Welcome to General Chat - GAW Community Area
This General Chat area started off as a place for people to talk about things that are off topic, however it has quickly evolved into a community and has become an integral part of the GAW experience for many of us.
Based on its evolving needs and plenty of user feedback, we are trying to bring some order and institute some rules. Please make sure you read these rules and participate in the spirit of this community.
Rules for General Chat
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Be respectful to each other. This is of utmost importance, and comments may be removed if deemed not respectful.
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Avoid long drawn out arguments. This should be a place to relax, not to waste your time needlessly.
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Personal anecdotes, puzzles, cute pics/clips - everything welcome
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Please do not spam at the top level. If you have a lot to post each day, try and post them all together in one top level comment
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Try keep things light. If you are bringing in deep stuff, try not to go overboard.
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Things that are clearly on-topic for this board should be posted as a separate post and not here (except if you are new and still getting the feel of this place)
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If you find people violating these rules, deport them rather than start a argument here.
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Feel free to give feedback as these rules are expected to keep evoloving
In short, imagine this thread to be a local community hall where we all gather and chat daily. Please be respectful to others in the same way
It sounds like you're suggesting that a believer can lose their salvation. I disagree with that, as Ephesians 4:30 assures us we have been 'sealed for the day of redemption.'
It's an interesting question. I believe God gives us the opportunity to turn away from him, which if we do that, we condemn ourselves. It might depend on varying translations, but I read 4:30 as being conditioned on faithfully converting, as specified earlier in the chapter's verses 4:14, 17 and 21, which involve abandoning old ways and abstaining from evil ways and thoughts.
And then we have other verses such as Luke 9:62- "And Jesus said unto him, No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God" that imply a person can learn the truth and yet knowingly abandon it, disqualifying themselves.
In a way it's academic: the question is only relevant for those who believe in Jesus the Christ and who then knowingly do wrong. Hopefully that doesn't apply to either of us, and I will appeal to His mercy should I falter from weakness. At any rate, that's how I read it.
Thanks for the further discussion. I agree that there are passages that 'seemingly' suggest that. However, my belief is that God's promise is far superior than our human promises and it does not falter. Even after we become believers, we are still imperfect, still sinners. Though we strive to live outside the shackles of sin, we are still frail, imperfect humans and do "miss the mark" (the actual translation of the Greek word 'sin' used in the New Testament.) So yes, we miss the bullseye because we are indeed imperfect.
However, God's promises to us are unfailing. So even when we fail, even when we falter and turn away from the faith, the promise that He made to us doesn't change. We are secure in His faithfulness to us. I am very grateful for that.
Good discussions are not for winning or losing a dispute, but rather to help the participants uncover the truth themselves by exploring new perspectives, with the opportunity to further open the mind and the heart. Agreement on the conclusion is not needed to benefit from and enjoy the discussion. And it's healthy to challenge one's ideas, especially when the challenge comes from good faith. The Bible is a source of study that is inexhaustible, and deserves frequent visits. I'll continue to turn it over in my heart. Thank you.
I agree, and civil discussions have been limited in our country (that is, if you're in the USA - but even in other countries) in recent years. I enjoy them. As you said, the bible is a source of study that is inexhaustible. I never pretend to have all the answers, only to know the One who does. I find peace in knowing of God's faithfulness to me, even if I fail in my faithfulness to me. Willfulness, weakness, stubborn stupidity - all of these I have exhibited at times and regretted. God's patience with me has been infinite. Blessings to you, fren.