You disagree with yourself right in the same comment friend
which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt
Mystery Babylon is the spiritual name for the woman
Sodom and Egypt is the spiritual name for Jerusalem, which is only a portion of Mystery Babylon, as I see it. Jerusalem has been accused of "playing the harlot", but the woman is the MOTHER of ALL harlots.
Since we know Jerusalem was faithful in the beginning, she can't be called the mother of harlots. I'd assign that label to Babylon, for I find that all false religions begun at the Tower of Babel.
Mystery Babylon represents a place as well as a woman. The woman was a Harlot who had committed fornication (spiritual). The Harlot was riding/directing the Beast. The Beast represents a government - the Roman Government at the time of Jesus Christ. The crucifixion of Christ was a joint effort between the Roman government and the Jewish Religious Leaders (High Priest et al). Mystery Babylon is a religious system. John is writing in coded language to conceal his message. The woman is apostate Israel with it's headquarters in Jerusalem.
Jerusalem was faithful in the beginning? That's not what I get out of the entire New Testament (or the Old for that matter). Israel was constantly backsliding. Jesus told the Jewish religious leaders that their "house" would be left to them desolate. The "house" was the Temple. That prophecy came to pass. Read Matthew chapter 23!
John is not speaking of Babylon in Iraq. He is speaking of the Jerusalem that existed in the 1st century which was destroyed by Roman General Titus in 70 A.D.
How is the faithful city become an harlot! it was full of judgment; righteousness lodged in it; but now murderers.
Jeremiah 2:2
Go and cry in the ears of Jerusalem, saying, Thus saith the LORD; I remember thee, the kindness of thy youth, the love of thine espousals, when thou wentest after me in the wilderness, in a land that was not sown.
The faithful city became a harlot. They committed spiritual adultery. They had filled up the cup of trembling. Therefore they were judged by God Almighty. They were supposed to be righteous but became murderers.
I believe Matt 23:37-38 helps answer that question: “Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were not willing. Look, your house is left to you desolate.".
**Where were the prophets killed? Where was Jesus the Messiah killed? Jerusalem! They became murderers. **
Does that mean Jerusalem (which represents a religious system led by ungodly leaders) was always unrighteous? Of course not - there were periods where Israel was in obedience. But by in large they were not!
I don't have time right now to really dig into this but at some point I'd like to if you're available. For now I'll just present a quick AI summary of each position (I hold to the latter):
The interpretation of the "woman who rides the beast" in the Book of Revelation has generated extensive debate over the centuries. Two prominent interpretations involve Jerusalem and the Catholic Church. Below are some of the strongest arguments for each position.
Arguments for Jerusalem as the Woman Who Rides the Beast
Historical Context: In the first century, Jerusalem was the center of Jewish life and worship. The city had a complex relationship with the ruling Roman Empire, which parallels the imagery of the beast as a representation of corrupt political power.
Symbolic Imagery: Jerusalem is often depicted as a woman in biblical texts. For example, in the Old Testament, cities are frequently personified as feminine figures. Revelation 21 contrasts the "New Jerusalem" with Babylon, suggesting a broader symbolism of Jerusalem representing both the faithful and, in its fall, the corrupt.
Rejection of Christ: Jerusalem is often associated with the rejection of Jesus, the Messiah. This rejection could be seen as embodying the "abominations" referenced in Revelation, specifically in light of the city's role in the crucifixion and persecution of early Christians.
Prophetic Literature: The prophetic literature of the Old Testament often depicts Jerusalem in a dual light—both as a place of future hope and as a city that has been judged. The judgment on Jerusalem by the Romans in 70 CE could be reflected in the imagery of the beast.
Link to Babylon: Revelation refers to the woman as "Babylon the Great," and some interpreters see this as a representation of Jerusalem, which had gone through cycles of faithfulness and unfaithfulness, particularly during the Second Temple period where political corruption and moral decline were rampant.
Arguments for the Catholic Church as the Woman Who Rides the Beast
Historical Identification: Throughout history, many Protestant reformers and theologians identified the Catholic Church with Babylon due to perceived corruption, the establishment of papal authority, and the alleged departure from original Christianity.
Political Power: The Catholic Church, particularly during the Middle Ages, wielded significant political power and influence, often partnering with and challenging secular authorities, which aligns with the image of a woman riding a beast (an alliance between church and state).
Symbolism of the Seven Hills: Revelation 17:9 mentions the woman sitting on seven hills. Rome, the seat of the Catholic Church, is famously known as the "City of Seven Hills," providing a geographical link to the interpretation.
Persecution of Saints: The Catholic Church, throughout its history, has been involved in the persecution of various groups, including other Christians (e.g., the Inquisition) and non-Christians. This aligns with the portrayal of the woman in Revelation as one who is drunk with the blood of the saints.
Maternal Imagery: The Catholic Church often uses maternal imagery in its theology (e.g., the Church as Mother). This parallels the woman in Revelation, who is presented as nurturing but also as an entity that can exploit and oppress, fitting with the notion of institutional corruption.
You disagree with yourself right in the same comment friend
Mystery Babylon is the spiritual name for the woman
Sodom and Egypt is the spiritual name for Jerusalem, which is only a portion of Mystery Babylon, as I see it. Jerusalem has been accused of "playing the harlot", but the woman is the MOTHER of ALL harlots.
Since we know Jerusalem was faithful in the beginning, she can't be called the mother of harlots. I'd assign that label to Babylon, for I find that all false religions begun at the Tower of Babel.
Which city was the Messiah crucified in?
Mystery Babylon represents a place as well as a woman. The woman was a Harlot who had committed fornication (spiritual). The Harlot was riding/directing the Beast. The Beast represents a government - the Roman Government at the time of Jesus Christ. The crucifixion of Christ was a joint effort between the Roman government and the Jewish Religious Leaders (High Priest et al). Mystery Babylon is a religious system. John is writing in coded language to conceal his message. The woman is apostate Israel with it's headquarters in Jerusalem.
Jerusalem was faithful in the beginning? That's not what I get out of the entire New Testament (or the Old for that matter). Israel was constantly backsliding. Jesus told the Jewish religious leaders that their "house" would be left to them desolate. The "house" was the Temple. That prophecy came to pass. Read Matthew chapter 23!
John is not speaking of Babylon in Iraq. He is speaking of the Jerusalem that existed in the 1st century which was destroyed by Roman General Titus in 70 A.D.
How would you explain
Isaiah 1:21
How is the faithful city become an harlot! it was full of judgment; righteousness lodged in it; but now murderers.
Jeremiah 2:2
Go and cry in the ears of Jerusalem, saying, Thus saith the LORD; I remember thee, the kindness of thy youth, the love of thine espousals, when thou wentest after me in the wilderness, in a land that was not sown.
The faithful city became a harlot. They committed spiritual adultery. They had filled up the cup of trembling. Therefore they were judged by God Almighty. They were supposed to be righteous but became murderers.
I believe Matt 23:37-38 helps answer that question: “Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were not willing. Look, your house is left to you desolate.".
**Where were the prophets killed? Where was Jesus the Messiah killed? Jerusalem! They became murderers. **
Does that mean Jerusalem (which represents a religious system led by ungodly leaders) was always unrighteous? Of course not - there were periods where Israel was in obedience. But by in large they were not!
I don't have time right now to really dig into this but at some point I'd like to if you're available. For now I'll just present a quick AI summary of each position (I hold to the latter):
The interpretation of the "woman who rides the beast" in the Book of Revelation has generated extensive debate over the centuries. Two prominent interpretations involve Jerusalem and the Catholic Church. Below are some of the strongest arguments for each position.
Arguments for Jerusalem as the Woman Who Rides the Beast
Historical Context: In the first century, Jerusalem was the center of Jewish life and worship. The city had a complex relationship with the ruling Roman Empire, which parallels the imagery of the beast as a representation of corrupt political power.
Symbolic Imagery: Jerusalem is often depicted as a woman in biblical texts. For example, in the Old Testament, cities are frequently personified as feminine figures. Revelation 21 contrasts the "New Jerusalem" with Babylon, suggesting a broader symbolism of Jerusalem representing both the faithful and, in its fall, the corrupt.
Rejection of Christ: Jerusalem is often associated with the rejection of Jesus, the Messiah. This rejection could be seen as embodying the "abominations" referenced in Revelation, specifically in light of the city's role in the crucifixion and persecution of early Christians.
Prophetic Literature: The prophetic literature of the Old Testament often depicts Jerusalem in a dual light—both as a place of future hope and as a city that has been judged. The judgment on Jerusalem by the Romans in 70 CE could be reflected in the imagery of the beast.
Link to Babylon: Revelation refers to the woman as "Babylon the Great," and some interpreters see this as a representation of Jerusalem, which had gone through cycles of faithfulness and unfaithfulness, particularly during the Second Temple period where political corruption and moral decline were rampant.
Arguments for the Catholic Church as the Woman Who Rides the Beast
Historical Identification: Throughout history, many Protestant reformers and theologians identified the Catholic Church with Babylon due to perceived corruption, the establishment of papal authority, and the alleged departure from original Christianity.
Political Power: The Catholic Church, particularly during the Middle Ages, wielded significant political power and influence, often partnering with and challenging secular authorities, which aligns with the image of a woman riding a beast (an alliance between church and state).
Symbolism of the Seven Hills: Revelation 17:9 mentions the woman sitting on seven hills. Rome, the seat of the Catholic Church, is famously known as the "City of Seven Hills," providing a geographical link to the interpretation.
Persecution of Saints: The Catholic Church, throughout its history, has been involved in the persecution of various groups, including other Christians (e.g., the Inquisition) and non-Christians. This aligns with the portrayal of the woman in Revelation as one who is drunk with the blood of the saints.
Maternal Imagery: The Catholic Church often uses maternal imagery in its theology (e.g., the Church as Mother). This parallels the woman in Revelation, who is presented as nurturing but also as an entity that can exploit and oppress, fitting with the notion of institutional corruption.