and those five guys don't have a job anymore. they are out there competing for the jobs that remain. they're less likely to buy a house. they are less likely to invest. they aren't going to have as much money for consumer purchases. they might not be able to take their car to the mechanic and pay him to repair it. those five guys who are out of a job because of that automated concrete machine are five people who are being pushed onto the welfare system. and then the guy who owns the machine pockets all the money and sticks it in a bank account which he uses to buy more machines to automate everything and put everybody out of work until eventually there aren't any customers left who can afford to purchase his concrete services except the large institutions who own all the machines. where does everybody else go? The logical answer is to say that they all die and are replaced by machines which are owned by a very small group of people who essentially have no reason to exist anymore.
I guess I look at history. The slave owners were afraid to get rid of their slaves... who would do the work??? The cotton gin came along, then the Industrial Revolution, and although the slaves weren't needed anymore, the work was done. What happened to all the slaves? They found work and they have all found their place. Cars came along, it killed the horse and buggy industry, and the farriers, tack makers... on and on... new roads had to be built. They needed lights. They needed to build the cars. New industry was formed.
I could keep going... but I guess my point is, that even though it'll kill some industries, someone needs to fix the AI, someone needs to make parts, someone needs to fix the machinery. Jobs will be created.
Chinese propaganda to help them win the AI race. Total bullshit. Ai won’t take your job, people who know how to use AI will. That just happened at click up. They laid off people not to save money, to keep the people that were maximizing productivity with AI use and they created pay bands up to $1m they used the layoff money to raise wages. This is the future.
What you will find is that you will be more successful if you keep humans in the loop. You are falling victim to the propaganda. Look at what click up did. You can do what you want, but when shit goes sideways on you after you fire 50 people, I’ll be here to help you pick up the pieces. We can put your company on the right track to success. Or you can save a massive headband keep humans in the loop, oh and pay those people well, or people like me will find them, double their pay and take them from you :)
The reason for the firing is not AI. It’s poor management and bloated staff from Covid expansion. AI is the excuse. The propaganda is that it will take all the jobs. Take a 50k ft view. Look at who benefits from the US losing the AI race? It’s the same globalist fucks we are dealing with in everything we are fighting against. The AI data center attacks on environmental grounds same fucks, The propaganda is linked to Chinese firms. Dig deeper beyond the noise
I agree that the smart companies are doing this. The smart ones are indeed keeping payroll $'s steady and leveraging the increased productivity with AI-fluent employees to leap ahead of their competitors.
However, not all companies are that smart. As an example, I work for a large software company (a few billion in annual revenue) with a large engineering staff and products that exist in a very competitive market.
AI has absolutely accelerated development. However, the idiots that run my company have looked at the 30% increase in code output to lay off around 30% of the engineering/development staff.
And there are jobs that aren't augmented by AI, they're simply replaced by AI.
This is a much more nuanced conversation than you're making it out to be.
As another commenter noted in this thread, new opportunities will inevitably be created moving forward. However, AI is going to be a serious problem for a large minority of U.S. workers. There's just no getting around that.
That being said, I would encourage people to take your advice on making friends with AI. Those who become proficient with it will keep their jobs far longer.
You’re right, I’m probably oversimplifying things and neglecting the nuance. I think I was just triggered by an article touting Nobel laureate as having a clue other than globalist bullshit.
Your last sentence is what I want for people. That is what I’m trying to do for people. Yes, I agree, some will be displaced, and yes other opportunities will also surface, but in almost all cases, it will involve AI to some extent. Businesses should also start investing in hardware to run local models and use mitigate some of the recurring AI costs This is a transition for our workforce and it’s happening faster than any transition in history. The big ones were electricity, the internet and now this one.
Whatever we do, there is no putting the genie back in the bottle, restricting AI is a recipe for disaster. So we have to find a way to move forward with AI.
I think someone showed them how an AI-based economics learning model can beat them at their own game. Not just beat them, but obliterate them, like the chess players that suddenly retired once they learned they can't beat a computer at chess anymore.
Assuming it doesn't make up stories. A "ghost hunter" historian just posted that he tried to ask AI for history stories, and AI gave him one true one and one made up one. When it caught AI making up stories, AI just said "Ooops, got caught up in the moment." So we need people to make sure AI is not just going off the rails.
AI is absolutely disrupting the book publishing and editing industries.
Friend is a longtime novelist and book editor, helping other authors get their books ready for submission to publishers or for self-publishing.
About two years ago, she started getting manuscripts that were obvious AI-generated garbage. On some, she was paid to rewrite and "fix" them so that they were at least coherent and sounded like a human being wrote them.
At the same time, editing started dropping off because everybody started using AI programs for editing. All that does is make everybody sound the same, but you can't tell these "authors" that.
The result:
"Real" publishers - the ones with the books you see in the big stores - are so swamped with submissions that if you do send them your manuscript, you have virtually zero chance of anybody seeing it. It literally takes two to three years to get a response, if you get one at all.
Yes. Years.
The self-publishing platforms - like Amazon and several others - are so swamped with submissions that they had to put a limit on how many books an account is allowed to upload per day. I think it's five. Per day. Others are charging money to upload, where it used to be free and you just gave them a cut of the royalty if/when your book got sales.
Overall result:
There is money in stolen/fake property, if you can sell to people who don't know the difference. Amazon, just to name one, is so utterly flooded with books - huge numbers of which are stolen, fake, and just plain garbage - that legit authors are drowning in that same flood.
That's because when literally thousands of books come up when someone searches on "military sci-fi," or anything else, nobody is going to find the book you wrote. Nobody is going to look through that many pages of results.
Amazon tries to keep the garbage off, but it's a losing battle. Unless they want to shut down submissions and have a human look at each one before they let it through - which would grind everything to a halt - the floods will continue.
It's true that a rising tide lifts all boats. It's also true that a tsunami drowns everybody.
AI Is nothing more than a computer that runs through THOUSANDS OF PERMUTATIOINS to solve a problem. The ONLY thing is, is that the computer chips have become FASTER and are able to be "GANGED" in a system so that the scale does not matter what the problem is.!!!!!!
Funny thing is, AI will be able to write it's own code to solve a problem and then what happens?????
I am preparing to hear that claim repeated over and over for the rest of my life: "It will surpass human ability in 1-2 years."
We know that MCAS software can kill 346 passengers and crew as a necessary consequence of its basic design. We know that autonomous vehicles can kill people for bizarre reasons. We know that AI has a basic problem with UNPREDICTABLE hallucinations. We know that AI can generate slop. We know that companies which have taken the plunge into AI have had to retreat on account of all the slop errors that have occurred. We know that AI is now training on AI slop and producing more of the same, beyond limit or control (error propagation across the internet).
There is very dishonest advertising going on, here. AI is not even remotely "intelligence." It cannot think. Thinking requires conceptualization. A.I. cannot entertain concepts. It can only perceptualize. Its graphic and textual behavior is more aptly described as dreaming. Dreams do not obey logic (i.e., they merge into hallucinations).
I have had some interaction with Large Language Model AI through a friend who fancies himself a cosmologist and is trying to develop a theory of cyclic universes, using AI to backstop his thinking. What comes out of the AI is sheer sophism: arguments calculated to arrive at the desired thinking. When I point out deficiencies in its logic or the existence of information at odds with the thinking, he cycles it back through the AI, which produces more sophism, mostly arm-waving and retreat into cosmological truisms or platitudes. How can one trust a supposed thinking process that has no concept of truth or fiction?
In a case like this, skeptical people like to employ the metaphor of Frankenstein's monster. But a more apt, and in some ways more troubling, metaphor is that of the golem: a force that does what we want, relentless, from ill-chosen desire.
Or, a more modern metaphor might be that of a Sith adept: increasingly talented with forbidden knowledge, until it turns and kills its master. In this case, not even out of malevolence. Only out of imperfection and a phenomenal ability to magnify error.
A year ago it was supposed to have taken all the coding and writing jobs. It improved rapidly at first but has definitely plateaued in my experience using it.
Right. It’s not taking the jobs but engineers who code are now using it to do 90% of their coding or more. Even karpathy who developed the ai for Tesla and who now works for anthropic is using it to build stuff. The ai is now building the next ai models. It’s being directed by humans. That’s the difference. Experts are no longer needing to know the coding, they need to know how to work with ai.
Companies care about the bottom line. If they can get a machine to do the work of several people and save salaries, benefits, and health insurance over a long period of time there is absolutely no question they will purchase that machine and dump the humans.
To the higher ups it's just business. They do not care about people and whether they lose their livelihoods.And if you think differently, you're very naive and in for a rude awakening.
This is exactly how the 737 MAX ended up with the MCAS software that killed 346 people. I think the losses related to that dual catastrophe were in the billions of dollars and a prolonged delay into the market. To the higher-ups who have no vision or product acumen, a focus on pennies leads to death and the loss of millions and billions. And if you think differently...
Publicly traded companies often think this way because their incentive structure is different.
They're under constant pressure to reduce costs and improve financial performance, which can increase investor confidence and, ultimately, the stock price.
Private companies don't face that same level of quarter-to-quarter market pressure.
Many of the large layoffs you've been hearing about have come from publicly traded companies driven by Wall Street expectations and not from private businesses.
Private companies often manage employees differently because their priorities and ownership structures are different.
So no, not every business owner is Mr. Burns from The Simpsons.
At the end of the day, company culture and leadership determine how aggressively a company cuts costs and treats its employees.
Here's one job I know AI can put out of work: Globalist (anti-MAGA) economists. AI can't be worse than the economist record of 100% WRONG for moar than 100 years.
As for AI in general, it's a relatively poor show and highly undependable. I've seen it answer in one way in a search, and repeating the same search seconds later, produce the exact opposite conclusion. That's 50% accurate which beats the always 100% wrong anti-MAGA economist crowd of DERANGED FLEAS.
Can it pour concrete?
Actually it can do some amazing things with concrete. I seen a machine that did the work of about 5 guys.
and those five guys don't have a job anymore. they are out there competing for the jobs that remain. they're less likely to buy a house. they are less likely to invest. they aren't going to have as much money for consumer purchases. they might not be able to take their car to the mechanic and pay him to repair it. those five guys who are out of a job because of that automated concrete machine are five people who are being pushed onto the welfare system. and then the guy who owns the machine pockets all the money and sticks it in a bank account which he uses to buy more machines to automate everything and put everybody out of work until eventually there aren't any customers left who can afford to purchase his concrete services except the large institutions who own all the machines. where does everybody else go? The logical answer is to say that they all die and are replaced by machines which are owned by a very small group of people who essentially have no reason to exist anymore.
So what's your solution? Crush AI development?
Not happening. The Chinese would rule the world in no time.
I guess I look at history. The slave owners were afraid to get rid of their slaves... who would do the work??? The cotton gin came along, then the Industrial Revolution, and although the slaves weren't needed anymore, the work was done. What happened to all the slaves? They found work and they have all found their place. Cars came along, it killed the horse and buggy industry, and the farriers, tack makers... on and on... new roads had to be built. They needed lights. They needed to build the cars. New industry was formed.
I could keep going... but I guess my point is, that even though it'll kill some industries, someone needs to fix the AI, someone needs to make parts, someone needs to fix the machinery. Jobs will be created.
It can't rebuild transmissions.
Chinese propaganda to help them win the AI race. Total bullshit. Ai won’t take your job, people who know how to use AI will. That just happened at click up. They laid off people not to save money, to keep the people that were maximizing productivity with AI use and they created pay bands up to $1m they used the layoff money to raise wages. This is the future.
What you will find is that you will be more successful if you keep humans in the loop. You are falling victim to the propaganda. Look at what click up did. You can do what you want, but when shit goes sideways on you after you fire 50 people, I’ll be here to help you pick up the pieces. We can put your company on the right track to success. Or you can save a massive headband keep humans in the loop, oh and pay those people well, or people like me will find them, double their pay and take them from you :)
The reason for the firing is not AI. It’s poor management and bloated staff from Covid expansion. AI is the excuse. The propaganda is that it will take all the jobs. Take a 50k ft view. Look at who benefits from the US losing the AI race? It’s the same globalist fucks we are dealing with in everything we are fighting against. The AI data center attacks on environmental grounds same fucks, The propaganda is linked to Chinese firms. Dig deeper beyond the noise
I agree that the smart companies are doing this. The smart ones are indeed keeping payroll $'s steady and leveraging the increased productivity with AI-fluent employees to leap ahead of their competitors.
However, not all companies are that smart. As an example, I work for a large software company (a few billion in annual revenue) with a large engineering staff and products that exist in a very competitive market.
AI has absolutely accelerated development. However, the idiots that run my company have looked at the 30% increase in code output to lay off around 30% of the engineering/development staff.
And there are jobs that aren't augmented by AI, they're simply replaced by AI.
This is a much more nuanced conversation than you're making it out to be.
As another commenter noted in this thread, new opportunities will inevitably be created moving forward. However, AI is going to be a serious problem for a large minority of U.S. workers. There's just no getting around that.
That being said, I would encourage people to take your advice on making friends with AI. Those who become proficient with it will keep their jobs far longer.
You’re right, I’m probably oversimplifying things and neglecting the nuance. I think I was just triggered by an article touting Nobel laureate as having a clue other than globalist bullshit.
Your last sentence is what I want for people. That is what I’m trying to do for people. Yes, I agree, some will be displaced, and yes other opportunities will also surface, but in almost all cases, it will involve AI to some extent. Businesses should also start investing in hardware to run local models and use mitigate some of the recurring AI costs This is a transition for our workforce and it’s happening faster than any transition in history. The big ones were electricity, the internet and now this one.
Whatever we do, there is no putting the genie back in the bottle, restricting AI is a recipe for disaster. So we have to find a way to move forward with AI.
Love it when Anons team up with the nobel laureates, the smae ones who have been throwing sand in our eyes.
Funny how they were greeting such warnings with skepticism before AI came under MAGA control.
I think someone showed them how an AI-based economics learning model can beat them at their own game. Not just beat them, but obliterate them, like the chess players that suddenly retired once they learned they can't beat a computer at chess anymore.
Every "intellectual" professional is shaking in their boots.
You feed your blood test results and ChatGPT can tell you about your health better than your pharma-agent-doctor.
Feed any contract and you wont need a lawyer.
Ask any business strategy, direction, long term goals etc after feeding your company info, and the MBAs can f right back to their hovels.
Any subject you want to learn, an LLM will do a better job than your average professors.
And when it comes to coding, forget about it. H1Bs are a thing of the past. You can have a bunch of software developers at your fingertips!
No wonder all these snowflake professionals are so pissed off at AI.
I would ask my dog to assess my health before I'd ask an AI.
And I don't have a dog.
Assuming it doesn't make up stories. A "ghost hunter" historian just posted that he tried to ask AI for history stories, and AI gave him one true one and one made up one. When it caught AI making up stories, AI just said "Ooops, got caught up in the moment." So we need people to make sure AI is not just going off the rails.
AI is absolutely disrupting the book publishing and editing industries.
Friend is a longtime novelist and book editor, helping other authors get their books ready for submission to publishers or for self-publishing.
About two years ago, she started getting manuscripts that were obvious AI-generated garbage. On some, she was paid to rewrite and "fix" them so that they were at least coherent and sounded like a human being wrote them.
At the same time, editing started dropping off because everybody started using AI programs for editing. All that does is make everybody sound the same, but you can't tell these "authors" that.
The result:
"Real" publishers - the ones with the books you see in the big stores - are so swamped with submissions that if you do send them your manuscript, you have virtually zero chance of anybody seeing it. It literally takes two to three years to get a response, if you get one at all.
Yes. Years.
The self-publishing platforms - like Amazon and several others - are so swamped with submissions that they had to put a limit on how many books an account is allowed to upload per day. I think it's five. Per day. Others are charging money to upload, where it used to be free and you just gave them a cut of the royalty if/when your book got sales.
Overall result:
There is money in stolen/fake property, if you can sell to people who don't know the difference. Amazon, just to name one, is so utterly flooded with books - huge numbers of which are stolen, fake, and just plain garbage - that legit authors are drowning in that same flood.
That's because when literally thousands of books come up when someone searches on "military sci-fi," or anything else, nobody is going to find the book you wrote. Nobody is going to look through that many pages of results.
Amazon tries to keep the garbage off, but it's a losing battle. Unless they want to shut down submissions and have a human look at each one before they let it through - which would grind everything to a halt - the floods will continue.
It's true that a rising tide lifts all boats. It's also true that a tsunami drowns everybody.
Make sure you know the difference.
I'm impressed. It took 16 Nobel laureates significant time to determine what I've said for several years. But what do I know? I'm just a housewife.
AI is a tool.
Are taxis evil because they replaced the horse and buggy to travel?
Is this like the 51 intel signatures
AI Is nothing more than a computer that runs through THOUSANDS OF PERMUTATIOINS to solve a problem. The ONLY thing is, is that the computer chips have become FASTER and are able to be "GANGED" in a system so that the scale does not matter what the problem is.!!!!!!
Funny thing is, AI will be able to write it's own code to solve a problem and then what happens?????
They are lieing.
AI is not killing as many jobs at they tell us. Companies are laying off due to the Pandemic over hiring and outdated business models.
It's killing AI related jobs because it doesn't work.
No this is not true at all. It works very well. Will surpass human ability in 1-2 years.
I am preparing to hear that claim repeated over and over for the rest of my life: "It will surpass human ability in 1-2 years."
We know that MCAS software can kill 346 passengers and crew as a necessary consequence of its basic design. We know that autonomous vehicles can kill people for bizarre reasons. We know that AI has a basic problem with UNPREDICTABLE hallucinations. We know that AI can generate slop. We know that companies which have taken the plunge into AI have had to retreat on account of all the slop errors that have occurred. We know that AI is now training on AI slop and producing more of the same, beyond limit or control (error propagation across the internet).
There is very dishonest advertising going on, here. AI is not even remotely "intelligence." It cannot think. Thinking requires conceptualization. A.I. cannot entertain concepts. It can only perceptualize. Its graphic and textual behavior is more aptly described as dreaming. Dreams do not obey logic (i.e., they merge into hallucinations).
I have had some interaction with Large Language Model AI through a friend who fancies himself a cosmologist and is trying to develop a theory of cyclic universes, using AI to backstop his thinking. What comes out of the AI is sheer sophism: arguments calculated to arrive at the desired thinking. When I point out deficiencies in its logic or the existence of information at odds with the thinking, he cycles it back through the AI, which produces more sophism, mostly arm-waving and retreat into cosmological truisms or platitudes. How can one trust a supposed thinking process that has no concept of truth or fiction?
In a case like this, skeptical people like to employ the metaphor of Frankenstein's monster. But a more apt, and in some ways more troubling, metaphor is that of the golem: a force that does what we want, relentless, from ill-chosen desire.
Or, a more modern metaphor might be that of a Sith adept: increasingly talented with forbidden knowledge, until it turns and kills its master. In this case, not even out of malevolence. Only out of imperfection and a phenomenal ability to magnify error.
A year ago it was supposed to have taken all the coding and writing jobs. It improved rapidly at first but has definitely plateaued in my experience using it.
Right. It’s not taking the jobs but engineers who code are now using it to do 90% of their coding or more. Even karpathy who developed the ai for Tesla and who now works for anthropic is using it to build stuff. The ai is now building the next ai models. It’s being directed by humans. That’s the difference. Experts are no longer needing to know the coding, they need to know how to work with ai.
Companies care about the bottom line. If they can get a machine to do the work of several people and save salaries, benefits, and health insurance over a long period of time there is absolutely no question they will purchase that machine and dump the humans.
To the higher ups it's just business. They do not care about people and whether they lose their livelihoods.And if you think differently, you're very naive and in for a rude awakening.
This is exactly how the 737 MAX ended up with the MCAS software that killed 346 people. I think the losses related to that dual catastrophe were in the billions of dollars and a prolonged delay into the market. To the higher-ups who have no vision or product acumen, a focus on pennies leads to death and the loss of millions and billions. And if you think differently...
Bullshit!
Publicly traded companies often think this way because their incentive structure is different.
They're under constant pressure to reduce costs and improve financial performance, which can increase investor confidence and, ultimately, the stock price.
Private companies don't face that same level of quarter-to-quarter market pressure.
Many of the large layoffs you've been hearing about have come from publicly traded companies driven by Wall Street expectations and not from private businesses.
Private companies often manage employees differently because their priorities and ownership structures are different.
So no, not every business owner is Mr. Burns from The Simpsons.
At the end of the day, company culture and leadership determine how aggressively a company cuts costs and treats its employees.
Here's one job I know AI can put out of work: Globalist (anti-MAGA) economists. AI can't be worse than the economist record of 100% WRONG for moar than 100 years.
As for AI in general, it's a relatively poor show and highly undependable. I've seen it answer in one way in a search, and repeating the same search seconds later, produce the exact opposite conclusion. That's 50% accurate which beats the always 100% wrong anti-MAGA economist crowd of DERANGED FLEAS.
u/#youdontsay
So it might be costing some jobs RIGHT NOW but could very easily end up creating tons of jobs in the near future
Or causing manned spaceships to crash on Mars. The possibilities are limitless.
Just like there was no RUssian Hoax, Signed the CIA, FBI & DeepState.