicums and internships are (were?) highly encouraged.
Unfortunately, college requirements for jobs has become so prevailent, pretty much everyone is encouraged to go, which created high demands (what we saw developing in the 80's), we have tons of junk colleges with junk degrees everywhere.
Short reply, agree. Trade or 2 year degrees are excellent for most people. it is a shame higher learning has been ravaged by idiots, fools and facists/commies.
What time frame are you referring to when you say, "Colleges didn't used to be this way." You'd have to go back 50 years or more to get me to agree with that statement. And even before then, it is an, "I don't know because it was before my own experiences."
Colleges and universities make a mockery of the inflation rate. Take the inflation rate and quadruple it or even more. This has been the tuition rate of universities and colleges, since the 1970s.
As far as the scholarships and grants, yea, there out there, but not that easy to get.
Yes, I'm referring to 50+ years. Even then, however, I'm just not a fan of hyperbolic over generalizations. It is easy to say ALL colleges are crap. But it simply isn't true, even today.
Yes, scolerships are hard to get, but parents can do a lot to help with that. By helping their kids look. They are there.
The following is the quote from [u/ArmyLady:](/u/ArmyLady:)
to which you responded by saying:
As a rule of thumb, u/ArmyLady statement is so true. I suppose somewhere in this vast land we live there 'might' be an exception, but it would surprise me greatly. Her statement for at least the last 50 years is so true. I lived it and experienced it. My brother and my friends all lived it and experienced it. It's common knowledge to all those that went to college.
Yes. It changed while I was in college.
By the time I left, this conservative midwest religious college had invited Gloria Steinem and her sidekick (name I do not remember) into the main girls' dorm for a talk. Later when the U wanted donations, I wrote to the dean of students explaining why I was not contributing, she denied it happened. Maybe someone sneaked them in without the dean knowing?
I can barely read most of the Alum magazine, liberal gobby-de-gook. Army magazine is getting to be the same way, sadly.
Citing personal experience, I have also graduated from college. Most of my family has. Friends as well.
I have attended private college and university. Also attended public local colleges. Perhaps the difference is Red vs. Blue state, and also size of school.
I agree with the OP by and large. You and i also seem to agree, as per rule of thumb, that is the case, agreed.
However. Again, my caveat was do not lump ALL colleges and universities together. By going to college you should know this too.
This is why we have discernment. If that college is gonna teach you liberal garbage and they have no value, why are you going there???? There are literally thousands to choose from. Either choose a different one and move on, go to a trade school like many in my family have, or go straight to the workforce.
Likewise you can marry into money, but that discussion is for another time.
meh let's not conflate religions with churches XD churches being 501c3 and falling under the government thumb regardless of what religion they claim to follow probably isn't a bad comparison.