There is only one purpose for the 2nd Amendment, and it is not what 99% of you are saying.
The only purpose of the 2nd Amendment is 100% a reminder to government that it has no power over anything related to our right to bear arms, our right to own arms, our right to defend our property, our lives, our families, our communities, and our Constitutional Republic. It is a prohibition on ANY infringement on any of those things via legislation, or any other action, by government. It is also a reminder that they have no power over the militia's, and a warning that the militia's are a direct defense and response to government violating these prohibitions, or the prohibition over any of our other rights.
It was not written for us, it was written for government as a reminder of the limits of delegated power, and a warning as to the consequences of ignoring those warnings.
“The right of a citizen to bear arms, in lawful defense of himself or the State, is absolute. He does not derive it from the State government. It is one of the high powers delegated directly to the citizen, and is excepted out of the general powers of government. A law cannot be passed to infringe upon or impair it, because it is above the law, and independent of the lawmaking power.” ~ Cockrum v. State 24 Tex.394, at 401-402 (1859)
“Congress have no power to disarm the militia. Their swords, and every other terrible implement of the soldier, are the birth-right of an American ... the unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people.” ~ Tench Coxe (1755-1824) American political economist
“The militia of these free commonwealths, entitled and accustomed to their arms, when compared with any possible army, must be tremendous and irresistible. Who are the militia? Are they not ourselves? Is it feared, then, that we shall turn our arms each man against his own bosom. Congress have no power to disarm the militia. Their swords, and every other terrible implement of the soldier, are the birth-right of an American ... the unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people.” ~ Tench Coxe (1755-1824) American political economist Pennsylvania Gazette, February 20, 1788
“Let us recollect that peace or war will not always be left to our option; that however moderate or unambitious we may be, we cannot count upon the moderation, or hope to extinguish the ambition of others. ... The best we can hope for concerning the people at large is that they be properly armed.” ~ Alexander Hamilton (1757-1804) American statesman, Secretary of the Treasury Federalist No. 34, January 4, 1788
“A constitution defines and limits the powers of the government it creates. It therefore follows, as a natural and also a logical result, that the governmental exercise of any power not authorized by the constitution is an assumed power, and therefore illegal.” ~ Thomas Paine (1737-1809) US Founding father, pamphleteer, author
The 2nd was the shortest debate of all of the bill of rights. No vote was actually taken for its inclusion. It was what we today call a no-brainer. The only change made to the original text was to flip the 2 sentences. And to now make them one sentence. Only the modern liberal is unable to grasp the truth of it.
Agreed. However, the wording of the amendment clearly establishes that militia and the people are separate and the right is of the people to regulate, if necessary, the militia. IMO, Tench Coxe, seems to blend the two together.
The militia isn’t a separate force; it is the people, armed and trained. The Founders meant this literally, not figuratively. As George Mason plainly stated at the Virginia convention, the militia comprises “the whole people, except a few public officers.” The right to keep and bear arms belongs to the people as individuals, not just to those formally enrolled.
“It is always dangerous to the liberties of the people to have an army stationed among them, over which they have no control ... The Militia is composed of free Citizens. There is therefore no danger of their making use of their Power to the destruction of their own Rights, or suffering others to invade them.” ~ Samuel Adams (1722-1803), was known as the "Father of the American Revolution."
3 Samuel Adams, Writings 251 (Henry A. Cushing Ed., 1906).
“The right of a citizen to bear arms, in lawful defense of himself or the State, is absolute. He does not derive it from the State government. It is one of the high powers delegated directly to the citizen, and is excepted out of the general powers of government. A law cannot be passed to infringe upon or impair it, because it is above the law, and independent of the lawmaking power.” ~ Cockrum v. State
24 Tex.394, at 401-402 (1859)
“While the people have property, arms in their hands, and only a spark of noble spirit, the most corrupt Congress must be mad to form any project of tyranny.” ~ Rev. Nicholas Collin (1746-1831) Episcopal pastor, friend of Benjamin Franklin
Fayetteville Gazette (N.C.), October 12, 1789
“Congress have no power to disarm the militia. Their swords, and every other terrible implement of the soldier, are the birth-right of an American ... the unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people.” ~ Tench Coxe (1755-1824) American political economist
“The militia, who are in fact the effective part of the people at large, will render many troops quite unnecessary. They will form a powerful check upon the regular troops, and will generally be sufficient to over-awe them” ~ Tench Coxe (1755-1824) American political economist
An American Citizen IV, October 21, 1787
“What, Sir, is the use of a militia? It is to prevent the establishment of a standing army, the bane of liberty. ...Whenever Governments mean to invade the rights and liberties of the people, they always attempt to destroy the militia, in order to raise an army upon their ruins.” ~ Elbridge Gerry (1744-1814) of Massachusetts, Signer of the Declaration of Independence and Member of the Constitutional Convention
spoken during floor debate over the Second Amendment, I Annals of Congress at 750, August 17, 1789
“In recent years it has been suggested that the Second Amendment protects the "collective" right of states to maintain militias, while it does not protect the right of "the people" to keep and bear arms. If anyone entertained this notion in the period during which the Constitution and the Bill of Rights were debated and ratified, it remains one of the most closely guarded secrets of the eighteenth century, for no known writing surviving from the period between 1787 and 1791 states such a thesis.” ~ Steven P. Halbrook Attorney, author
That Every Man Be Armed: The Evolution Of A Constitutional Right, P. 83 (The Independence Institute 1984.).
“Let us recollect that peace or war will not always be left to our option; that however moderate or unambitious we may be, we cannot count upon the moderation, or hope to extinguish the ambition of others. ... The best we can hope for concerning the people at large is that they be properly armed.” ~ Alexander Hamilton (1757-1804) American statesman, Secretary of the Treasury
Federalist No. 34, January 4, 1788
“If the representatives of the people betray their constituents, there is then no recourse left but in the exertion of that original right of self-defense...” ~ Alexander Hamilton (1757-1804) American statesman, Secretary of the Treasury
The Federalist Papers, No. 28
“Have we the means of resisting disciplined armies, when our only defence, the militia, is put in the hands of Congress?” ~ Patrick Henry (1736-1799) US Founding Father
“For a people who are free, and who mean to remain so, a well organized and armed militia is their best security.” ~ Thomas Jefferson (1743-1826), US Founding Father, drafted the Declaration of Independence, 3rd US President
Eighth Annual Message, November 8, 1808
“What country can preserve its liberties, if its rulers are not warned from time to time that this people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms.” ~ Thomas Jefferson (1743-1826), US Founding Father, drafted the Declaration of Independence, 3rd US President
November 13, 1787, letter to William S. Smith, quoted in Padover's Jefferson On Democracy, ed., 1939
“The people are not to be disarmed of their weapons. They are left in full possession of them.” ~ Zachariah Johnson June 25, 1788, Virginia Constitutional Ratification Convention.
Debates in the Several State Conventions on the Adoption of the Federal
Constitution, Jonathan Elliot, ed., v.3 p.646 (Philadelphia, 1836)
“A militia, when properly formed, are in fact the people themselves...and include all men capable of bearing arms.” ~ Richard Henry Lee (1732-1794) Founding Father
Additional Letters from the Federal Framer (1788) at p. 169
“The highest number to which a standing army can be carried in any country does not exceed one hundredth part of the souls, or one twenty-fifth part of the number able to bear arms. This portion would not yield, in the United States, an army of more than twenty-five or thirty thousand men. To these would be opposed a militia amounting to near half a million citizens with arms in their hands, officered by men chosen from among themselves, fighting for their common liberties and united and conducted by governments possessing their affections and confidence. It may well be doubted whether a militia thus circumstanced could ever be conquered by such a proportion of regular troops. ... Besides the advantage of being armed, ... the existence of subordinate governments ... forms a barrier against the enterprises of ambition, more insurmountable than any which a simple government of any form can admit of. ... [The governments of Europe] are afraid to trust the people with arms. ... Let us not insult the free and gallant citizens of America with the suspicion that they would be less able to defend the rights of which they would be in actual possession than the debased subjects of arbitrary power would be to rescue theirs from the hands of their oppressors.” ~ James Madison (1751-1836), Father of the Constitution for the USA, 4th US President
The Federalist Papers, No. 46
“That the people have a Right to mass and to bear arms; that a well regulated militia composed of the Body of the people, trained to arms, is the proper natural and safe defense of a free State...” ~ George Mason (1725-1792), drafted the Virgina Declaration of Rights, ally of James Madison and George Washington
Within Mason's declaration of "the essential and unalienable Rights of the People," -- drafted by Thomas Jefferson, George Mason and others, and later adopted by the Virginia ratification convention, 1788
“Who are the militia, if they be not the people of this country...? I ask, who are the militia? They consist of now of the whole people, except a few public officers.” ~ George Mason (1725-1792), drafted the Virgina Declaration of Rights, ally of James Madison and George Washington
in the Virginia Convention on the ratification of the Constitution, June 16, 1788,
in_Debates in the Several State Conventions on the Adoption of the Federal Constitution,_
Jonathan Elliot, ed., v.3 p.425 (Philadelphia, 1836)
IMO, the militia is not separate, it IS OF the People. If not "of" then not well regulated. Militia and People are distinct, different things. The power, and the right, is of the people.
Agreed. Honestly your framing is the sharper one. Of the people, and distinct from the militia. That is exactly how the SCOTUS kept the right alive in Heller.
The Amendment protects the right of the people. The Court said the people means every member of the political community, the same people named in the First and Fourth Amendments. The militia clause gives the reason for the right. It does not hand the right only to whoever is enrolled. That's the whole point. If the right belonged to the militia as a body, then the other side gets to claim only the National Guard has it. That is the reading that lost in Heller, because the Court kept the people who hold the right separate from the militia that's the stated purpose.
So, the militia is drawn from the whole body of the people. That's why an armed citizenry is the check on tyranny the founders trusted over a standing army. The right itself belongs to the people as individuals, not rationed out to the ones currently enrolled.
The practical meaning of the 2nd Amendment was quite broad during the founding of the country. It embraced fieldpieces (in the Concord MA militia armory) and ships of war. When the Constitution authorizes Letters of Marque and Reprisal, to whom do you think they were issuing these letters? Private ship owners (privateers). The armed ship was probably the most dangerous "weapon system" of the day, as it could sail into a harbor and conduct a cannonade of the entire settlement.
There is an argument that, based on the early use of fieldpieces, any form of crew-served weapon should be allowed for militia purposes. The situation with weapon systems is a bit more complicated, as it involves interoperability with national forces and secure control over classified elements of the systems.
"Our technologies permit us to manipulate time and space" -- Michael Kratsios, Director of the White House Office of Science and Technology Policy
I'm not entirely sure I want my former neighbor down the street (who is a legitimate psychopath and murderer) to "own weapons sufficient to rival our current military".
I have a lot of thoughts on Sovereignty and how it might apply to a reasonable government (specifically 2A), but I don't think Nuclear Weapons, DEWs, other WMDs, Black Hole (or wormhole/time) Machines, or only God knows what, should be available for purchase to every Tom, Dick, and Harry with PTSD and a penchant for being an angry drunk.
Relax. Complex military systems are owned from the outset by the government by contractual stipulation. Civilian sales are either prohibited outright, or require government approval (as with sales to foreign governments). In some cases, civilian production of government-pattern firearms is permitted (e.g., M1911 pistols) and purchase of field clothing or equipment.
Stick to the point. It is obvious that Every communist 'ruling' Gov. in history has disarmed the citizen, so they Can Rule. ANY and All 'gov. officials' that would commit treason and ignore The 2nd is clearly a 'communist'.
I suggest I couldn't have been more on point. You are attempting to distract from the absolute conclusions of 2A as framed or (legally) imagined after Disclosure (probably within the next few weeks).
Yes, disarming humanity is not the path and has been used for great evil. Everyone knows that. Maybe it was something to talk about 5 years ago, but it hardly even needs to be stated at this point. It's more like kicking a dead horse, at least in America. But 2A as stated is not the path, and that DOES need to be addressed.
You only need to look at the current 'communist' Govs. of the EU. Aus. NZ. etc. to see what will always happen when the citizens can not say NO!
There is only one purpose for the 2nd Amendment, and it is not what 99% of you are saying.
The only purpose of the 2nd Amendment is 100% a reminder to government that it has no power over anything related to our right to bear arms, our right to own arms, our right to defend our property, our lives, our families, our communities, and our Constitutional Republic. It is a prohibition on ANY infringement on any of those things via legislation, or any other action, by government. It is also a reminder that they have no power over the militia's, and a warning that the militia's are a direct defense and response to government violating these prohibitions, or the prohibition over any of our other rights.
It was not written for us, it was written for government as a reminder of the limits of delegated power, and a warning as to the consequences of ignoring those warnings.
“The right of a citizen to bear arms, in lawful defense of himself or the State, is absolute. He does not derive it from the State government. It is one of the high powers delegated directly to the citizen, and is excepted out of the general powers of government. A law cannot be passed to infringe upon or impair it, because it is above the law, and independent of the lawmaking power.” ~ Cockrum v. State 24 Tex.394, at 401-402 (1859)
“Congress have no power to disarm the militia. Their swords, and every other terrible implement of the soldier, are the birth-right of an American ... the unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people.” ~ Tench Coxe (1755-1824) American political economist
“The militia of these free commonwealths, entitled and accustomed to their arms, when compared with any possible army, must be tremendous and irresistible. Who are the militia? Are they not ourselves? Is it feared, then, that we shall turn our arms each man against his own bosom. Congress have no power to disarm the militia. Their swords, and every other terrible implement of the soldier, are the birth-right of an American ... the unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people.” ~ Tench Coxe (1755-1824) American political economist Pennsylvania Gazette, February 20, 1788
“Let us recollect that peace or war will not always be left to our option; that however moderate or unambitious we may be, we cannot count upon the moderation, or hope to extinguish the ambition of others. ... The best we can hope for concerning the people at large is that they be properly armed.” ~ Alexander Hamilton (1757-1804) American statesman, Secretary of the Treasury Federalist No. 34, January 4, 1788
“A constitution defines and limits the powers of the government it creates. It therefore follows, as a natural and also a logical result, that the governmental exercise of any power not authorized by the constitution is an assumed power, and therefore illegal.” ~ Thomas Paine (1737-1809) US Founding father, pamphleteer, author
Who do you think would ultimately be that reminder, then? It specifically says in the 2nd A. that We, The People hold those rights.
Just a bit of trivia.
The 2nd was the shortest debate of all of the bill of rights. No vote was actually taken for its inclusion. It was what we today call a no-brainer. The only change made to the original text was to flip the 2 sentences. And to now make them one sentence. Only the modern liberal is unable to grasp the truth of it.
Instant agreement, no vote taken. Easy Peezy.
Agreed. However, the wording of the amendment clearly establishes that militia and the people are separate and the right is of the people to regulate, if necessary, the militia. IMO, Tench Coxe, seems to blend the two together.
The militia isn’t a separate force; it is the people, armed and trained. The Founders meant this literally, not figuratively. As George Mason plainly stated at the Virginia convention, the militia comprises “the whole people, except a few public officers.” The right to keep and bear arms belongs to the people as individuals, not just to those formally enrolled.
“It is always dangerous to the liberties of the people to have an army stationed among them, over which they have no control ... The Militia is composed of free Citizens. There is therefore no danger of their making use of their Power to the destruction of their own Rights, or suffering others to invade them.” ~ Samuel Adams (1722-1803), was known as the "Father of the American Revolution." 3 Samuel Adams, Writings 251 (Henry A. Cushing Ed., 1906).
“The right of a citizen to bear arms, in lawful defense of himself or the State, is absolute. He does not derive it from the State government. It is one of the high powers delegated directly to the citizen, and is excepted out of the general powers of government. A law cannot be passed to infringe upon or impair it, because it is above the law, and independent of the lawmaking power.” ~ Cockrum v. State 24 Tex.394, at 401-402 (1859)
“While the people have property, arms in their hands, and only a spark of noble spirit, the most corrupt Congress must be mad to form any project of tyranny.” ~ Rev. Nicholas Collin (1746-1831) Episcopal pastor, friend of Benjamin Franklin Fayetteville Gazette (N.C.), October 12, 1789
“Congress have no power to disarm the militia. Their swords, and every other terrible implement of the soldier, are the birth-right of an American ... the unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people.” ~ Tench Coxe (1755-1824) American political economist
“The militia, who are in fact the effective part of the people at large, will render many troops quite unnecessary. They will form a powerful check upon the regular troops, and will generally be sufficient to over-awe them” ~ Tench Coxe (1755-1824) American political economist An American Citizen IV, October 21, 1787
“What, Sir, is the use of a militia? It is to prevent the establishment of a standing army, the bane of liberty. ...Whenever Governments mean to invade the rights and liberties of the people, they always attempt to destroy the militia, in order to raise an army upon their ruins.” ~ Elbridge Gerry (1744-1814) of Massachusetts, Signer of the Declaration of Independence and Member of the Constitutional Convention spoken during floor debate over the Second Amendment, I Annals of Congress at 750, August 17, 1789
“In recent years it has been suggested that the Second Amendment protects the "collective" right of states to maintain militias, while it does not protect the right of "the people" to keep and bear arms. If anyone entertained this notion in the period during which the Constitution and the Bill of Rights were debated and ratified, it remains one of the most closely guarded secrets of the eighteenth century, for no known writing surviving from the period between 1787 and 1791 states such a thesis.” ~ Steven P. Halbrook Attorney, author That Every Man Be Armed: The Evolution Of A Constitutional Right, P. 83 (The Independence Institute 1984.).
“Let us recollect that peace or war will not always be left to our option; that however moderate or unambitious we may be, we cannot count upon the moderation, or hope to extinguish the ambition of others. ... The best we can hope for concerning the people at large is that they be properly armed.” ~ Alexander Hamilton (1757-1804) American statesman, Secretary of the Treasury Federalist No. 34, January 4, 1788
“If the representatives of the people betray their constituents, there is then no recourse left but in the exertion of that original right of self-defense...” ~ Alexander Hamilton (1757-1804) American statesman, Secretary of the Treasury The Federalist Papers, No. 28
“Have we the means of resisting disciplined armies, when our only defence, the militia, is put in the hands of Congress?” ~ Patrick Henry (1736-1799) US Founding Father
“For a people who are free, and who mean to remain so, a well organized and armed militia is their best security.” ~ Thomas Jefferson (1743-1826), US Founding Father, drafted the Declaration of Independence, 3rd US President Eighth Annual Message, November 8, 1808
“What country can preserve its liberties, if its rulers are not warned from time to time that this people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms.” ~ Thomas Jefferson (1743-1826), US Founding Father, drafted the Declaration of Independence, 3rd US President November 13, 1787, letter to William S. Smith, quoted in Padover's Jefferson On Democracy, ed., 1939
“The people are not to be disarmed of their weapons. They are left in full possession of them.” ~ Zachariah Johnson June 25, 1788, Virginia Constitutional Ratification Convention. Debates in the Several State Conventions on the Adoption of the Federal Constitution, Jonathan Elliot, ed., v.3 p.646 (Philadelphia, 1836)
“A militia, when properly formed, are in fact the people themselves...and include all men capable of bearing arms.” ~ Richard Henry Lee (1732-1794) Founding Father Additional Letters from the Federal Framer (1788) at p. 169
“The highest number to which a standing army can be carried in any country does not exceed one hundredth part of the souls, or one twenty-fifth part of the number able to bear arms. This portion would not yield, in the United States, an army of more than twenty-five or thirty thousand men. To these would be opposed a militia amounting to near half a million citizens with arms in their hands, officered by men chosen from among themselves, fighting for their common liberties and united and conducted by governments possessing their affections and confidence. It may well be doubted whether a militia thus circumstanced could ever be conquered by such a proportion of regular troops. ... Besides the advantage of being armed, ... the existence of subordinate governments ... forms a barrier against the enterprises of ambition, more insurmountable than any which a simple government of any form can admit of. ... [The governments of Europe] are afraid to trust the people with arms. ... Let us not insult the free and gallant citizens of America with the suspicion that they would be less able to defend the rights of which they would be in actual possession than the debased subjects of arbitrary power would be to rescue theirs from the hands of their oppressors.” ~ James Madison (1751-1836), Father of the Constitution for the USA, 4th US President The Federalist Papers, No. 46
“That the people have a Right to mass and to bear arms; that a well regulated militia composed of the Body of the people, trained to arms, is the proper natural and safe defense of a free State...” ~ George Mason (1725-1792), drafted the Virgina Declaration of Rights, ally of James Madison and George Washington Within Mason's declaration of "the essential and unalienable Rights of the People," -- drafted by Thomas Jefferson, George Mason and others, and later adopted by the Virginia ratification convention, 1788
“Who are the militia, if they be not the people of this country...? I ask, who are the militia? They consist of now of the whole people, except a few public officers.” ~ George Mason (1725-1792), drafted the Virgina Declaration of Rights, ally of James Madison and George Washington in the Virginia Convention on the ratification of the Constitution, June 16, 1788, in_Debates in the Several State Conventions on the Adoption of the Federal Constitution,_ Jonathan Elliot, ed., v.3 p.425 (Philadelphia, 1836)
"The militia is not separate, it IS the People."
IMO, the militia is not separate, it IS OF the People. If not "of" then not well regulated. Militia and People are distinct, different things. The power, and the right, is of the people.
Agreed. Honestly your framing is the sharper one. Of the people, and distinct from the militia. That is exactly how the SCOTUS kept the right alive in Heller.
The Amendment protects the right of the people. The Court said the people means every member of the political community, the same people named in the First and Fourth Amendments. The militia clause gives the reason for the right. It does not hand the right only to whoever is enrolled. That's the whole point. If the right belonged to the militia as a body, then the other side gets to claim only the National Guard has it. That is the reading that lost in Heller, because the Court kept the people who hold the right separate from the militia that's the stated purpose.
So, the militia is drawn from the whole body of the people. That's why an armed citizenry is the check on tyranny the founders trusted over a standing army. The right itself belongs to the people as individuals, not rationed out to the ones currently enrolled.
Oh, to be a pamphleteer.
The practical meaning of the 2nd Amendment was quite broad during the founding of the country. It embraced fieldpieces (in the Concord MA militia armory) and ships of war. When the Constitution authorizes Letters of Marque and Reprisal, to whom do you think they were issuing these letters? Private ship owners (privateers). The armed ship was probably the most dangerous "weapon system" of the day, as it could sail into a harbor and conduct a cannonade of the entire settlement.
There is an argument that, based on the early use of fieldpieces, any form of crew-served weapon should be allowed for militia purposes. The situation with weapon systems is a bit more complicated, as it involves interoperability with national forces and secure control over classified elements of the systems.
nice 2A meme artwork!
The only problem nowadays is the only people who can afford weapons to rival the government are psychopathic billionaires.
It also only applied when the USA was a pure ethno-state
The musket was a weapon of war in 1776. The founding fathers knew that when they wrote our Constitution.
So in theory, machine guns were outlawed by un-Constitutional laws and regulations.
I'm not entirely sure I want my former neighbor down the street (who is a legitimate psychopath and murderer) to "own weapons sufficient to rival our current military".
I have a lot of thoughts on Sovereignty and how it might apply to a reasonable government (specifically 2A), but I don't think Nuclear Weapons, DEWs, other WMDs, Black Hole (or wormhole/time) Machines, or only God knows what, should be available for purchase to every Tom, Dick, and Harry with PTSD and a penchant for being an angry drunk.
Relax. Complex military systems are owned from the outset by the government by contractual stipulation. Civilian sales are either prohibited outright, or require government approval (as with sales to foreign governments). In some cases, civilian production of government-pattern firearms is permitted (e.g., M1911 pistols) and purchase of field clothing or equipment.
Stick to the point. It is obvious that Every communist 'ruling' Gov. in history has disarmed the citizen, so they Can Rule. ANY and All 'gov. officials' that would commit treason and ignore The 2nd is clearly a 'communist'.
I suggest I couldn't have been more on point. You are attempting to distract from the absolute conclusions of 2A as framed or (legally) imagined after Disclosure (probably within the next few weeks).
Yes, disarming humanity is not the path and has been used for great evil. Everyone knows that. Maybe it was something to talk about 5 years ago, but it hardly even needs to be stated at this point. It's more like kicking a dead horse, at least in America. But 2A as stated is not the path, and that DOES need to be addressed.