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123
VIDEO: Ukraine Troops SURRENDER en-masse; WHITE FLAGS on Tanks (July 30th) (halturnerradioshow.com) 🔍 Notable
posted 2 years ago by MuckeyDuck 2 years ago by MuckeyDuck +123 / -0
VIDEO: Ukraine Troops SURRENDER en-masse; WHITE FLAGS on Tanks
Hundreds of Ukrainian troops, displaying white flags on their tanks and infantry vehicles, surrendered en-masse to Russia today. More and more...
halturnerradioshow.com
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▲ 6 ▼
– MuckeyDuck [S] 6 points 2 years ago +6 / -0

Someone else made the claim that it was prisoner exchange. I ask them for proof, a dated story about it, and not gotten reply. Also look for myself, and can't find any thing that shows it was prisoner exchange. Does not mean it's not that, but why would you have surrender flags if it was prisoner exchange.

I can find no display of white flag ever being displayed during prison swap. I can find pictures of other swaps, but no white flag.

https://bloximages.newyork1.vip.townnews.com/santafenewmexican.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/5/55/5553a930-5437-5759-a8ee-20989644b5b3/549e12a41ce1b.image.jpg

https://www.timeturk.com/en/ukraine-russia-swap-prisoners-amid-ongoing-war/news-57355

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▲ 6 ▼
– HOSEQ 6 points 2 years ago +6 / -0

The Ukrainian Soldiers have been Surrendering to Russians for about three months now....

It started when the Ukrainians started their Open Draft, or Conscription of men on the streets....

It's a ""Sure, I'll take a rifle and go to the front"", but when they get there, they grab a radio and give up in groups....

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▲ 2 ▼
– Sadness 2 points 2 years ago +2 / -0

Agreed, but this video is not evidence of that. There are columns of people walking in both directions.

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▲ 1 ▼
– HOSEQ 1 point 2 years ago +1 / -0

Still, I see lots of white flags....

If you have Telegram App, you could reach out to someone like ""Intel Slava Z"", and ask about it....

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▲ 3 ▼
– DeathRayDesigner 3 points 2 years ago +3 / -0

A white flag is a flag of truce, not a flag of surrender. One side may invoke a truce in order to negotiate terms of surrender. A truce would also apply during a prisoner exchange.

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▲ 1 ▼
– MuckeyDuck [S] 1 point 2 years ago +1 / -0

I suppose if they were surrendering they would "throw in the towel", although it would have to be a fairly big towel to see it from any distance.

But on a serious note: If anything I am guilty of using terms loosely.

The idiom, "Raising the white flag", can have a inferred, accepted or popular meaning, and a legal meaning which according to the conclusion of link at bottom is in need of firm definition.

Some states explicitly recognize "Raising the White Flag" as a symbol of surrender, and some states do not.

France's Manual on the Law of Armed Conflict explains that ‘[a]n intention to surrender must be clearly expressed; by raising hands, throwing down weapons or waving a white flag’.

Dominican Republic's Military Manual accepts that once a white flag is waved this signals an intent to surrender.

The United States, for example, claims that ‘waving a white flag technically is not a sign of surrender, but signals a desire to negotiate and that ‘the hoisting of a white flag has no other legal meaning in the law of war’.

Canada's Code of Conduct states that ‘the showing of a white flag is not necessarily an expression of an intent to surrender’. The Teaching Manual for the armed forces of Côte d'Ivoire also explains that ‘the white flag is used to indicate the intention to negotiate and to protect the persons who negotiate. It does not necessarily indicate – as it is often believed – an intention to surrender’

International Humanitarian Law Databases ICRC (What we use to call Geneva Convention) Rule 58. Improper Use of the White Flag of Truce Definition Improper use refers to any use other than that for which the flag of truce was intended, namely a request to communicate, for example, in order to negotiate a cease-fire or to surrender.[13] Any other use, for example, to gain a military advantage over the enemy, is improper and unlawful.

Guidance on how a person expresses an intention to surrender is provided by the Official Commentary to Article 41(2) of Additional Protocol I:Footnote 99

In land warfare … a soldier who wishes to indicate that he is no longer capable of engaging in combat, or that he intends to cease combat, lays down his arms and raises his hands. Another way is to ceasefire, wave a white flag and emerge from a shelter with hands raised … If he is surprised, a combatant can raise his arms to indicate that he is surrendering, even though he may still be carrying weapons.

ICRC commentary to Rule 47 which, after citing ‘many military manuals’, explains that ‘[i]n land warfare, a clear intention to surrender is generally shown by laying down one's weapons and raising one's hands or by ‘displaying a white flag.

See Conclusion here.

I know this is TMI but what the hell.

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▲ 3 ▼
– Sadness 3 points 2 years ago +3 / -0

https://is2.4chan.org/pol/1690756815244975.jpg

From a thread on this very topic: https://boards.4chan.org/pol/thread/436336808/ukraine-troops-surrender-enmasse-white-flags-on

Just saying.

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▲ 1 ▼
– deleted 1 point 2 years ago +1 / -0
▲ 2 ▼
– b472113 2 points 2 years ago +2 / -0

FWIW this site says prisoner exchange. https://observers.france24.com/en/europe/20230731-debunked-ukrainian-soldiers-surrendering-en-masse-prisoner-exchange

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▲ 1 ▼
– MuckeyDuck [S] 1 point 2 years ago +1 / -0

I'll buy that, although I don't trust fact checking sites to tell the truth. In the video you link to it clearly show one line of people going on way, and the other opposite way.

A small error the Telegraph makes is to say a white flag typically represents a neutral area. I just read extensively about the meaning of a white flag in individual state military code and international code, and find no reference to it being used to represent a "neutral area."

https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/israel-law-review/article/rule-of-surrender-in-international-humanitarian-law/714B1EAB954811EB2907A046EA069504

https://ihl-databases.icrc.org/en/customary-ihl/v2/rule58

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