Don't be so sure. If industry wants to sell to the rest of the world, metric compatibility will be a necessity. In the late 1970s, we were dual-dimensioning military hardware in English and metric. There was no problem doing so. Most medical technology has long been in metric units.
If you have to deal with serious science, and go across the fields of mechanics, electricity, and chemistry, metric units are the way to go. You don't have to deal with awkward things like British Thermal Units, horsepower, and pounds meaning either/both mass and force.
There is a lot of utility in being familiar with the metric system. Objecting to learning it is just a defense of ignorance.
Only 3 countries in the world still use the 'imperial' system. Liberia, Myanmar and the United States. Probably good for tool makers, etc, as you have to buy both metric and standard imperial sizes.
It might be an ignorant defense, but I would not call it a defense of ignorance. Resistance to Metric is better described as defense of the familiar and avoidance of sudden disorientation.
Even in some countries that have converted to metric I notice that Imperial units maintain a hold in personal measurements. Canadians remember their weight in pounds and their height in feet and inches. A six foot two man is immediately recognized as tall and, outside of official documentation, is described 6'2", not as 188 cm. Some Brits will give you their weight in stones, of all things.
Two additional advantages of the metric system: i) it is uniformly power-of-10 based. ii) All units are connected to seven irreducible base units. ... SI is a clean-slate system of the organized mind. I believe science would not have progressed nearly as rapidly without it.
That said, astronomers still measure distances in parsecs, and communicate to the general public in light-years; both are tied to SI but are not strictly SI. Scientists too like sticking to familiar units of measurement.
My only point is that the rest of the technological world uses metric units and we have no choice but to master them if we want to sell products that integrate into that world. Go to any other country and find that they use meters, centimeters, millimeters, kilometers, kilograms, grams, and liters...with no conversion into English units. Simple prudence dictates the utility of being "numerate" in metric, if you want to travel the world.
Besides, there is little difference. A liter is nearly equal to a quart. A yard is 9/10ths of a meter. A kilogram is 2.2 pounds-mass. Etc. It only amounts to a handful of simple arithmetic conversions. It is not a big deal. And, as I mentioned, many of our accepted product areas (e.g., medicine and photography) are already established in metric measure. (And, besides, did you know there are two English systems of units? There is the system where force is measured in pounds and mass is measured in slugs. Or the system where mass is measured in pounds and force is measured in poundals. That is one hell of a headache. Along with BTUs and horsepower. I've done engineering in all these systems, and use metric by preference for the sake of simplicity and reduction of confusion.)
Astronomers measure distances in parsecs (parallax-seconds) only in conversation with other astronomers, for which the unit has some functional significance. Otherwise, they use lightyears...and I've read plenty of literature to testify to this. But lightyears have either metric or English measures. They also use Astronomical Units, which is a special measure, having no relation to either system, though they are defined in both systems.
You made multiple points, ending with a zinger of psychological attribution. But, for sake of making peace I'll grant you that your main point is just as you say. The benefit of supporting metric measurements and part sizes so that industry is equipped to sell into non-U.S. markets.
Since you ask, that's a yes and a no. I do know that there are differences between the Imperial and U.S. variant of the English system. The most familiar quantity being liquid volume. The Imperial gallon is larger than the American gallon. Almost exactly 20% larger, for a "bonus" 5th quart. But you got me on slugs and poundals. Your familiarity I gather is attributable to a career in aeronautics engineering.
Superfluous add-on commentary: When selling your space lasers in England, not only shall all dimension be in metric, take care to mount them in flying contraptions known as aeroplanes, with body and frame constructed from aluminium. To my ears there is nothing quite like a posh Londoner pronouncing a·loo·mi·nee·uhm on the BBC.
In my aeronautics and astronautics classes, I had to do force equations in pounds-force and slugs. A slug is approximately 32 pounds-mass. The rationale comes from good old F = ma. If you measure F in pounds-force, you need to measure mass in slugs, in order to come out with a in feet/second2. Same thing around for poundals and pounds-mass. Awkward as the Dickens. I barely recall the English unit for viscosity, but it is somewhat hilarious to say out loud without preparing the audience (slug-feet/second or something similar).
Yes, English has tons and "long tons" (2200 lbs, which are nearly identical to metric tons of 1000 kg). You mentioned the traditional "stone" for weight (14 lbs, but you think they could have used a dozen instead). The height of a horse (at the shoulder) is measured in "hands" (4 inches, or about 1 decimeter). It's all fun. A cubit is about half a meter.
When I was working on the ROLAND 2 program, I was part of the Technology Transfer phase, where we converted metric drawings in millimeters to English drawings in inches. Not really a problem. We just made sure that the inch equivalents of the tolerances were on the tighter side to the best thousandth of an inch, and life was good. There was a lot of anticipation that the TT phase would be a problem, but it was a profound non-problem. A machinist and his lathe could easily work to the thousandth of an inch. Our produced parts had higher regularity than the examples we received from France. For us, the tolerance was a requirement. For them, it was a goal. World of difference! (My first lesson in the differences between engineering cultures.) Many of the French parts were not in conformance "to print." We all were open-mouthed. How did they make the danged thing work? "File to fit and paint to match!" Not for us. Just easier to make it right the first time. During test flights comparing U.S. and European products, the U.S. missiles had visibly better flight response characteristics...but we were never able to claim reference to that in sales literature, because we were producing them to the same specifications, right?
But lasers are indeed all metric, over the world, power and optics alike. Anybody using English units would be pushed out of the room as being unintelligible. And military systems frequently used "nautical miles" which are longer than statute miles. (It turns out they are an even fraction of distance measured in degrees of arc across a global map. Some 6,000 feet or precisely 1,852 meters.)
If you think about it, there are other metals ending in "-um" (platinum, tantalum, molybdenum come to mind).
Thanks for the topic. It's an old favorite for me.
And you forgot something, they are killing people left and right with their vaccines. Their evil agenda is to reduce the world population in 500 millions.
It most certainly is about the trees, or more specifically the Ents. The largest of the "plants". The data centers will do them in, and their crummy corrupt "ecosystems". Good freakin riddance!
Dumbass always talk about how we need to replant them. It just shows how very very little they know. And it doesn't matter if a crop takes 20 or 40 years to grow, it's still a crop.
Cutting trees is good jobs,for the American people.
I remember when the commies supported the working class.
To be fair, replanting helps. I think I recall hearing that timber companies harvest every 17 years, so it makes sense to reasonably shorten the growing time.
In my lifetime, I have seen a particular hillside on the south of my home town, grown and harvested 4 times over my life, and I think I may have missed some recent cycles.
Yeah I'm not falling for the whole thing where they're like "oh my God AI data centers are destroying our country and killing our children we need to tax them out of existence"....
This stuff makes money roll my eyes so hard since I work in I.T.
What trees and ecosystems are being destroyed? If you don't like AI datacenters, at least use actual reasons for why you are against them. This is TDS all over again, people saying they hate President Trump for a million and a half reasons that are all made up and not true, or severely exaggerated.
There are plenty of reasons you can not like data centers. Complaining that they hurt trees and ecosystems is a pitiful reason. Just use actual reasons.
Haha, every month to this day my bank asks me to go paperless with the bank statements, with the "paperless" option prefilled. I rejected everytime. It's a game at this point, but the main reason is that if I unfortunately die, at least my next of kin will be aware of my accounts.
Ditto. It's very simple. "Going paperless" increases their convenience, not yours. I have noticed a lot of movements in the banking industry, and they all come down to making business more convenient for the bank by pushing the work onto the client. Yeah, I can do ever so much more electronically, but I prefer to show up in person and have the clerk do the work. I notice banks having few staff to serve patrons, and it becomes very clear that customer service is not really their guiding principle.
Also, if I have to do business with someone by making an internet account with them, that is a put-off for me. I just don't want to mess around with usernames and passwords.
In a world where you can convert CAD files to mm or inches with the click of a button - the whole inches vs millimeters "argument" is irrelevant. It really doesn't matter anymore.
Aside from stick framing and similar situations "in the field", SAE/Metrique isn't an issue. Any MAJOR project, product etc these days is going to be designed in CAD software. Units are ultimately meaningless...
In the USA, circa mid-1980s, auto manufacturers started the annoying "let's play guess the unit" game - forcing you to have BOTH SAE AND Metrique wrenches, sockets, tap/dies etc - since many vehicles were a hybrid of the old 1/64 or 1/128 inch system (GM for instance - all measurements were in 1/128 inches) and metrique. There were a WHOLE LOTTA rounded off nuts and bolts in those days until everyone understood it could be metrique...
This reminds of me of how many times dudes would completely round off the head of carburetor screws on Japanese motorcycles when they wanted to rejet them thinking they were Phillips screws...There are NO Phillips screws on ANY Japanese motorcycle ever made! They're JIS (Japanese Industrial Screw)!
Where’s Gen X? Y’all remember the poster with the Earth in the middle with the “Reduce, Reuse, Recycle” slogan?
Edit: Also Gen X. Government said “y’all are going to learn the metric system” and the teachers said - fvck that.
The USA was supposed to be fully metric by 1986. It seems like no one tried to make this conversion.
Don't be so sure. If industry wants to sell to the rest of the world, metric compatibility will be a necessity. In the late 1970s, we were dual-dimensioning military hardware in English and metric. There was no problem doing so. Most medical technology has long been in metric units.
If you have to deal with serious science, and go across the fields of mechanics, electricity, and chemistry, metric units are the way to go. You don't have to deal with awkward things like British Thermal Units, horsepower, and pounds meaning either/both mass and force.
There is a lot of utility in being familiar with the metric system. Objecting to learning it is just a defense of ignorance.
Only 3 countries in the world still use the 'imperial' system. Liberia, Myanmar and the United States. Probably good for tool makers, etc, as you have to buy both metric and standard imperial sizes.
It might be an ignorant defense, but I would not call it a defense of ignorance. Resistance to Metric is better described as defense of the familiar and avoidance of sudden disorientation.
Even in some countries that have converted to metric I notice that Imperial units maintain a hold in personal measurements. Canadians remember their weight in pounds and their height in feet and inches. A six foot two man is immediately recognized as tall and, outside of official documentation, is described 6'2", not as 188 cm. Some Brits will give you their weight in stones, of all things.
Two additional advantages of the metric system: i) it is uniformly power-of-10 based. ii) All units are connected to seven irreducible base units. ... SI is a clean-slate system of the organized mind. I believe science would not have progressed nearly as rapidly without it.
That said, astronomers still measure distances in parsecs, and communicate to the general public in light-years; both are tied to SI but are not strictly SI. Scientists too like sticking to familiar units of measurement.
My only point is that the rest of the technological world uses metric units and we have no choice but to master them if we want to sell products that integrate into that world. Go to any other country and find that they use meters, centimeters, millimeters, kilometers, kilograms, grams, and liters...with no conversion into English units. Simple prudence dictates the utility of being "numerate" in metric, if you want to travel the world.
Besides, there is little difference. A liter is nearly equal to a quart. A yard is 9/10ths of a meter. A kilogram is 2.2 pounds-mass. Etc. It only amounts to a handful of simple arithmetic conversions. It is not a big deal. And, as I mentioned, many of our accepted product areas (e.g., medicine and photography) are already established in metric measure. (And, besides, did you know there are two English systems of units? There is the system where force is measured in pounds and mass is measured in slugs. Or the system where mass is measured in pounds and force is measured in poundals. That is one hell of a headache. Along with BTUs and horsepower. I've done engineering in all these systems, and use metric by preference for the sake of simplicity and reduction of confusion.)
Astronomers measure distances in parsecs (parallax-seconds) only in conversation with other astronomers, for which the unit has some functional significance. Otherwise, they use lightyears...and I've read plenty of literature to testify to this. But lightyears have either metric or English measures. They also use Astronomical Units, which is a special measure, having no relation to either system, though they are defined in both systems.
You made multiple points, ending with a zinger of psychological attribution. But, for sake of making peace I'll grant you that your main point is just as you say. The benefit of supporting metric measurements and part sizes so that industry is equipped to sell into non-U.S. markets.
Since you ask, that's a yes and a no. I do know that there are differences between the Imperial and U.S. variant of the English system. The most familiar quantity being liquid volume. The Imperial gallon is larger than the American gallon. Almost exactly 20% larger, for a "bonus" 5th quart. But you got me on slugs and poundals. Your familiarity I gather is attributable to a career in aeronautics engineering.
Superfluous add-on commentary: When selling your space lasers in England, not only shall all dimension be in metric, take care to mount them in flying contraptions known as aeroplanes, with body and frame constructed from aluminium. To my ears there is nothing quite like a posh Londoner pronouncing a·loo·mi·nee·uhm on the BBC.
In my aeronautics and astronautics classes, I had to do force equations in pounds-force and slugs. A slug is approximately 32 pounds-mass. The rationale comes from good old F = ma. If you measure F in pounds-force, you need to measure mass in slugs, in order to come out with a in feet/second2. Same thing around for poundals and pounds-mass. Awkward as the Dickens. I barely recall the English unit for viscosity, but it is somewhat hilarious to say out loud without preparing the audience (slug-feet/second or something similar).
Yes, English has tons and "long tons" (2200 lbs, which are nearly identical to metric tons of 1000 kg). You mentioned the traditional "stone" for weight (14 lbs, but you think they could have used a dozen instead). The height of a horse (at the shoulder) is measured in "hands" (4 inches, or about 1 decimeter). It's all fun. A cubit is about half a meter.
When I was working on the ROLAND 2 program, I was part of the Technology Transfer phase, where we converted metric drawings in millimeters to English drawings in inches. Not really a problem. We just made sure that the inch equivalents of the tolerances were on the tighter side to the best thousandth of an inch, and life was good. There was a lot of anticipation that the TT phase would be a problem, but it was a profound non-problem. A machinist and his lathe could easily work to the thousandth of an inch. Our produced parts had higher regularity than the examples we received from France. For us, the tolerance was a requirement. For them, it was a goal. World of difference! (My first lesson in the differences between engineering cultures.) Many of the French parts were not in conformance "to print." We all were open-mouthed. How did they make the danged thing work? "File to fit and paint to match!" Not for us. Just easier to make it right the first time. During test flights comparing U.S. and European products, the U.S. missiles had visibly better flight response characteristics...but we were never able to claim reference to that in sales literature, because we were producing them to the same specifications, right?
But lasers are indeed all metric, over the world, power and optics alike. Anybody using English units would be pushed out of the room as being unintelligible. And military systems frequently used "nautical miles" which are longer than statute miles. (It turns out they are an even fraction of distance measured in degrees of arc across a global map. Some 6,000 feet or precisely 1,852 meters.)
If you think about it, there are other metals ending in "-um" (platinum, tantalum, molybdenum come to mind).
Thanks for the topic. It's an old favorite for me.
What’s “metric”?
Just a fad. It's on its way out.
Yeah, just 98.5% of the world's countries use it.
I laughed at it then. Lol
If anyone did drugs or still does, you know the metric system
"Earth in the Middle"... good one!
It's not about the trees.
It is about tracking your every movement and seizing your financial assets if you ever go against the cabal.
Same with Vaxxine Passports.
Same with Digital IDs.
Same with...
And you forgot something, they are killing people left and right with their vaccines. Their evil agenda is to reduce the world population in 500 millions.
They are not "vaccines". They are vaxxines, AKA BIO-WEAPONS.
It most certainly is about the trees, or more specifically the Ents. The largest of the "plants". The data centers will do them in, and their crummy corrupt "ecosystems". Good freakin riddance!
Lord of the Rings enters the chat. Thank you.
I'm just pointing out that cold hard cash isn't as controllable as digital money.
Trees are a delightfully renewable resource.
Trees are a crop just like corn or wheat.
Especially Pecan trees, I love me some Pecans.
Where I live, they are more like weeds. Turn your back on them for a year, and they will overgrow everything. Can't be stopped.
Dumbass always talk about how we need to replant them. It just shows how very very little they know. And it doesn't matter if a crop takes 20 or 40 years to grow, it's still a crop.
Cutting trees is good jobs,for the American people.
I remember when the commies supported the working class.
To be fair, replanting helps. I think I recall hearing that timber companies harvest every 17 years, so it makes sense to reasonably shorten the growing time.
In my lifetime, I have seen a particular hillside on the south of my home town, grown and harvested 4 times over my life, and I think I may have missed some recent cycles.
Yeah I'm not falling for the whole thing where they're like "oh my God AI data centers are destroying our country and killing our children we need to tax them out of existence"....
This stuff makes money roll my eyes so hard since I work in I.T.
Environmentalists are leading the charge against these Data centers as well. They were correct then and correct now.
What trees and ecosystems are being destroyed? If you don't like AI datacenters, at least use actual reasons for why you are against them. This is TDS all over again, people saying they hate President Trump for a million and a half reasons that are all made up and not true, or severely exaggerated.
There are plenty of reasons you can not like data centers. Complaining that they hurt trees and ecosystems is a pitiful reason. Just use actual reasons.
If you have no paper records
And
Everything is in the cloud
And
The cloud is just somebody else's hard drive
Then
Somebody else can make your records disappear.
Haha, every month to this day my bank asks me to go paperless with the bank statements, with the "paperless" option prefilled. I rejected everytime. It's a game at this point, but the main reason is that if I unfortunately die, at least my next of kin will be aware of my accounts.
Ditto. It's very simple. "Going paperless" increases their convenience, not yours. I have noticed a lot of movements in the banking industry, and they all come down to making business more convenient for the bank by pushing the work onto the client. Yeah, I can do ever so much more electronically, but I prefer to show up in person and have the clerk do the work. I notice banks having few staff to serve patrons, and it becomes very clear that customer service is not really their guiding principle.
Also, if I have to do business with someone by making an internet account with them, that is a put-off for me. I just don't want to mess around with usernames and passwords.
Just put your phone down turn off your computer and walk away…
Then how do we check up on what’s going on at GAW?
Echoes the “no fossil fuels” slogan…
Got it. God bless
Every reason is good enough it seems if it can help diss data centers.🥱
Metrique...
In a world where you can convert CAD files to mm or inches with the click of a button - the whole inches vs millimeters "argument" is irrelevant. It really doesn't matter anymore.
Aside from stick framing and similar situations "in the field", SAE/Metrique isn't an issue. Any MAJOR project, product etc these days is going to be designed in CAD software. Units are ultimately meaningless...
In the USA, circa mid-1980s, auto manufacturers started the annoying "let's play guess the unit" game - forcing you to have BOTH SAE AND Metrique wrenches, sockets, tap/dies etc - since many vehicles were a hybrid of the old 1/64 or 1/128 inch system (GM for instance - all measurements were in 1/128 inches) and metrique. There were a WHOLE LOTTA rounded off nuts and bolts in those days until everyone understood it could be metrique...
This reminds of me of how many times dudes would completely round off the head of carburetor screws on Japanese motorcycles when they wanted to rejet them thinking they were Phillips screws...There are NO Phillips screws on ANY Japanese motorcycle ever made! They're JIS (Japanese Industrial Screw)!
u/#catdance
Hypocrites!
Who is a hypocrite? Environmentalists are leading the charge against these Data centers as well. They were correct then and correct now.
These suckers kept talking about we wasting material but it's just another case of greedy behavior!
What are you talking about?