years ago i heard my pastor describe meekness as the huge workhorse who has loads of strength but is tethered by a small strap of leather.
The strong who show control will inherit the earth
I agree with this outlook. A person who is weak can not be "meek" any more than a person with literally no fear can be "brave". Meekness requires being able to -not- be meek. A toddler is not meek, but a good parent sure has to be.
Probably done on purpose to get Christians to become meek and submissive. Same way they tried to turn Christians into pacifists so they wouldn't dare fight back when necessary.
Even a lot of our religions have been manipulated and twisted for a very long time as [they] use them as a mechanism to change and control the populations.
It’s the other way around- Satan changes the meaning of the word ‘meek’ to mean what it means today. He CAN mess with Bible translations, but it’s quite obvious when he does (research Westcott-Hort, Codex Sinaiticus Vaticanus straight scheme from the devil.) Chuck Missler is a great resource on this
Oh I like that so much better! It takes real strength to be THINK, to be Patient, to handle real difficulties. Being meek is submissive when action is required. Thank you for this!
It's not Q related but I'm just going through some rough times right now with the lockdowns and restrictions in my area. They are really hurting my ability to support my family and stay in business. I'm able to stay strong most of the time but was really feeling the doom this morning.
I was asking God for a sign if i should just give up or stay in business and less than 5 minutes later I saw your post.
I always thought it was "the meek shall inherit the earth" and when I thought meek, I thought like a mouse or old lady or something. Your translation shed new light on Mathew 5:5 for me and gave it personal meaning.
I come from a poor family and started my business with all the money I had. I have put everything into it and if I go under Ill lose everything.
Your post made me realize I need to stay strong, stay determined, be in control of my emotions and have patience. I don't really have any other options at this point but it gives me hope. To me, that was a message from God and I thank you again for posting that, it was what I needed to see.
If we look at the early Christian belief of those who were closest to Christ there is a frame of thought completely different to modern western bible interpretation.
For St. Paul - the chief enemy of humanity are sin death and the law of Moses. They are linked together holding man in bondage.
St. Paul considers the law of Moses as a type of emergency measure provided by god to deal with a crises of human sin. (Gal 3: 15-29; cf Rom 10:4)
The law of Moses was meant as a tutor (παιδαγωγός) in order to prepare the people of Christ. Gal 3:23-26; Rom 2:14-15; Rom 10:4.
Instead the law was treated by the Jews as goal unto itself and thus became a tyrant. They looked into keeping the law as part of their security and so we say even the law became an idol, no longer leading to god any more.
The unholy alliance between sin and the law is the rule of death. Death is a product of life in which relationships have been broken.
When Jesus is condemned to the cross - and he defeated death - he also defeats sin and Satan. And if the laws of Moses are now of sin - and it’s those same Jewish priests under the laws of Moses who condemned him. Jesus is the breaker of chains. Of human reconnection to god and salvation.
St. Chrysostom says that we are saved through the fire. The hottest fire - and a literal hell on earth that we tread through is the path to salvation and immortality.
Orthodoxy is very suggestive that Άδης (the term used for “hell” in the west) is here on earth. And that all can be saved in passing through hell. Indeed it’s he who is burned most by his time on earth who is made stronger unto god.
Jesus walked up the mount and carried his cross, and took this burden willingly in order to defeat death sin and Satan.
There are so many deviations unfortunately in modern interpretations of scripture.
[b]If any man’s work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as through fire.
St. John Chrysostom ca. 349-407B/b]
1 Cor. 3:12-15 If any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay, stubble; each man’s work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it is revealed in fire; and the fire shall prove each man’s work of what sort it is. If any man’s work abide which he built thereon, he shall receive a reward. If any man’s work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as through fire.
St. John Chrysostom ca. 349-407
Now his meaning is this: If any man have an ill life with a right faith, his faith shall not shelter him from punishment, his work being burnt up. The phrase, shall be burned up, means, shall not endure the violence of the fire. But just as if a man having golden armor on were to pass through a river of fire, he comes from crossing it all the brighter; but if he were to pass through it with hay, so far from profiting, he destroys himself besides; so also is the case in regard of men’s works. For he does not say this as if he were discoursing of material things being burnt up, but with a view of making their fear more intense, and of showing how naked of all defence he is who abides in wickedness. Wherefore he said, He shall suffer loss: lo, here is one punishment: but he himself shall be saved, but so as by fire; lo, again, here is a second. And his meaning is, He himself shall not perish in the same way as his works, passing into nought, but he shall abide in the fire.
He calls it, however, “salvation”, you will say; why, that is the cause of his adding, so as by fire: since we also used to say, It is preserved in the fire, when we speak of those substances which do not immediately burn up and become ashes. For do not at sound of the word fire imagine that those who are burning pass into annihilation. And though he call such punishment “salvation”, be not astonished. For his custom is in things which have an ill sound to use fair expressions, and in good things the contrary. For example, the word “captivity” seems to be the name of an evil thing, but Paul has applied it in a good sense, when he says, Bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ. 2 Corinthians 10:5 And again, to an evil thing he has applied a good word, saying, Sin reigned, Romans 5:21 here surely the term reigning is rather of auspicious sound. And so here in saying, he shall be saved, he has but darkly hinted at the intensity of the penalty: as if he had said, “But himself shall remain forever in punishment”. (Homily 9 on First Corinthians)
I definitely agree there is a different frame of thought in old school Christianity vs modern Christianity and there are a lot of deviations in modern interpretations of scripture.
I didn't grow up in a Christian home and my only knowledge of Christianity was what I saw on TV and how people I knew were Christians acted. I was very opposed to God, or what I thought at the time was God, because of this. I was actively against and full of hatred towards Christians and Christianity.
God revealed himself to me through a series of events and visions at a Crossroads in my life. The most profound was when I was studying Aleister Crowley with some friends and someone they referred to as a guru. We were getting ready to head to a huge occult convention later that day.
All of a sudden all I could see was fire, like I was inside of a huge bonfire, completely surrounded by an inferno. I tried to open and close my eyes but it made no difference, it was all I could see. In addition to this, all I could hear was this intense rumble, like what it sounds like when you are standing beside a freight train going by. There was also a feeling of impending doom that was indescribably brutal.
Before this, I thought the spiritual realm was kind of a joke and didn't really believe in it. To me, the occult was just a cool thing to be into and went well with my lifestyle. A few hours after this I accepted Christ into my heart at the suggestion of someone I trusted. They later turned out to be someone who used Christianity to manipulate me.
Since I didn't know anything about Christianity, have any Christian friends or know of any church I could learn about God at, I got a bunch of books at a thrift store. These were all really sketchy, borderline cult books and this really led me astray towards legalism. I started going to church and ultimately this led me further astray, eventually leading me to abandon my faith. I was a Christian for about 10 years at this point. Modern interpretations definitely led me astray.
After leaving my faith I didn't think much about God other than that if he was real, he wasn't what I had learned at these churches or in the books I read. I recently prayed again for the first time in almost 8 years, largely because of this board.
I think what you posted makes a lot of sense. It really does seem like this life is a test (hellish) at times. My hardships have made me a stronger person and I can see how it would be a path to salvation and immortality. If I didn't go through the struggles I have, I would be a very different person, someone who I would currently be ashamed of.
I appreciate you taking the time to respond to me and what you posted definitely resonates with me. I think you probably felt called to make your original post. I don't post much here as I don't really have much of value to add to the conversation but I just wanted to confirm to you that it was very helpful, at least to me.
I'm not so much an atheist as I am an antitheist and a huge part of that is that religion doesn't exactly promote critical as much as it promotes dogmatic thinking.
I mean the bible and all other major religious texts have been re-written and filtered through the hands of the kazahrians/molochites to serve their purposes(would still be antitheist but would find a lot more value in what's in the bible if this wasn't the case...) and this is just one of MANY examples....
Another example is the whole 666 thing, this is their number and so is a lot of the things associated with it, I mean satan means adversary translated literally and they feared it so much that they changed the original number(616) and the whole story to make a badguy........
The reason I thought to remember/mention this is OP's more correct translation headline as these two are definitively related.....
Man’s religion may promote dogmatic thinking, the Lord certainly doesn’t. Interestingly enough, most of the times God is chastising individuals or nations in Scripture, He is blasting them for NOT thinking clearly and using the wisdom and logic he gave them. Christ is literally the ‘logos’ after all.
Then refer to the Greek. You will find a mistranslation every time. Gentile is used to replace 34 different words and sometimes even sentences. Sentences in the Greek language that are rich with meaning and metaphorical interpretation.
They replace words with power like «έθνος» = nation.
They replace words like: «ελλην» = Greek - a great civilisation of the time.
Every time they moderate greater words - for a word that represents simply “non-Jew”.
The words of the Bible of strength and stature can not simply replace the words with “gentile”.... you are not simply a “non-Jew”.
Imagine if the Bible was written today and they replaced - Nation; USA and entire powerful sentences filled with meaning with “gentile”.....
Jesus fought the Jewish priests supremacy and preached equality for all, before his crucifix action. And he never ever used a weak word like “non-Jew” to replace these ideas...
And yet many Christian evangelicals are obsessed with joining the “Jewish tribe” of Jesus. Jesus was a rebel of racial superiority. He was for equality under god.
Are you now still surprised - at the division in USA? When even the Bible was manipulated into tribal affiliation... and demolishes strong words and concepts?
It translates to a concept not in the English language in a single word.
Let me paint you a picture.
Imagine the lion in the picture above - eating his meal patiently; as 20 hyenas circle him. He remains composed and able. Yet does not resort to violence, yet is capable of it. Tolerant yet battle ready. Able to follow commands of a general also, and not shoot or engage in violence unnecessarily.
It litterally translates to the “calm before the storm” in a personified manner.
It translates to temperance and control of the strong.
Meek does not mean just passive. It means battleready and keeping your sword sheathed. It translates to tolerance.
The Greek is not simply words. It is personified images.
Thank you for bringing this up. There is so much more to the Word of God than most understand, and so much more than I have even researched.
This difficult-to-translate root (pra-) means more than "meek." Biblical meekness is not weakness but rather refers to exercising God's strength under His control – i.e. demonstrating power without undue harshness.The English term "meek" often lacks this blend – i.e. of gentleness (reserve) and strength.]
How dpoes πραεῖς translate as "strong"? I don't speak Greek but the best machine translation I can do is to romanise it as "praeis" which translates as "before"
That’s really awesome dude!! Must be such a blessing to read the New Testament in the Koine. But for native English speakers, the Lord doesn’t want to fool them.
Do you believe He preserves His Words for His children to read in any generation, no matter the culture or language?
“The words of the Lord are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times. Thou shalt keep them, O Lord, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever.”
Psalms 12:6-7
He provided an accurate, trustworthy translation in the King James for English speaking people. He doesn’t put up unnecessary barriers to Himself and does not require me to learn fluent Koine Greek. I trust and rely on His pure Words in the KJ every single day and it is amazing!
Only the Greek Orthodox Church preserves the words as they were.
But knowledge for both me and you.. can be aided by the priests, pastors and scholars.
But the aforementioned must always keep humble to the Greek of the New Testament.
This is why the Greek Orthodox Church fires lights first when the holy flame is passed.
Religious texts often make consequential and a series of mistakes - that takes the faith and adapts it to translations written before upon which they are based. Then there is cultural influence of our times swinging religions left and right so that they change like the sand - rather than stay firm like a rock.
I suggest the work of father Josiah trenham in understanding these differences.
He has a book called rock and sand. Here he is discussing his book:
The movie documentary: wolf in sheep’s clothing - should also serve as a warning to you on how astray some may go...
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt6107652/
People don’t need to know Greek. But those that preach - should constantly be referring to the Greek. And those who pick a translation, should pay close attention to which bibles have been purposefully changed.
Hint:
The word “gentile” does not exist in the Bible.
It replaces a multitude of words - including «έθνος» - nation and «ελλην» meaning Greek.. and sometimes entire sentences. Gentile replaces important terms relating to national sovereignty and equality of the races.
The series rock and sand i attached above I believe has the power to help you find the closest place to Jesus message that can be found. If you understand what he is saying. The rest becomes self evident of where to look.
I do not believe one can point to any one church and say "This is the true church". Frankly, most of those who judge in such a way have only done enough studies to "prove themselves correct", rather than taking an unbiased approach to the whole subject matter. I am familiar with Trenham’s material, as I felt it was the strongest ‘Ironman’ argument for Orthodoxy and approached it with a humble heart.
One example of an error in Orthodox doctrine is that no Bishop is married within the Orthodox Church, though you do find the occassional Priest who is married within the church.
The reason you do not find any Bishops married and only a few Priests married is because of their approach to theology. With the Apostle Paul's commands to Deacons and Bishops we find the scripture to say that a Bishop is "to be husband to one wife". They read this as a prohibition against polygamy, rather than a commandment for the Bishop to be married.
As a result of their belief that it is to steer Bishops away from polygamy, they go a step further and only allow non-married men to become Bishops. This is unscriptural and even hinted at by Paul to be a doctrine of devils (1 Tim 4 forbidding marriage).
Orthodox also teach that baptism is for remission of sins, which is a dispensational error that arises from not rightly dividing the Scriptures. (2 Tim 2:15)
Out of curiosity, would you say that because the leader of my church was not ordained by a Greek Orthodox bishop, that we are no church of God?
What exactly is inaccurate? I didn’t include primary sources because this is a casual forum discussion, but I wrote from doctrinal statements on an Orthodox website. Why are the bishops not allowed to be married when even Peter was married and Paul explicitly describes it as a doctrine of devils?
As someone not affiliated with orthodoxy but who has a deep love for Christ, His Word and His church, there is enough in this issue alone to be extremely wary as the Holy Ghost warns me in Colossians 2:8-
“Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ”
Yes I am familiar with autocephaly, but that is only granted by permission of an ecumenical orthodox council. My church has not sought this permission from any council. I live in New Zealand where there is virtually no orthodox presence. Therefore your orthodox bishops would label my church not of God, and therefore of Satan, correct?
I’m not here to start a war. From our conversation I can sense you truly are my brother in Christ, and I love you and hope to meet you after this life is all over and have a good laugh.
New Zealand and Australia anyone can preach. Even with close to 0 understanding of scripture or Greek.
If you don’t see this as a problem.. hard to help you.
They can tell you anything and you will believe it.
Thinking critically - will lead you to the true words. And the true words are only in Greek. And this is why the Greek Orthodox Church often blesses churches who preach the true word - then gives them autocephaly - which means complete independance.
The only true text is the Greek.
Meek is not the right word.
I speak Greek - the translated sentence above is mine. KJB uses meek. And meek is wrong. (Or maybe the English dictionary is wrong in describing meek).
I’m not saying that my translation of a single sentence is much. Only that KJB is wrong here.
I replied to your other comment before you deleted it. Heavily disagree that the only ‘true text’ is the Greek. That would mean that only native Greek speakers ever get to read the pure Words of God, and that simply does not agree with Scripture or the nature of God as I know Him. Grace and peace to you brother
You are mistaken friend. God speaks every language and has the ability to ensure His Words are accurately translated into any language for His children to read and understand.
Every child of God is a priest by the way-
“But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:”
1 Peter 2:9
Jesus is the Word. The most important thing is to have Him (and He, you) and His Spirit to understand the Bible anyway. This invitation is available to little children and ‘the simple’. These do not have the ability to learn another language, and yet the Lord has made a way for them to receive His pure Words through accurate translations in their native tongue.
I’m not talking about NIV or ESV or any of these modern muddled Bibles based on Alexandrian or Catholic texts, but the TR only.
You rightly say that humans are fallible and sinners, yet confidently proclaim that you are definitely correct and KJ is wrong. I hope you can see the irony in that
I stated a fact. If you want the truth do more research on my interpretation. And be at peace - or just ignore it... you can easily ignore the fact that the church in many Protestant faiths are radically different even 20 years ago to today. Or you might see that that is a problem.
years ago i heard my pastor describe meekness as the huge workhorse who has loads of strength but is tethered by a small strap of leather. The strong who show control will inherit the earth
I agree with this outlook. A person who is weak can not be "meek" any more than a person with literally no fear can be "brave". Meekness requires being able to -not- be meek. A toddler is not meek, but a good parent sure has to be.
Probably done on purpose to get Christians to become meek and submissive. Same way they tried to turn Christians into pacifists so they wouldn't dare fight back when necessary.
Even a lot of our religions have been manipulated and twisted for a very long time as [they] use them as a mechanism to change and control the populations.
It’s the other way around- Satan changes the meaning of the word ‘meek’ to mean what it means today. He CAN mess with Bible translations, but it’s quite obvious when he does (research Westcott-Hort, Codex Sinaiticus Vaticanus straight scheme from the devil.) Chuck Missler is a great resource on this
The problem is that the meaning of "meek" has drifted.
calm before the storm - the strong and disciplined
Oh I like that so much better! It takes real strength to be THINK, to be Patient, to handle real difficulties. Being meek is submissive when action is required. Thank you for this!
Thank you for posting this. I needed to see this today, it was an answer to prayer.
Care to share the good news?
It's not Q related but I'm just going through some rough times right now with the lockdowns and restrictions in my area. They are really hurting my ability to support my family and stay in business. I'm able to stay strong most of the time but was really feeling the doom this morning.
I was asking God for a sign if i should just give up or stay in business and less than 5 minutes later I saw your post.
I always thought it was "the meek shall inherit the earth" and when I thought meek, I thought like a mouse or old lady or something. Your translation shed new light on Mathew 5:5 for me and gave it personal meaning.
I come from a poor family and started my business with all the money I had. I have put everything into it and if I go under Ill lose everything.
Your post made me realize I need to stay strong, stay determined, be in control of my emotions and have patience. I don't really have any other options at this point but it gives me hope. To me, that was a message from God and I thank you again for posting that, it was what I needed to see.
Thx for sharing your struggles.
If we look at the early Christian belief of those who were closest to Christ there is a frame of thought completely different to modern western bible interpretation.
For St. Paul - the chief enemy of humanity are sin death and the law of Moses. They are linked together holding man in bondage.
St. Paul considers the law of Moses as a type of emergency measure provided by god to deal with a crises of human sin. (Gal 3: 15-29; cf Rom 10:4)
The law of Moses was meant as a tutor (παιδαγωγός) in order to prepare the people of Christ. Gal 3:23-26; Rom 2:14-15; Rom 10:4.
Instead the law was treated by the Jews as goal unto itself and thus became a tyrant. They looked into keeping the law as part of their security and so we say even the law became an idol, no longer leading to god any more.
The unholy alliance between sin and the law is the rule of death. Death is a product of life in which relationships have been broken.
When Jesus is condemned to the cross - and he defeated death - he also defeats sin and Satan. And if the laws of Moses are now of sin - and it’s those same Jewish priests under the laws of Moses who condemned him. Jesus is the breaker of chains. Of human reconnection to god and salvation.
St. Chrysostom says that we are saved through the fire. The hottest fire - and a literal hell on earth that we tread through is the path to salvation and immortality.
Orthodoxy is very suggestive that Άδης (the term used for “hell” in the west) is here on earth. And that all can be saved in passing through hell. Indeed it’s he who is burned most by his time on earth who is made stronger unto god.
Jesus walked up the mount and carried his cross, and took this burden willingly in order to defeat death sin and Satan.
There are so many deviations unfortunately in modern interpretations of scripture.
[b]If any man’s work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as through fire. St. John Chrysostom ca. 349-407B/b]
1 Cor. 3:12-15 If any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay, stubble; each man’s work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it is revealed in fire; and the fire shall prove each man’s work of what sort it is. If any man’s work abide which he built thereon, he shall receive a reward. If any man’s work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as through fire. St. John Chrysostom ca. 349-407
Now his meaning is this: If any man have an ill life with a right faith, his faith shall not shelter him from punishment, his work being burnt up. The phrase, shall be burned up, means, shall not endure the violence of the fire. But just as if a man having golden armor on were to pass through a river of fire, he comes from crossing it all the brighter; but if he were to pass through it with hay, so far from profiting, he destroys himself besides; so also is the case in regard of men’s works. For he does not say this as if he were discoursing of material things being burnt up, but with a view of making their fear more intense, and of showing how naked of all defence he is who abides in wickedness. Wherefore he said, He shall suffer loss: lo, here is one punishment: but he himself shall be saved, but so as by fire; lo, again, here is a second. And his meaning is, He himself shall not perish in the same way as his works, passing into nought, but he shall abide in the fire.
He calls it, however, “salvation”, you will say; why, that is the cause of his adding, so as by fire: since we also used to say, It is preserved in the fire, when we speak of those substances which do not immediately burn up and become ashes. For do not at sound of the word fire imagine that those who are burning pass into annihilation. And though he call such punishment “salvation”, be not astonished. For his custom is in things which have an ill sound to use fair expressions, and in good things the contrary. For example, the word “captivity” seems to be the name of an evil thing, but Paul has applied it in a good sense, when he says, Bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ. 2 Corinthians 10:5 And again, to an evil thing he has applied a good word, saying, Sin reigned, Romans 5:21 here surely the term reigning is rather of auspicious sound. And so here in saying, he shall be saved, he has but darkly hinted at the intensity of the penalty: as if he had said, “But himself shall remain forever in punishment”. (Homily 9 on First Corinthians)
I definitely agree there is a different frame of thought in old school Christianity vs modern Christianity and there are a lot of deviations in modern interpretations of scripture.
I didn't grow up in a Christian home and my only knowledge of Christianity was what I saw on TV and how people I knew were Christians acted. I was very opposed to God, or what I thought at the time was God, because of this. I was actively against and full of hatred towards Christians and Christianity.
God revealed himself to me through a series of events and visions at a Crossroads in my life. The most profound was when I was studying Aleister Crowley with some friends and someone they referred to as a guru. We were getting ready to head to a huge occult convention later that day.
All of a sudden all I could see was fire, like I was inside of a huge bonfire, completely surrounded by an inferno. I tried to open and close my eyes but it made no difference, it was all I could see. In addition to this, all I could hear was this intense rumble, like what it sounds like when you are standing beside a freight train going by. There was also a feeling of impending doom that was indescribably brutal.
Before this, I thought the spiritual realm was kind of a joke and didn't really believe in it. To me, the occult was just a cool thing to be into and went well with my lifestyle. A few hours after this I accepted Christ into my heart at the suggestion of someone I trusted. They later turned out to be someone who used Christianity to manipulate me.
Since I didn't know anything about Christianity, have any Christian friends or know of any church I could learn about God at, I got a bunch of books at a thrift store. These were all really sketchy, borderline cult books and this really led me astray towards legalism. I started going to church and ultimately this led me further astray, eventually leading me to abandon my faith. I was a Christian for about 10 years at this point. Modern interpretations definitely led me astray.
After leaving my faith I didn't think much about God other than that if he was real, he wasn't what I had learned at these churches or in the books I read. I recently prayed again for the first time in almost 8 years, largely because of this board.
I think what you posted makes a lot of sense. It really does seem like this life is a test (hellish) at times. My hardships have made me a stronger person and I can see how it would be a path to salvation and immortality. If I didn't go through the struggles I have, I would be a very different person, someone who I would currently be ashamed of.
I appreciate you taking the time to respond to me and what you posted definitely resonates with me. I think you probably felt called to make your original post. I don't post much here as I don't really have much of value to add to the conversation but I just wanted to confirm to you that it was very helpful, at least to me.
I'm not so much an atheist as I am an antitheist and a huge part of that is that religion doesn't exactly promote critical as much as it promotes dogmatic thinking.
I mean the bible and all other major religious texts have been re-written and filtered through the hands of the kazahrians/molochites to serve their purposes(would still be antitheist but would find a lot more value in what's in the bible if this wasn't the case...) and this is just one of MANY examples....
Another example is the whole 666 thing, this is their number and so is a lot of the things associated with it, I mean satan means adversary translated literally and they feared it so much that they changed the original number(616) and the whole story to make a badguy........
The reason I thought to remember/mention this is OP's more correct translation headline as these two are definitively related.....
Man’s religion may promote dogmatic thinking, the Lord certainly doesn’t. Interestingly enough, most of the times God is chastising individuals or nations in Scripture, He is blasting them for NOT thinking clearly and using the wisdom and logic he gave them. Christ is literally the ‘logos’ after all.
Is sorta at odds with a lot of the stuff written in the bible, the reason should be obvious....
Can you give me an example?
Look for the word “gentile” in the Bible...
Then refer to the Greek. You will find a mistranslation every time. Gentile is used to replace 34 different words and sometimes even sentences. Sentences in the Greek language that are rich with meaning and metaphorical interpretation.
They replace words with power like «έθνος» = nation. They replace words like: «ελλην» = Greek - a great civilisation of the time.
Every time they moderate greater words - for a word that represents simply “non-Jew”.
The words of the Bible of strength and stature can not simply replace the words with “gentile”.... you are not simply a “non-Jew”.
Imagine if the Bible was written today and they replaced - Nation; USA and entire powerful sentences filled with meaning with “gentile”.....
Jesus fought the Jewish priests supremacy and preached equality for all, before his crucifix action. And he never ever used a weak word like “non-Jew” to replace these ideas...
And yet many Christian evangelicals are obsessed with joining the “Jewish tribe” of Jesus. Jesus was a rebel of racial superiority. He was for equality under god.
Are you now still surprised - at the division in USA? When even the Bible was manipulated into tribal affiliation... and demolishes strong words and concepts?
It doesn’t translate to strong.
It translates to a concept not in the English language in a single word.
Let me paint you a picture.
Imagine the lion in the picture above - eating his meal patiently; as 20 hyenas circle him. He remains composed and able. Yet does not resort to violence, yet is capable of it. Tolerant yet battle ready. Able to follow commands of a general also, and not shoot or engage in violence unnecessarily.
It litterally translates to the “calm before the storm” in a personified manner.
It translates to temperance and control of the strong.
Meek does not mean just passive. It means battleready and keeping your sword sheathed. It translates to tolerance.
The Greek is not simply words. It is personified images.
Thank you for bringing this up. There is so much more to the Word of God than most understand, and so much more than I have even researched.
This difficult-to-translate root (pra-) means more than "meek." Biblical meekness is not weakness but rather refers to exercising God's strength under His control – i.e. demonstrating power without undue harshness.The English term "meek" often lacks this blend – i.e. of gentleness (reserve) and strength.]
How dpoes πραεῖς translate as "strong"? I don't speak Greek but the best machine translation I can do is to romanise it as "praeis" which translates as "before"
Goto Strongs, fren. Forget translating machines.
https://biblehub.com/greek/4239.htm
Sometimes you have to study a usage to resurrect the sentiment regarding an expression in a dead language.
And what you are looking at is not Greek as you know now. It is Koine, and is ancient.
The word in question is a tough one. And does not exist in modern Greek.
But I wouldn’t call koine ancient. Modern Greek speakers can understand most of koine Greek. Koine means “new” greek.
But yea your link is accurate. And the dictionary definition of meek is completely different in English.
The ‘true translation’ is the KJV.
The problem is that there has been a deliberate attenpt to slowly alter the meaning of words over time (as well as natural language evolution).
Read KJ with a humble heart open to teaching, and prayer for the Spirit to show you what He meant, and you will never go wrong.
https://youtu.be/e1CYtiNNUcs
That’s really awesome dude!! Must be such a blessing to read the New Testament in the Koine. But for native English speakers, the Lord doesn’t want to fool them.
Do you believe He preserves His Words for His children to read in any generation, no matter the culture or language?
“The words of the Lord are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times. Thou shalt keep them, O Lord, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever.” Psalms 12:6-7
He provided an accurate, trustworthy translation in the King James for English speaking people. He doesn’t put up unnecessary barriers to Himself and does not require me to learn fluent Koine Greek. I trust and rely on His pure Words in the KJ every single day and it is amazing!
Only the Greek Orthodox Church preserves the words as they were.
But knowledge for both me and you.. can be aided by the priests, pastors and scholars.
But the aforementioned must always keep humble to the Greek of the New Testament.
This is why the Greek Orthodox Church fires lights first when the holy flame is passed.
Religious texts often make consequential and a series of mistakes - that takes the faith and adapts it to translations written before upon which they are based. Then there is cultural influence of our times swinging religions left and right so that they change like the sand - rather than stay firm like a rock.
I suggest the work of father Josiah trenham in understanding these differences.
He has a book called rock and sand. Here he is discussing his book:
Part 1 https://youtu.be/piVdrtgo7Xw
Part 2 https://youtu.be/xs0ExgnRMqc
The movie documentary: wolf in sheep’s clothing - should also serve as a warning to you on how astray some may go... https://www.imdb.com/title/tt6107652/
People don’t need to know Greek. But those that preach - should constantly be referring to the Greek. And those who pick a translation, should pay close attention to which bibles have been purposefully changed.
Hint: The word “gentile” does not exist in the Bible. It replaces a multitude of words - including «έθνος» - nation and «ελλην» meaning Greek.. and sometimes entire sentences. Gentile replaces important terms relating to national sovereignty and equality of the races.
The series rock and sand i attached above I believe has the power to help you find the closest place to Jesus message that can be found. If you understand what he is saying. The rest becomes self evident of where to look.
I do not believe one can point to any one church and say "This is the true church". Frankly, most of those who judge in such a way have only done enough studies to "prove themselves correct", rather than taking an unbiased approach to the whole subject matter. I am familiar with Trenham’s material, as I felt it was the strongest ‘Ironman’ argument for Orthodoxy and approached it with a humble heart.
One example of an error in Orthodox doctrine is that no Bishop is married within the Orthodox Church, though you do find the occassional Priest who is married within the church. The reason you do not find any Bishops married and only a few Priests married is because of their approach to theology. With the Apostle Paul's commands to Deacons and Bishops we find the scripture to say that a Bishop is "to be husband to one wife". They read this as a prohibition against polygamy, rather than a commandment for the Bishop to be married. As a result of their belief that it is to steer Bishops away from polygamy, they go a step further and only allow non-married men to become Bishops. This is unscriptural and even hinted at by Paul to be a doctrine of devils (1 Tim 4 forbidding marriage).
Orthodox also teach that baptism is for remission of sins, which is a dispensational error that arises from not rightly dividing the Scriptures. (2 Tim 2:15)
Out of curiosity, would you say that because the leader of my church was not ordained by a Greek Orthodox bishop, that we are no church of God?
Much of what you wrote here is inaccurate.
The Orthodox Church believes in autocephaly - DuckDuckGo that.
If christians stayed true to orthodoxy there would be no Christian brother wars - and a fight against the globalist cabal pope
IC XC NIKA
What exactly is inaccurate? I didn’t include primary sources because this is a casual forum discussion, but I wrote from doctrinal statements on an Orthodox website. Why are the bishops not allowed to be married when even Peter was married and Paul explicitly describes it as a doctrine of devils?
As someone not affiliated with orthodoxy but who has a deep love for Christ, His Word and His church, there is enough in this issue alone to be extremely wary as the Holy Ghost warns me in Colossians 2:8- “Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ”
Yes I am familiar with autocephaly, but that is only granted by permission of an ecumenical orthodox council. My church has not sought this permission from any council. I live in New Zealand where there is virtually no orthodox presence. Therefore your orthodox bishops would label my church not of God, and therefore of Satan, correct?
I’m not here to start a war. From our conversation I can sense you truly are my brother in Christ, and I love you and hope to meet you after this life is all over and have a good laugh.
New Zealand and Australia anyone can preach. Even with close to 0 understanding of scripture or Greek. If you don’t see this as a problem.. hard to help you. They can tell you anything and you will believe it. Thinking critically - will lead you to the true words. And the true words are only in Greek. And this is why the Greek Orthodox Church often blesses churches who preach the true word - then gives them autocephaly - which means complete independance.
The only true text is the Greek. Meek is not the right word. I speak Greek - the translated sentence above is mine. KJB uses meek. And meek is wrong. (Or maybe the English dictionary is wrong in describing meek).
I’m not saying that my translation of a single sentence is much. Only that KJB is wrong here.
I replied to your other comment before you deleted it. Heavily disagree that the only ‘true text’ is the Greek. That would mean that only native Greek speakers ever get to read the pure Words of God, and that simply does not agree with Scripture or the nature of God as I know Him. Grace and peace to you brother
Above reasoning - is why the christian Orthodox Church still gives sermons in the original koine Greek.
Translation for more to have access is great.
But the priests and pastors should be learning greek period.
You are mistaken friend. God speaks every language and has the ability to ensure His Words are accurately translated into any language for His children to read and understand.
Every child of God is a priest by the way-
“But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:” 1 Peter 2:9
Jesus is the Word. The most important thing is to have Him (and He, you) and His Spirit to understand the Bible anyway. This invitation is available to little children and ‘the simple’. These do not have the ability to learn another language, and yet the Lord has made a way for them to receive His pure Words through accurate translations in their native tongue.
I’m not talking about NIV or ESV or any of these modern muddled Bibles based on Alexandrian or Catholic texts, but the TR only.
Humans are fallible and sinners. Our texts aren’t holy - only the words and direct testament of Jesus is.
You rightly say that humans are fallible and sinners, yet confidently proclaim that you are definitely correct and KJ is wrong. I hope you can see the irony in that
I stated a fact. If you want the truth do more research on my interpretation. And be at peace - or just ignore it... you can easily ignore the fact that the church in many Protestant faiths are radically different even 20 years ago to today. Or you might see that that is a problem.
Tip:
Rock and sand book:
https://youtu.be/piVdrtgo7Xw
https://youtu.be/xs0ExgnRMqc