What would Jesus do?
(www.theamericanconservative.com)
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It is true that the RCC, via the Jesuit Order, infiltrated Freemasonry, which at the time did not appear to be a nefarious group, though a Christian could likely call it harmful to faith in Christ. Regardless of that, the man who started the Illuminati was trained by the Jesuits and was a professor at Canon Law. The Illuminati started in 1776, right as America's government was being formed. They soon infiltrated America through the masonic lodges. You now had a parallel, and nefarious side of Freemasonry doing all it could to make sure America's sovereign growth was stifled, undermining it at every turn. And now history is a blur; one can't help but presume malice on the part of our Founders due to them being a part of the now tarnished 'Freemasonry'.
As to the 'good God / evil God' thing, that's called Marcionism. It is a false teaching promulgated by people who haven't had the holy Spirit open the eyes of their understanding, and so they cannot read the Old Testament properly. Give me a verse you have a problem with in the Old Testament and I'll show you why it's there. Jesus wasn't calling YHWH the devil, he was telling the Scribes and Pharisees that they did not know YHWH (even though they knew about YHWH) and that they were in fact children of the devil, not of YHWH like they presumed.
In the Hebrew mind, being a child of someone doesn't only mean you're descended from them, but also that you take after their character. What Jesus was saying was that they did not take after the character of YHWH.
YHWH is not an evil God. YHWH punishes evil and delights in what is right and good.
u/AmateurExpert or u/LateToTheShow might have more thoughts on this
...one can't help but presume malice on the part of our Founders due to them being a part of the now tarnished 'Freemasonry'. - What's your opinion of their documents then? Specifically the Constitution, how do you square that?
I strongly disagree, Jesus says "You belong to your father, the devil", nothing about Scribes or Pharisees in John 8, what version of the Bible are you using? Where do you read that he is speaking to Scribes and Pharisees? Yhwh is the Jews Father, Whom Jesus calls the Devil.
I think Q even hinted at this:
QPost #998
The "Chair" serves the Master.
Who is the Master?
P = C.
Q
QPost #290
[Thor]
Thor being a Norse God points us to the Rune.
P = The Rune P
P = Thor (Thunraz)
C = The Rune C
C = Ulcer = a moral blemish or corrupting influence
Confirms Thor is "The Master"
Thor = Indra / Zeus / Yahweh (all Storm/Rain Gods, all the same God)
The God of the Winged Wheel Coin confirms Yhwh is the same as Zeus.
1000000% false.
Marcionism is a definite heresy, and I don’t throw that word around lightly. There are plenty of sketchy doctrines that can be overlooked, but that’s not one of them.
Among the many questions you’re bypassing to make that claim - and I’m not going to bring up everything I could:
I’m not going to tell you more than that because in your current state, you would just trample it, but I assure you, there are few things that I will assert that I know with 100% certainty, and it is that Yeshua came in accordance with YHWH’s Will, which is good.
However you came to this conclusion, you should look at it again with fresh eyes. If YHWH is false, Jesus is false, and Christianity is false. You cannot remove the foundation and still have the building. YHWH’s character is not false. Yeshua’s character is not false. Lots of “Christian” doctrine is false. Go back to the scriptures and re-examine your foundational principles and understandings.
u/winn
Its originally a Gnostic concept, not Marcionism, Its arguable weather Marcion was a Gnostic or not. Marcion believed Jesus was not human, I do and so do the Gnostics. I lean toward Gnosticism.
I can't take anyone's argument seriously when they label something as heresy. Its a close minded. Orthodoxy believe that the Christian Faith and the Church are inseparable. It is impossible to know Christ, to share in the life of the Holy Trinity, or to be considered a Christian, apart from the Church. It is in the Church that the Christian Faith is proclaimed and maintained. I can't think of a better way to stifle free thought and control religious freedom than to subscribe to Orthodoxy and fear being called a Heretic, go use your Fear based rhetoric somewhere else. It carries no meaning for my scholarly pursuits. Your a sheep, being lead to slaughter by your shepherd. [Q Post #290/#998]
Moses also followed YHWH (“I Am, that I Am”)
So. He follows a god that is so deceitful he won't give us his real name? If you know a Demon's name you can control them and cast them out. [Mark:5-9-10]
Who, specifically was Jesus speaking to?
His Father. I could ask you the same question, because no where in the New Testament does it refer to Yhwh by name, unlike the Old Testament. All we know is he is speaking to his father.
Who were they?
See above.
How would Jesus have denounced his own house?
I take it you mean Why not How. I'll take House to mean the Jews in general and not Judah and to go against Yhwh and his laws. Mathew 12:9-14, John 8:1-11, Mark 7:19, ect, ect.
Whose character had they adopted? (They were already far from written Torah practice)
Can you clarify? I have no clue to what you're referring.
I'll take that you mean by my current state as awakened to the false teachings of the R.C.C. that high jacked Christianity and metastasized throughout all Christian based Churches and their doctrine. You are on a Q board you should know this, unless you are just here to preach fire and brimstone and virtue signal as I suspect. You should know that 10000000000000000000000000000000000000% of Churches are compromised through NGO's from this Q board.
And by trample you mean, I would totally crush your Orthodoxy arguments.
Honestly, this statement set the tone for my entire reply. Not very Christian of you. You Fraud. And on Easter none the less. Typical.
Prove it. 100% Bullshit if you can't prove it. I really don't care what you believe you lost all credibility with me as soon as you said Heresy. You are "Fire and Brimstone", preaching fear
That's False.
You sure as hell can.
How about NO!
How about we just let people believe what they want to, instead of force feeding them your regurgitated points of view. How about we admit that no one knows a 10000000000000000000000000% if God exists. How about we just have a friendly debate to find the holes in our own augments and respect other beliefs, but I think thats to much to ask from an Orthodox Christian who thinks he has a mission to proselytize and convert everyone into a free-thinkers nightmare.
I believe in most of Jesus' teachings, weather from the Bible or Gnostic texts, is that not enough for you, I need to agree with your Orthodoxy 100000000000000000%, you'd make a great democrat, why don't you go back and re-examine your foundational principles and understandings. The R.C.C. would love to have you become a democrat to complete your orthodoxy. Idiot.
First time I’ve ever been called orthodox… maybe in my life. I am neither, RCC, nor Orthodox, nor do I claim a Protestant Denomination.
For now…
… I’ll grant you that it was (unintentionally, though I should have realized it) rude. So, apologies for that, though I’m entering into “God is a demon” as a starting point, and I’ve never had a good conversation with a gnostic/Marcion on this subject, which colored my response as well (not your fault, obviously). Will try to address the rest later.
While I was rude, by the same note you applied to me… you did move on to do exactly what I said, which isn’t precisely the best way to prove that it wouldn’t happen…
Not that it justifies my entering the discussion on a preconceived wrong foot, which is to say, a reboot is probably justified and in order for any continuance.
And you have just received an apology on the internet.
No, he was not speaking to "Jews" at large. He was speaking to Jews who thought that descent from Abraham was all they needed to be sons of God. Jesus was pointing out that being so depended on whether they heeded the Word of God, not whether they were descendants of Abraham. And if they did not heed the Word of God, they were children of the devil.
I believe God, in His divine purposes on the earth, inspired the Constitution, through and despite imperfect men.
You need to go back to the beginning of John 8. Look at verse 3 and verse 13 specifically to understand Jesus' audience during this passage. Verse 44 isn't a stand-alone passage, it has a ton of context.
As to all that rune stuff I think you're going into absurdity. Afaik the P and C posts were related to the Vatican and the pope.
If you really think Jesus was calling the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob the devil, you need to do some serious research and reading the OT. The NT is literally laced with OT references and Jesus Himself made a ton of them. What He was saying to those Pharisees could be summed up like this:
"You say you're the children of YHWH, but you're actually the children of the devil"
I’ve read claims that something like 75% of the NT is either alluding to or direct copy/paste of the OT, including Revelation.
The Gospels for certain are highly referenced.
Let me preface this by saying, You're a good debater. I'm not trying to change your beliefs or trying to get you to think a certain way, Im merely trying to strengthen my arguments and theories, to find the "holes". Much Respect, your knowledge has helped. I'm interested to know your denomination.
Also, my last reply was somewhat incomplete in addressing someof the points you made. It was late and Gutfeld was coming on so I fired off the reply to quickly. I will address those now.
I would consider my views more Gnostic than Marcionism, the differences being Marcionism denies the human nature of Jesus (docetic), and base their theology on The Letters of Paul, where as the Gnostics base their theology on secret knowledge. There is much debate on weather Maricon was a Gnostic or not.
I believe that if you study the Bible it will eventually reveal its secretes to you, "Seek and you shall find." I truly believe it is divinely inspired and will reveal to any individual the answers they need/require. This is why Im opposed to organized religion, I don't feel they encourage individual thought or individual study of the Bible, at least the churches I've known.
If you claim to not trust the Pharisees and the Scribes does this mean you also do not trust Paul's writings, a Pharisee?
Do you lean more towards the Sadducees? If so, I would assume you favor the Septuagint over the Masoretic Texts, the Sadducees being more Hellenistic. I would agree, I use the Septuagint for studying the Bible.
In the Septuagint Micah 6:8 is translated as
Has it [not] been told thee, O man, what [is] good? or what does the Lord require of thee, but to do justice, and love mercy, and be ready to walk with the Lord thy God?
The Greek word ἀνηγγέλη is translated as to mock, or to be laughed at NOT told as the Masoretic states, so I translate it as
You are being Mocked, The beautiful man who says, "The Lord (Yhwh) seeks to disable you" Indeed, Otherwise why bring about judgement, and destroy love and compassion. Be ready to find the Lord God in the midst of yourself.
I can show you my complete translation if interested.
I am fully against the "fire and brimstone" type of rhetoric, I wrestle with God and I think that he approves, I believe we are here to learn good from evil and to question everything not just swallow what we are given mindlessly.
You are correct that I didn't go back to verse 1, I went back to verse 31, the last place it stated to whom Jesus was speaking. The last place he was speaking to the Pharisees was 13. Besides I believe they all claim the same father, they all claim to be Jews as far as I know their conflict was with purity laws, not what God they worshiped.
Q #290 does show a picture of Thor below the Pope and a Bishop, I don't think its that absurd to use the Norse runes, if he's showing a picture of a Norse God.
And the God of the Winged Wheel God coin validates the ancients saw Zeus and Yhwh as the same God.
Q states that the Chair severs the Master, well I can tell you the R.C.C. is not serving the same Loving God as I try to, for sure and I think Q is saying the same thing and is showing us that Thor is who the R.C.C. is serving. Why else show a picture of Thor below the Pope?
I study every religion, nothing is off the table. I think they are all telling the same story from different viewpoints.
You as well fren. This has been pleasantly surprising. I typically encounter the more 'rabid' style of debaters. Kek. I have to remind myself that not everyone is coming with caustics so to see this go into the "See more comments" zone without any mud-slinging refreshes my soul! You also know your stuff and I've learned a lot just by our few interactions here!
I 100% agree with that. The only organized religion I think God established was OT Israel, and that was more than a religion, it was a theocracy. I think God set that up only as a stop-gap emergency measure to ensure that a faith-possessing bloodline was preserved just long enough to send the Messiah through (David's bloodline via Mary). Mankind was so corrupted and devoid of faith that at the flood there was only 1 family---only 8 people worthy of saving, and they too had issues develop later on. God even had to shorten mankind' lifespan because the longer we lived, the more wicked we became. Needless to say every post-Christ religion or theocracy turns into a vile hub of falsehood and wickedness. Whether it be Sharia Law Islamic states or the Roman Catholic empire, the abuses and absurdities abound to laughable levels. I believe Christ completed that arc in our history and that any attempt to revive such systems is doomed.
Paul was a Pharisee who believed, so I believe him. I think the Bible refers to "scribes and Pharisees" so often because it was members of those two groups (ie. the most studied in the Hebrew religion---think "seeing they cannot see", "blinded the eyes of their understanding", etc., the punishment for / consequence of Israel's stubbornness. {Verses 9-10}) who had the hardest time believing in Jesus. Even Paul was on a crusade against Jesus' followers before he was radically born again.
Here is Micah 6:8 from another english LXX. I've run "εἰ ἀνηγγέλη σοι, ἄνθρωπε, τί καλόν; ἢ τί Κύριος ἐκζητεῖ παρὰ σοῦ ἀλλ᾿ ἢ τοῦ ποιεῖν κρίμα καὶ ἀγαπᾶν ἔλεον καὶ ἕτοιμον εἶναι τοῦ πορεύεσθαι μετὰ Κυρίου Θεοῦ σου" through two different translators and both times it comes out basically as it does in the KJV. I'm not sure where you're getting such an inverted translation.
I've also wrestled with eternal torment and have come to conclude that the doctrine was eisegeted by the Catholic church to control people and is not what the Scriptures actually say. If anything I lean toward Anihillationism mixed with a bit of reincarnation / do-over, though I wouldn't dare debate that point since the Scriptures mention nothing of the sort. I'm a silly sorta' sola-scriptura Saint 😂
I agree we're here to learn how to live. I liken life on earth to 'school for eternity'.
Here in John 8 verse 31, (picking up from verse 30), Jesus is speaking to the Jews who believed on him. Then, in verse 33, either:
the subjects of verse 13,
or:
some of their adherents
rudely interject with more debate. It is not logical that Jesus would accuse the Jews who believed on him of seeking to kill him (v37). He is pivoting back to the Pharisees (or to the Jews who side with them) who interjected, and they resume debating Jesus in verse 39, continuing all the way to the end of the chapter, encompassing verse 44. The believing Jews did not speak at all during this. The discourse was between Jesus and the unbelievers. If these debators had been true children of YHWH they would have believed in the One YHWH sent to them. This is mentioned elsewhere in the Gospels iirc.
Indeed, hence verse 41-44. An interesting side-note: it is reported by 1st century Jewish sources (I think, could be wrong on the date) that there was a rumor going around that Mary was a whore, since she had not yet slept with her husband while pregnant with Jesus.
Paul later further exposits the difference between being a physical descendent of Abraham vs. being a spiritual descendent in Rom. 9:6-8 and Gal. 3:26-29.
Jesus refers to YHWH all throughout the Gospels. Let's take one NT example. In Matt. 22:31-32 Jesus Quotes Ex. 3:6.
(I'm not Sadd-u-see :p)
Examining Ex. 3 a bit more closely (I'll be swapping a few 'Christianity buzzwords' with their definitions for this):
This article gets into the nuances of the various words used for God in the OT. Michael Heiser adds interesting clarity to the apparent plurality of God in his 'Divine Council' works. I haven't studied them extensively, but the TLDR is that YHWH has a group of lesser supernatural beings around Him who offer inputs, do His bidding and keep Him company! Pretty cool stuff.
The OT is a journey of man learning who God actually is, amidst a slew of false gods and superstitions. It is a story of God systematically, and many times harshly, re-revealing Himself to man after the fall in Eden, the flood, and the tower of Babel (where confusion and myths of those false gods originated from). Man is wired to know God; however God had to distance Himself from sinful man because we would immediately die if approached by God while in sin, for sin cannot exist in God's presence. We were thoroughly infected with a cancer; God's presence is like the ultimate chemo radiation all at once. Thus, we had the complex temple worship and ritual, etc. But our Perfect Messiah fulfilled all that, so now we can reunite with Almighty God through faith in Him. Jesus literally shields us from destruction from the presence of God. See Ex. 20:19
and 33:20
On to Thor!
I think they serve a myraid of false gods. Saturn, Jupiter, Isis Horus Set, et cet. Kek. Rome was known for that, like their predecessor Greece. Mystery Babylon the Great is always consuming her predecessors though we're at the Final Boss.
Here is the bread that Q post was made in https://archive.ph/Zou4w
Anons pointed out that the painting of Thor had a Swastika in it and that the painting had become an icon for Nazis (post No. 50843 in above archive). In the very next post (291) Q highlighted anon's post about Chelsea Clinton. I am reminded of her upside-down cross necklace. Back to 290, the pope is seen in a chair featuring an upside-down cross. Furthermore in drop 936 (and others though I forget their number), Q appears to align the Catholic church with Hitler's Nazi Germany. To me it seems Q is linking the Clintons, the Vatican, and the Nazis together. To what end I haven't delved much into.
We're also told 'double-meanings exist' so I take that Thor drop to signify 'bringing down the hammer on cabal giants', as Thor was known to slay giants. The Catholic church is the oldest, biggest 'giant' on planet earth today!
I still think the runes angle is a stretch. BUT I will not wholly disregard it. Can you give me a short summary of what you take those posts to be saying? Surely it's more than "the RCC worships Thor and Zeus, YHWH is Zeus". What are the practical ramifications of that train of thought? Where would I go from there? I've never heard that interpretation of those drops so I'm interested where they lead.
I don't think it exists 😬