I also personally think EVs are fine versus gas cars, I don't totally understand the hate.
OK, I will tell ya why the hate. And for some of us, it is REAL HATE.
First, we don't like people DEMANDING we switch. Not saying you are doing that, but plenty of assholes out there are.
Second, when you are driving or riding in an EV, YOU ARE SITTING ON A HUGE BATTERY -- THAT EMITS EMF's. Probably not healthy for you, or your gonads.
Third, they use up WAY MORE ENERGY than gas cars. The coal plants produce the electricity that the car plugs into. Seems a lot of people don't "get" that the electricity AIN'T FREE. The combined air pollution to create the electricity is MORE than the combined air pollution of gas cars.
Fourth, the batteries only last a few years -- then they are EXPENSIVE to replace and the old ones GO INTO A LAND FILL THAT HARMS THE SOIL.
Fifth, they are much heavier than gas cars. The combined weight in a parking garage, if they are all EV's, could crumble the garage. The garages, roads, and infractructure would need major upgrades to support the heavier load.
Sixth, no practical way to pull into a station, "fill up" in 1 minute, and be on your way. Ya gotta wait ... HOURS.
Seventh, no long range usage, at least not yet and in practical form.
Eight, they are SUBSIDIZED BY YOUR TAX DOLLARS. You should not have to fund some other guy's wet dream, just because.
Ninth, they are made by SLAVE LABOR. Some of the necessary cobalt comes from Africa, where child slaves mine it.
Tenth, the mining of the lithium for the batteries DESTROYS THE ENVIRONMENT.
And one more time ... there are people out there DEMANDING WE SWITCH (did I mention that already?) ... and WE DON'T LIKE ULTIMATUMS.
Finally, the entire narrative of EV's is BUILT ON LIES. And that is what I hate the most.
I would demur on point two, since batteries do not produce oscillating electromagnetic fields.
But, I would replace it with the point that a lithium battery fire is perhaps the most energetic fire chemically possible, and is essentially impossible to extinguish. (The only known method is to smother it with molten metal. Have at it.) EVs in a parking garage are just a holocaust waiting to happen. An EV in your garage could burn down your house (and/or a neighbor's house). I am surprised that home insurance does not yet have an EV premium due to the increased hazard.
Your point seven is good without qualification. A conventional car with a 20-gallon tank and 25 mpg highway driving, can give you 500 miles between fill-ups. Even if an EV could drive 500 miles AND you could find a charging station, it takes you hours and hours to recharge, whereas 10 minutes at the gas pump and you are on your way. (As a humorous side note, I've seen a recent retrofit to a local Tesla charging lot, of what seems to be motor-generator sets.)
You don't list it as such, but I think the battery is a huge single-point failure node. If you run out of gas, you can walk a mile or so to a gas station. If the engine has a failure, you can get your vehicle towed to a repair shop. If an EV battery fails... I don't really know what you do at that point. A tow job to a parking lot? Trapped in a podunk town at a cockroach motel, on the phone trying to get tech support for your computerized rigor mortis automobile?
An interesting detailed list so thank you for the response, although I feel a lot of those objections have responses plus oil and gas problems are omitted
demanding we switch
gas vehicle users are often suggesting EV people switch too
EMFs
good point and interesting, although the emissions from vehicles also creates smog, leading to increased lung cancer risks
more energy and pollution
I think people would debate this, or might argue it's negligible anyway. I've actually seen EV people argue gas uses way more unused energy in burning gas - that would have generated much more electricity than EVs use. But, if EVs are using "renewable" energy anyway... it could use more energy but we'll get more energy from the sun or wind anyway. In contrast, gas has been thought to be limited and not renewable.
Also, there could be more pollution at the plant but it could be controlled and filtered with a heavier filter rather than the smaller filter of a gas car.
Batteries only last a few years
And gas is consumed and doesn't last at all. The point about them creating waste stands, although I thought they were working on ways to recycle the materials.
heavier
meh, we have trucks with heavy loads on road already, but possible point taken about garages possibly having to adapt
hours charging
well, for those who can charge at home, they just plug in and wait overnight. Although gas is definitely faster here, gas also requires dependency on a large complicated distribution network to get gas, whereas electricity could be produced at home "off grid" with like solar or wind.
no long range use
Yeah, although ranges keep increasing
Subsidized
Not really intrinsic to EVs, just to the current state of things; the tech itself has been around for a century
Slave labor
Also not intrinsic to EVs, just the labor practices around them
lithium mining is bad for environment
I imagine gas and oil are pretty bad too (also with things like oil spills)
So... I find a lot of these objections kind of don't stand, and then I imagine there are probably a lot of gas car objections not mentioned
Here's some AI generated reasons why people like EVs:
Cheaper operating costs: no spark plugs, oil changes, exhaust systems, and less brakes to replace with regenerative braking (which also contributes to a further range without more fuel)
Quieter and smoother ride (less noise pollution)
Refueling at home allows for a person to avoid a trip to gas station
More flexible in their energy inputs (Renewables, coal, natural gas, etc. can be converted to electricity)
Give independence from gas dependency (like, the whole Iran conflict is often being over gas with the Strait of Hormuz)
More durable (besides the batteries)
(I'll note one thing I don't like about current EVs is a lot of "smart tech" being integrated in to them, but that again is more an argument against current EV tech's implementation rather than intrinsic to EVs - a lot of those features are also being added to gas cars unfortunately)
A wind turbine requires more energy for building than it will create in its lifetime. Net negative from the start.
Add in the unreliable production, visual pollution, health issues created and turbines are a scheme that will go down in history as criminally negligent.
OK, I will tell ya why the hate. And for some of us, it is REAL HATE.
First, we don't like people DEMANDING we switch. Not saying you are doing that, but plenty of assholes out there are.
Second, when you are driving or riding in an EV, YOU ARE SITTING ON A HUGE BATTERY -- THAT EMITS EMF's. Probably not healthy for you, or your gonads.
Third, they use up WAY MORE ENERGY than gas cars. The coal plants produce the electricity that the car plugs into. Seems a lot of people don't "get" that the electricity AIN'T FREE. The combined air pollution to create the electricity is MORE than the combined air pollution of gas cars.
Fourth, the batteries only last a few years -- then they are EXPENSIVE to replace and the old ones GO INTO A LAND FILL THAT HARMS THE SOIL.
Fifth, they are much heavier than gas cars. The combined weight in a parking garage, if they are all EV's, could crumble the garage. The garages, roads, and infractructure would need major upgrades to support the heavier load.
Sixth, no practical way to pull into a station, "fill up" in 1 minute, and be on your way. Ya gotta wait ... HOURS.
Seventh, no long range usage, at least not yet and in practical form.
Eight, they are SUBSIDIZED BY YOUR TAX DOLLARS. You should not have to fund some other guy's wet dream, just because.
Ninth, they are made by SLAVE LABOR. Some of the necessary cobalt comes from Africa, where child slaves mine it.
Tenth, the mining of the lithium for the batteries DESTROYS THE ENVIRONMENT.
And one more time ... there are people out there DEMANDING WE SWITCH (did I mention that already?) ... and WE DON'T LIKE ULTIMATUMS.
Finally, the entire narrative of EV's is BUILT ON LIES. And that is what I hate the most.
I would demur on point two, since batteries do not produce oscillating electromagnetic fields.
But, I would replace it with the point that a lithium battery fire is perhaps the most energetic fire chemically possible, and is essentially impossible to extinguish. (The only known method is to smother it with molten metal. Have at it.) EVs in a parking garage are just a holocaust waiting to happen. An EV in your garage could burn down your house (and/or a neighbor's house). I am surprised that home insurance does not yet have an EV premium due to the increased hazard.
Your point seven is good without qualification. A conventional car with a 20-gallon tank and 25 mpg highway driving, can give you 500 miles between fill-ups. Even if an EV could drive 500 miles AND you could find a charging station, it takes you hours and hours to recharge, whereas 10 minutes at the gas pump and you are on your way. (As a humorous side note, I've seen a recent retrofit to a local Tesla charging lot, of what seems to be motor-generator sets.)
You don't list it as such, but I think the battery is a huge single-point failure node. If you run out of gas, you can walk a mile or so to a gas station. If the engine has a failure, you can get your vehicle towed to a repair shop. If an EV battery fails... I don't really know what you do at that point. A tow job to a parking lot? Trapped in a podunk town at a cockroach motel, on the phone trying to get tech support for your computerized rigor mortis automobile?
An interesting detailed list so thank you for the response, although I feel a lot of those objections have responses plus oil and gas problems are omitted
gas vehicle users are often suggesting EV people switch too
good point and interesting, although the emissions from vehicles also creates smog, leading to increased lung cancer risks
I think people would debate this, or might argue it's negligible anyway. I've actually seen EV people argue gas uses way more unused energy in burning gas - that would have generated much more electricity than EVs use. But, if EVs are using "renewable" energy anyway... it could use more energy but we'll get more energy from the sun or wind anyway. In contrast, gas has been thought to be limited and not renewable.
Also, there could be more pollution at the plant but it could be controlled and filtered with a heavier filter rather than the smaller filter of a gas car.
And gas is consumed and doesn't last at all. The point about them creating waste stands, although I thought they were working on ways to recycle the materials.
meh, we have trucks with heavy loads on road already, but possible point taken about garages possibly having to adapt
well, for those who can charge at home, they just plug in and wait overnight. Although gas is definitely faster here, gas also requires dependency on a large complicated distribution network to get gas, whereas electricity could be produced at home "off grid" with like solar or wind.
Yeah, although ranges keep increasing
Not really intrinsic to EVs, just to the current state of things; the tech itself has been around for a century
Also not intrinsic to EVs, just the labor practices around them
I imagine gas and oil are pretty bad too (also with things like oil spills)
So... I find a lot of these objections kind of don't stand, and then I imagine there are probably a lot of gas car objections not mentioned
Here's some AI generated reasons why people like EVs:
Cheaper operating costs: no spark plugs, oil changes, exhaust systems, and less brakes to replace with regenerative braking (which also contributes to a further range without more fuel)
Quieter and smoother ride (less noise pollution)
Refueling at home allows for a person to avoid a trip to gas station
More flexible in their energy inputs (Renewables, coal, natural gas, etc. can be converted to electricity)
Give independence from gas dependency (like, the whole Iran conflict is often being over gas with the Strait of Hormuz)
More durable (besides the batteries)
(I'll note one thing I don't like about current EVs is a lot of "smart tech" being integrated in to them, but that again is more an argument against current EV tech's implementation rather than intrinsic to EVs - a lot of those features are also being added to gas cars unfortunately)
You and I will just have to disagree.
I don't care what an AI computer -- programmed by someone with an agenda -- spits out on your computer screen.
I would like to address two things in your response:
No, we won't. That will NEVER happen.
And if you want to talk about taxpayer subsidies, these are REALLY bad.
There is no way to do these, economically, without MASSIVE taxpayer subsidies.
No, it is renewable.
Old oil wells are capped, and then 10 or 20 years later they discover it is full again.
Look up: Abiotic Petroleum Theory
It's just that we might use it up faster than it renews. Thus, we need to continue to improve efficiency.
Renewable?
A wind turbine requires more energy for building than it will create in its lifetime. Net negative from the start.
Add in the unreliable production, visual pollution, health issues created and turbines are a scheme that will go down in history as criminally negligent.