https://consortiumnews.com/2023/08/09/atomic-bombings-were-needless-ww-iis-top-us-brass/
An excerpt:
Those who attack this mythology are often reflexively dismissed as unpatriotic, ill-informed or both. However, the most compelling witnesses against the conventional wisdom were patriots with a unique grasp on the state of affairs in August 1945 — America’s senior military leaders of World War II.
Let’s first hear what they had to say, and then examine key facts that led them to their little-publicized convictions:
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General Dwight Eisenhower on learning of the planned bombings: “I had been conscious of a feeling of depression and voiced to [Secretary of War Stimson] my grave misgivings, first on the basis of my belief that Japan was already defeated and that dropping the bomb was completely unnecessary, and secondly because I thought that our country should avoid shocking world opinion by the use of a weapon whose employment was, I thought, no longer mandatory as a measure to save American lives. It was my belief that Japan was, at that very moment, seeking some way to surrender with a minimum loss of ‘face’.”
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Admiral William Leahy, Truman’s Chief of Staff: “The use of this barbarous weapon… was of no material assistance in our war against Japan. The Japanese were already defeated and ready to surrender because of the effective sea blockade and the successful bombing with conventional weapons.”
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Major General Curtis LeMay, 21st Bomber Command: “The war would have been over in two weeks without the Russians entering and without the atomic bomb… The atomic bomb had nothing to do with the end of the war at all.”
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General Hap Arnold, US Army Air Forces: “The Japanese position was hopeless even before the first atomic bomb fell, because the Japanese had lost control of their own air.” “It always appeared to us that, atomic bomb or no atomic bomb, the Japanese were already on the verge of collapse.”
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Ralph Bard, Under Secretary of the Navy: “The Japanese were ready for peace, and they already had approached the Russians and the Swiss…In my opinion, the Japanese war was really won before we ever used the atom bomb.”
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Brigadier General Carter Clarke, military intelligence officer who prepared summaries of intercepted cables for Truman: “When we didn’t need to do it, and we knew we didn’t need to do it…we used [Hiroshima and Nagasaki] as an experiment for two atomic bombs. Many other high-level military officers concurred.”
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Fleet Admiral Chester Nimitz, Pacific Fleet commander: “The use of atomic bombs at Hiroshima and Nagasaki was of no material assistance in our war against Japan. The Japanese were already defeated and ready to surrender.”
Putting out feelers through third-party diplomatic channels, the Japanese were seeking to end the war weeks before the atomic bombings on August 6 and 9, 1945. Japan’s navy and air forces were decimated, and its homeland subjected to a sea blockade and allied bombing carried out against little resistance.
. . . We like to think of our system as one in which the supremacy of civilian leaders acts as a rational, moderating force on military decisions. The needless atomic bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki — against the wishes of World War II’s most revered military leaders — tells us otherwise.
Embrace of Sinister Principle
Sadly, the destructive effects of the Hiroshima myth aren’t confined to Americans’ understanding of events in August 1945. “There are hints and notes of the Hiroshima myth that persist all through modern times,” State Department whistleblower and author Peter Van Buren said on “The Scott Horton Show”.
The Hiroshima myth fosters a depraved indifference to civilian casualties associated with U.S. actions abroad, whether it is women and children slaughtered in a drone strike in Afghanistan, hundreds of thousands dead in an unwarranted invasion of Iraq, or a baby who dies for lack of imported medicine in US-sanctioned Iran.
Ultimately, to embrace the Hiroshima myth is to embrace a truly sinister principle: That, in the correct circumstances, it is right for governments to intentionally harm innocent civilians. Whether the harm is inflicted by bombs or sanctions, it is a philosophy that mirrors the morality of al Qaeda.
Nagasaki had the largest Christian population in Japan. These people underwent centuries of persecution by the Japanese and were finally vaporized by the Americans. Dispensible people. If you ask anyone what brought the end to the war in europe, they will say the invasion of d-day. If you ask what brought the end of the war in the pacific, they will say the atomic bomb. The atomic bomb robbed the American soldiers of their rightful place of the end of the war, instead they lay it at the feet of a Democrat politician.
More civilians died in Dresden than Hiroshima and Nagasaki combined. Dresden was an act of pure malice and genocide.
Yes. A large number of cities both in Europe and in Japan -- including Tokyo -- were incinerated by saturation bombing with incendiary bombs.
As you probably know, Kurt Vonnegut's novel Slaughterhouse Five was inspired by his experience as a POW in Dresden. From Wikipedia:
I have seen estimates up to 200,000 civilian deaths. The heat was so intense that victims were rendered to fat in underground shelters, and others melted into the pavement on the streets.
Funnily, the movie Oppenheimer seems to be allowing Japanese youtubers and influencers to start openly taking about the Bombs, their real purpose and why Japan was predestined to be the testing grounds for the Bombs, and why two bombs were dropped.
This movie and the subsequent conversations, I believe, will be the catalyst for the Awakening in Japan.
Some interesting facts:
Truman hated Japanese people. he called them Beasts, Savages and Miserable Killers.
Truman came to power after Germany surrenderd and before the bombs were dropped. He was the one who made the decision to drop the bombs.
Truman insisted on an unconditional surrender, which was the only thing that stopped the Emperor from surrendering. This was a calculated move to ensure Japan would not surrender, as "face" is an important concept in Eastern cultures.
Not allowing Japan to surrender by railroading them was the same way they were not allowed to negotiate and were railroaded into bombing Pearl Harbour (the plans of which was known to FDR from two different Intel Sources and gave the order that no alerts be sent to the base)
The two bombs that were dropped were to different kinds - First used the Uranium and second used the Plutonium. The two bombs were required because they needed to test these two technologies to see which was better.
After the war US detonated 20+ nuclear bombs in Bikini Atoll (hence the name "Bikini" for dress thats lacking the entire center part), off the coast of Japan.
Video in Japanese that touches on these
However, if you go back in history, there is a great case to be made that the entire Meiji revolution was done by the British to overthrow the Tokugawa shogunate and get their foot in the door.
This video is really fascinating (but again its in Japanese).
Japan has been the play ground of the British Cabal for more than 150 years and has been dragged around back and forth, but there has always been a small percent of the population who have always been awake and now I think they will bring the Awakening to the rest of the population.
Bikini atoll is hardly “off the coast of Japan”. It is 2,400 miles from Japan.
Why Hiroshima Was Destroyed The Detailed History Of An Infamous Era By Eustace C. Mullins
https://rense.com/general90/whyhir.htm
Most intriguing stuff by Mullins.
The devils needed to test their new toys.
Very good summation of what might have been without the nuclear bomb dropping at the end of WWII.
To this day, I remember my parents (Dad was a radioman and gunner in the Army Air Corps) who lived through that war solemnly telling me and my siblings that the USA had to nuke Japan because the Japanese people wouldn't surrender and would fight to the last killing more American soldiers, etc.. Years later I did some research and knew this was just another false narrative to justify such evil.
FWIW, my Dad had no such excuse for the fire bombing of Dresden, Germany which I believe he participated in. It was something he didn't want to talk about.
I’ve read every firsthand account of fighting in the pacific I could find. All of them state pretty plainly that 99% of the Japanese wanted to die in combat, this is reinforced by all Japanese first hand accounts at the time. What research led you to conclude this was not the case? The Japanese were preparing the mainland for an extended defensive slog
Where did you get that 99% number? More than 1% of Japanese soldiers surrendered prior to the bombings. They were tired, starved, wanted to see their families and didn't buy into honor killing themselves. And, yes, there were plenty of evil SoBs within the Japanese army (Rape of Nanking, Bataan, Dutch Nurses, etc..) who felt dying was better than submitting. But 99%? That sounds pretty high.
Fact is, the Japanese government - with the encouragement of the Emperor who knew they could not win - were already making overtures for surrender before the bombs fell. Yes, there were still a few highly-publicized, brainwashed Nippon soldiers and citizens who were willing to die for the Emperor rather than submit to the Allies. The newspapers in Japan were pushing that shaming narrative for public consumption. We all know newspapers wouldn't push false narratives to influence people, right? Most of the "Every Japanese would die rather than surrender" was pure propaganda. On both sides.
I did research why our country purposely bombed civilians in WWII. Some of it was retaliatory, but much of it was sinister and psychopathic in scope. The very quotes above from OP were part of it. FWIW, my research originally stemmed from my father's regret of the Dresden bombings. I don't see the justification for purposely killing civilians to end a war. But your take on it may vary.
A grade school history teacher gave us the same line about abating the need to invade Japan back in the 60s.
Was just like bay of pigs. No one saw it and it was a means to cause fear in other world leaders until they were brought in on the con.
Sorry, but I don't buy the whole "atomic weapons don't exist" idea.
They do, as do nuclear power plants.
If I misunderstood your comment, please let me know.
Have you looked into it? I am convinced it's as fake as any of the other psyops- Sandy Hook, Parkland, etc., i.e., a bit of reality to create an immense illusion. As far as the power plants, you can look up Galen Winsor on rumble as to his experience building them.
I have a geiger counter -- they function as advertised -- and I'm pretty clear on the physics involved. I have read a good deal about nuclear power plants and am horrified at the severe, global problem of nuclear waste -- which would not exist were it not for nuclear weapons, power plants, medical uses, and so on. The mental contortions required to view nuclear weapons and power plants as functioning via some OTHER mechanism never made sense to me and still doesn't.
For instance: nuclear subs can operate submerged for FAR longer than diesel subs. What's being used to make that possible, if not nuclear fusion (to create heat to generate electricity)?
A power plant and a bomb are different things.
Regardless of the details, power plants obviously produce electricity. I don't believe the danger is as advertised. Galen Winsor offers his testimony as to how this deception occurred; it seems reasonable to me. I have yet to see evidence of mutations or birth defects from 3-Mile Island, Chernobyl or Fukushima. In Fukushima, they ran the Olympic torch relay. The stories of danger are simply inconsistent, and Mr Winsor's explanations make more sense.
As far as bombs are concerned, it is simply a question of investigation. Nagasaki and Hiroshima do not have higher cancer levels than the rest of Japan nor did they have lower birth rates nor mutations; they are thriving cities without dead zones. We are told that a nuclear bomb causes a chain reaction that releases energy, but I haven't heard how or why the chain reaction simultaneously ceases. Then we have the fact that, despite the many terrorist organizations and unhinged tyrants in the world over the last 80 years, none have managed to steal, hack, recreate, or detonate anything remotely close to the bombs we are told to fear. The existence of suitcase nukes in the media and lost nuclear weapons from the fall of the USSR, and ever-increasing damage capabilities, combined with the fact that no other atomic bombs have been used, continues to stretch credibility. After looking at alternate theories, I believe that atomic bombs are a psyop.
But definitely investigate on your own.
Here's a collection of video clips of nuclear test blasts. Plenty of other such videos exist.
They were taken decades ago, before modern special effects. I'm old enough to have seen most of them in the '50s and '60s; they're real. And they're NOT anything that could be duplicated by chemical explosives.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oWQ5KnP2W3k
Enjoy.
Regarding the chain reaction - it really isn’t very different than any other explosive. It is a chain reaction involving the fissile nuclear material. The chain reaction relies on two factors 1) the density of the material and 2) the amount of material. The explosion both uses up material and spreads out unused material. That’s why the reaction stops.
It really is no different than how gunpowder works. If you compact it down into a small space, increasing the density, then start a chain reaction (with a percussion cap), the reaction spreads through the available material until it is used up. You haven’t ever wondered why when you fire a gun the reaction doesn’t go on forever, have you?
Likewise if you were to spread the gun powder out over a large area, you couldn’t set of an explosion with it. Same principle holds true for the nuclear material.
Well, that makes sense. I had heard it was an "uncontrollable" chain reaction which is why it was so big, but if it only occurs in the included fissile material that makes sense. I'll discard that concept as an argument. It's been a while since my physics courses. Even so, I think the circumstantial evidence is against it, and the direct evidence that's been presented is more propaganda than reality.
The difference between nuclear power plants and nuclear bombs is only a matter of power plants carefully controlling the rate of fission. Bombs release energy almost instantly; power plants release it over a much longer period, and do so with graphite rods carefully placed and adjusted to control the rate of fission.
Cancer and other harm: Yes, people died of radiation poisoning after the Japanese bombings. Yes, the cities are inhabited now; the levels of radiation are no longer of any real concern. FYI, there is still detectable and in some areas dangerous radiation from the Fukushima disaster in the areas surrounding that plant.
As for chernobyl:
~ Dr. Chris Busby, Deconstructing Nuclear Experts, March 2011
Also:
British Journal of Radiology published Rationale for using multiple antioxidants in protecting humans against low doses of ionizing radiation in 2005 (with 85 references). It includes, among other things, the following information:
You said "I haven't heard how or why the chain reaction simultaneously ceases" --
It DOESN'T, which is why radioactive (and chemically poisonous as well) waste is an issue from power plants, uranium mining and processing, etc. Depleted uranium is less radioactive than new rods used in power plants but still radioactive enough to be a health hazard to soldiers and civilians alike in areas where DU is used.
As for why the chain reactions in bombs cease, it's because the materials are no longer compressed together in tight contact, which is necessary for the chain reaction to continue. Only a small amount can fission before that happens.
Much comes down to which sources of information should be trusted. I'll admit I haven't read or compared the works of Wade Allison, George Monbiot or Chris Busby. But recent years have led me to question large swaths of what structured media presents as truth, including purportedly scientific media. And in revisiting the original stories of the atomic bomb, I find it more likely that both bombs were large-scale firebombings, similar to Dresden, leveraged into a very big lie. This does not discount the existence of large and powerful bombs, nor of large electricity-producing plants (which are also operated in government-controlled secrecy), nor smaller plants that are safe enough and small enough for submarines in port but too dangerous for the cities where they dock.
Because it's impossible to prove a negative, my reasoning is based on circumstantial evidence. Obviously if an atomic weapon explodes tomorrow in an observable place I'd be proven wrong. But 80 years without a repeat, despite media discussion of increasingly miniaturized and increasingly portable nukes, amidst multiple wars and conflicts including those in nuclear-equipped zones and countries (India-Pakistan; Ukraine; Israel), strains credulity. The constant media hammering of the danger, contrasted against the fact that it has never materialized, invites skepticism.
I find the alternate explanation that it's a psyop to be more convincing. A plane named Boch's car dropping a bomb named Fat Man represented a message to Japan that the Trans-Siberian railway (with its boxcars) would soon deliver Soviet (fat country) troops was to give them the choice of being occupied by the US or by the USSR. As a tool of propaganda, the atomic bomb is peerless and has been used ever since.
For the most part it's all rather abstract and meaningless in our daily lives except as a question of what to fear and whom to trust. I researched enough to find alternate explanations for the bombings and significant examples of the bomb used as propaganda. But people are rarely persuaded unless they convince themselves. If you're interested I'll drop a link to the place that got me started down this route.
(I really got started after seeing that half the medical press was based on deceit, but for the sake of the nuclear topic, the medical stuff was just the primer.)
The reactors on subs use fission, not fusion.
Thanks! I knew that -- NOTHING uses fusion yet (so far as I know), other than the sun and stars -- but my brain glitched.
Wait, were we the baddies?
If the military are given a new gun they just have to pull the trigger.
I think the Bomb was dropped as a "proof of concept " exercise, and many Americans believed (aided by the atrocities Japanese army committed in WWII) that the Japanese were subhuman and deserved to be made an example of.
"Proof of concept" could have been done by dropping the bomb on an uninhabited forest area, but I think you're right that anti-Japanese propaganda combined with actual reports of Japanese atrocities aided American acceptance of the bombings. My guess is that two civilian populations were targeted to show the world that A) we HAD such weapons and B) would use them callously to impose our will on the world -- so every nation would know we were the global hegemon.
Reasonable, but an actual proof of concept would have to be done with an actual population. That's why there were so many technicians on the ground at Hiroshima and Nagasaki as soon as Japan surrendered.
They were taking measurements, background radiation, interviewing survivors, taking photos, etc. It was a living (and dying) laboratory.
Blowing up an unpopulated forest would not have given them much data to work with.
Isn't the human species wonderful?
I agree that intimidation was at least part of the motivation.
Very possible that the US Govt wanted to test out their new Atomic weapons...Some of which they received from Germany.
The history regarding US receipt of enriched Uranium and infra-red proximity fuses via U-Boat U-234 after the German surrender is pretty well settled in Carter Heydrick's excellent book "Critical Mass". This enabled production of a bomb 6 or so months sooner than originally projected.
However more recent historical works suggest that "Fat Man" - the Uranium bomb dropped on Hiroshima (the 2nd bomb "Little Boy" dropped on Nagasaki, was a Plutonium bomb) could have actually been a captured German produced weapon. See Todd Riders "Hidden Creators" for more on this.
Especially if this is the case, I can see the CIC and OSS ( intel agencies before formation of CIA) insisting on using these weapons at any pretext, to get more info on their performance. Nasty people!
Further regarding Japan, I have read a few accounts of US military cruelty to the Japanese- things like troops pulling gold teeth out of the mouths of still living Japanese soldiers, not allowing surrenders, taking heads as trophies etc. etc. E.B. Sledge's "Withe The Old Breed" talks about this.
It strikes me that this story is very much the same as everywhere else..Japan had regular people, and regime people. In Japan , I think the regime people where especially bad, with little to no respect for human life (Unit 731, rape of Nanking, etc.).
I am not convinced dropping atomic bombs was necessary. In fact, I'm not even sure the invasion of Okinawa was necessary. On the flip-side though, it is likely we are STILL not privvy to the whole situation. With the info that is coming out regarding the German bomb (and other secret weapons) programs, it explains why Pattons 3rd army did not drive towards Berlin- they were scooping up tech programs and scientists instead.
Robert Wilcox, in "Japan's Secret War" claims the Japanese tested an atomic bomb off the coast of what is now North Korea hours before the Russians swooped in and took the area. If that is true, and there was concern about a Japanese bomb, that could explain why the US would bomb Japan- trying to end the war before the Japanese could operationalize an atomic weapon.