I have a freemason lodge right across the street from me. They are Christians who invite all faiths to worship God with them, and do community service work. There is nothing nefarious about it.
The Freemasons are a long standing organization which our founding fathers were a part of. Why should I believe that Christians like George Washington and others were part of an evil organization when I can just believe that anti-Christian groups are trying to demonize Christians?
If some reddit neckbeard is telling me that a Christian group is evil and bad, I am far more likely to think that the reddit neckbeard is a far left Christian-hating liberal. Who are these people making these claims against the Freemasons, exactly?
The same demonizing is made about the Knights of Templar, which were Catholic-Christians who opposed mass immigration and organized to protect their homeland.
BLT gets it. This.
Okay. But my response is that you are a liar or are otherwise repeating the words of liars. Now what do you have to show that these claims are true?
Human nature is pretty good evidence that what he said is true.
If the Freemasons were once a righteous organization, as I believe they were in George Washington's time, then of course the forces of evil would target it for corruption. What we know about 20th century Freemasons suggests that the org was fully corrupted by then.
@realeagle, I think you are on a trail there that many on this board will disagree with.
I tried to explain the other day WHY secrecy had to be imposed. It was to do with Roman Catholic Popes, and Kings, persecuting and killing those pesky Templars, or any other non-mainstream 'sect', for that matter - the first settlers to USA were running away from such persecution. As were the voortrekkers in South Africa.
Mostly, popes and kings went after Templars in an effort to cancel their excessive debts, BTW. The smearing, though. It's a bit like the Druids - native Brits - who even now, people believe the nonsense the Romans made up about them. [Insert Burning Man rituals].
I recently suffered a massive down-doot attack for broaching the subject of Freemasons. My research on the subject still hasn't confirmed anything otherwise, however. Even talking about Masons, had posters claiming that I was ignorant, etc.
I challenge those types to prove to me that all Masons have bad intentions. They can't. Or that somehow, diligence will turn sour, as people rise in the 'ranks' -- after all those years of 'pretending to serve the community'. The critics can't - the discourse becomes propaganda, so then, they say that all the good works 'on the ground' mean nothing, Which is ludicrous.
[insert screaming - downdoots incoming]
Meanwhile, USA was founded by Masons. Enlightenment-era, Christian, Masons.
The Dollar Bill even shows you that.
New York city is full of reminders.
Yes, there are bad apples in the mix. One cannot rule that out.
We can find a ton of liberals saying the exact same things about Christianity and Catholicism, and how it is really bad and evil, that they don't believe what they preach behind closed doors, and that priests are pedos or that they protect pedos, etc.
There are a ton of people who hate religion. Why shouldn't I assume that there are just more people lying and conspiring about a religiously-aligned organization?
Not true on the 33rd degree invite only comment, the 33rd degree is an honor that can only be bestowed upon a Scottish rite mason, and black mail is definitely not collected through initiation rights lmao. It’s hilarious to read and listen to non masons talk about masons like they actually know because they read it online.
I know a mason that quit after he figured it all out. He had a freemason bible - that had nothing to do with God or Jesus. It was about a god of light or some shit; So I'm pretty sure you're talking about a different set or crew.
Yeah that’s odd, we don’t have a bible that I’m aware of. It’s really like any other group, you’ve got your good and bad apples. It’s hilarious that people say the secrets are at the top and it is just evil people at the top lmao. It would be like being an astronaut that has literally seen the round earth hearing internet experts tell you that it’s flat. Anyone can literally become a mason to see for themselves. The mason I know aren’t evil 😆 but maybe that’s just my lodge or the ones I’ve frequented.
I found a copy of one of those Masonic Bibles along with some other books at the local public library that were also Masonic. The collection appeared to have been donated to the library by family members probably as a result of liquidating the estate of a high ranking Mason. I went back to the library a couple of days later to actually check it out and it had vanished along with the other books - something I found out later is common when Masons find these books out in the public sphere.
Yeah I’d love to have one for sure just for the nostalgia I guess. The only bible that I know these guys follow if you will is the King James Version but like I said, there’s bad apples in every organization. We don’t all worship one religion, we have one guy who just believes in a creator but doesn’t follow our bible. Most of us in my lodge were brought up Christian and remain that way to this day.
Yes, the Bible I saw was a King James. It was a beautiful publication and huge. There was a full color plate of George Washington on the inside front cover page wearing his Masonic regalia. I wanted to examine it more closely along with some of the other books I saw but they seemed not so straight forward and appeared a bit bizarre to me at the time. But, they were gone. It did not take long for someone to remove them. The day I saw them they were available for check out and had the library's cataloging numbers on them. I even looked into the library's files and they were no longer even listed in the system. The librarian thought I was nuts. "We have no record of those books ever being here."
I did manage to look at some other Masonic publications shown to me by the wife of a mason that was troubled by what she read in those books. I would have to agree with her having seen them. She was terrified even showing them to me because she was told not to even touch or read them herself. A sure way to get someone to do something is to tell them they can't. Lol. Her husband had them behind lock and key - but she is nosey and too curious to let it go. She is Catholic and wanted to know what her husband was hiding from her. The book appeared to be some variation of a Christian Kabbala/Gnostic theme which would explain the hush hush - only for the initiate of enlightenment so to speak. I will leave it there.
I know that Masonic lodges have within them many different flavors. Most are probably fine and filled with good people trying to do good for their communities that have good intentions. But, there are others that do lurk behind the scenes also within them. I think that fact leads to all the confusion. Any large enough institution can, and do, have not so good elements within them. But that is no reason to throw the baby out with the bathwater and try to paint everyone with the same brush.
I totally agree, the guys I know would do anything to defend this country. Many of us are prior service and a few are prior special forces that I am very close with, those guys are who I look up to and I love having them as brothers.
Not all freemasons are Christians. A great deal of them are not. That doesn't mean a freemason cannot "claim" Christianity as their "faith", many of them do.
1630, 1633, 4541, 4542
Freemasons are not Christian. They can be but it is not required. Only need a belief in a higher power. Templars ("modern" Templars) must be Master Masons and declared Christians. Knights Templars were Catholic Warriors, among other things. (Bankers)
Like banking, eh?
You go to the bank and put in money and get your money out and there's nothing nefarious about the banking system THAT YOU CAN SEE FROM YOUR PERSPECTIVE, so there's definitely nothing that could be going on that you're unaware of, right?
ROFLMFAO
In order for the bank to be nefarious it needs to be shown that they are nefarious. At present we have internet randos making wild claims about Freemasons eating babies and enslaving mankind.
The online conspiracy videos are equivalent to a homeless man standing outside of a bank, screaming to bystanders about the evil banks. Not really the best quality source there. We have no idea who those people in the videos are or if they have a bias which prevents them from being truthful.
Like when Wells Fargo was caught laundering money for Mexican drug cartels?
Sure. Wells Fargo personnel were sentenced to prison for those schemes. That means that Wells Fargo is bad.
But what similar expose is there for the Freemasons? So far the only real claim on this comment channel is that a prominent Freemanson wrote that Freemasons worshiped the devil, which we found was a widely known 1800's era hoax from a guy who spent his time writing anti-Catholic books - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L%C3%A9o_Taxil
To be anywhere near similar to your example we would need to see that Freemasons have been convicted of sacrificing people or whatever crimes are alleged against them.
Nobody from.the Biden crew that was using the autopen to pretend the president was approving things he wasn't has been convicted. We know it was happenimg.
Does the lack of a formal conviction in the cpurts mean it never happened? No, it means that there are power structures we aren't privy to which prevented a proper investigation and prosecution from happening.
The idea that Biden didn't know what bills were being signed or people were being pardoned is just an allegation though. It isn't something I would personally stand up for and champion as truth. It's easily possible that they did brief him on it and that he was giving thumbs up to all of it without much pushback.
And that is what we have for these Freemason claims: Allegations. We don't even really know who the allegations come from. They could come from modern people who hate religiously-aligned organizations, or they could just be modern people who are not specifically anti-religious zealots but who are jumping on a bandwagon that originated in the 1800's by people who sought to smear religiously-aligned organizations.
By backing this without evidence you are agreeing with people who you don't really know, potentially supporting their narrative which seeks to smear the name of good men like George Washington, Benjamin Franklin, Mozart, as well as more modern names like Theodore Rosevelt, Winston Churchil, and Sir Arthur Conan Doyle.
It is possible that these people were part of a wholly good organization which sought to do good and noble things. It is terrible to besmirch someone without evidence, casting scores of people with good reputations and good achievements in society as potential miscreants. Why are the good and accomplished conservative people in history the most likely people to be in league with Satan, over the people who are making those claims? Allegations are not enough.
I'm not certain of anything but I DO entertain the POSSIBILITY that the highest eschelons of the Freemasonry organizations fully embrace the universal truth that there is no such thing as "good" or "evil" and that some of them intentionally focus on doing negative things because they see it as part of God's plan.
Have you ever read the Law of One or the Hidden Hand interview?
The funny thing is, you don't want people to consider possibilities. You just want people to not think about why the elite do what they do at all.
"Obey. Follow your programming. Don't consider anything to be possible unless you see it on the news. We'll tell you what's real and what's not"
OP, the Illuminati infiltrated the Freemasonry lodges of Europe in the late 1700s. It was planned, and that plan exposed in Robison’s Proof of a Conspiracy. This book was sent to George Washington by a concerned citizen, and the two corresponded on it.
https://founders.archives.gov/documents/Washington/06-02-02-0435
My personal opinion is as follows: The founding fathers that were Masons were upright, moral men and Christians or Deists. At that time the American lodges were not part of the Illuminati infiltration playing out in Europe. Over time, they did infiltrate and takeover these lodges at the highest level, and they became part of the conspiracy.
From a broad view this is common sense. The cabal, etc., has infiltrated everywhere, to control all aspects of life on a global scale, and bring us to this point: the battle of Good and Evil, playing out now.
I'm sure there are plenty of men in the hierarchy of degrees who are as you say. But at the highest levels, I believe this, too, is compromised.
Let me add that within the branches and lodges of Freemasonry there may have been successful campaigns to wrest themselves from the Illuminist/Luciferian control - white hats vs. black hats. It would not surprise me if, among the MI leaders behind the Q movement, there are Masons who may fall under this speculation.
But they are secret societies and we have no way of knowing. Any trust given is to the face of their initiative (that which we call "Q"), the proofs as we believe them to be, and the populist instrument used (President Trump) - not in the secretive societies themselves. And rightfully so. Good or bad, how can you trust those that hide things and manipulate others?
I mean it’s really not even that secret nor is it hard to join. Any non mason can go down to their local lodge usually on a Saturday and get to know some of the guys, then after doing that for a few months you can become one yourself. Some people think it’s invite only or it’s so hard to get into, it’s not at all.
I believe you're referring to the lower degrees or initiates. I am not speaking to that..
Getting higher in the degrees is not hard either, nor is it invite only, I would know because I’m about as high as you can get. There are only 3 degrees in freemasonry, the 3rd is called a Master Mason. You can join appendant bodies like the York Rite or Scottish Rite and those will offer additional degrees but those are not considered higher in rank. To become a Knight Templar in the York Rite, you are supposed to be a Christian. We don’t really like non Christians going down the York Rite appendant body. I literally joined because I used to read this same shit on voat, I started following Q in OCT of 2017 when people first started talking about it. I wanted to know the truth for sure so I joined in 2018. Becoming a master mason does not take extremely long if you are active in the community and conduct yourself in a proper manner.
Well, you have your experience and perspective and are free to share it. In regards to what you say, I understand otherwise. I am not here to persuade or coerce, but to share. I'm not interested in that. I stand by my decades of research, and what I shared in my comments, and your feedback does not change that.
Good luck with Freemasonry. If it has meaning and purpose to you, and helps define who you are, that is your decision, and business.
Yeah no worries at all, I only commented because I did research as well since around 2004 when I was still in high school. I figured the only way to really know for sure was to join and I did. It’s super easy to leave too, just stop going to the lodge and community events lol.
Okay
Hellow fellow frogs. Look! Im just like you!
And no, I know you are saying that mockingly but I’m not like some “fellow frogs” 😂 I actually have a backbone and instead of spreading bullshit that I read online I went and discovered for myself lmao.
I guess, I got tired of reading about it and wanted to know for myself 🤷♂️ anyone can speculate online but actually figuring out something on your own is pretty rewarding. I guess I just wasn’t scared to try it… and before anyone says you can’t just leave, yes you absolutely can 😂 the rumors at this point are almost too comical to try to stop.
“They are Christians who invite all faiths to worship God with them, and do community service work”.
Did you mean to say all denominations or all faiths? All “faiths” are not the same.
Bible:
Matthew 5:33–37:
“Again, you have heard that it was said to the people long ago, ‘Do not break your oath, but fulfill to the Lord the vows you have made.’ But I tell you, do not swear an oath at all: either by heaven, for it is God’s throne; or by the earth, for it is his footstool; or by Jerusalem, for it is the city of the Great King. And do not swear by your head, for you cannot make even one hair white or black. All you need to say is simply ‘Yes’ or ‘No’; anything beyond this comes from the evil one.”
Freemasonry:
The Masonic Oath
https://nyenquirer.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/The-Masonic-Oath.pdf
I guess the oath to join the military would fall under this as well then.
Actually, this has been taken into account. Rather than swearing, you can affirm your oath. You are basically saying, "Yes, I will do this."
Enlisted Personnel Oath: "I, _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God."
Commissioned Officers Oath: "I, _____ (SSAN), having been appointed an officer in the Army of the United States, as indicated above in the grade of _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office upon which I am about to enter. So help me God."
What oath do masons swear to and is it any different than I ____ do solemnly swear etc?
Ha ha wth do you think they’re referring to when they claim “we’re giving ourselves to a higher power”?!?! If it was God, they would’ve said GOD!! Not higher power, or supreme power or like POS George w bush said “supreme beings”
Freemasonry historically is entirely built around esoteric eschatology. Albert Pike literally states in his writings that Lucifer is the entity that freemasonry is dedicated to.
That being said, what you are describing from personal experience is true. I liken the phenomenon to unions. Yes, they do some good for blue collar members but in the grand scheme of things union dues are spent on politics that the normie members do not align with and most probably do not even realize their contributions are used in a dubious manner.
In other words, the common rank & file members could be seen as useful idiots even if illustrating positive actions and harboring good intentions. At the end of the day, the bulk of the money they collect and send up the chain to the top is used for evil.
Albert Pike was a prominent freemason. I asked ChatGPT:
It responded:
It then went on with a long response about how it was a 1800's-era hoax to demonize freemasonry.
Morals & Dogma, archive link to sauce
Well, that's exactly the type of loaded false response you should expect from AI....
Straight from the horse's mouth. What more proof do you need? It's not my fault that plebian normies join a local community gentleman's club and do not realize that the organization at it's core is dedicated to the dark lord of the Earth, Lucifer.
That's not from the horse's mouth. I put that into Google search and Google AI said:
It linked me to this page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxil_hoax
The quote you provided appears in this section: "The Luciferian quote - A series of paragraphs about Lucifer are frequently associated with the Taxil hoax. They read:"
you put a good amount of faith in google, don't you?
And Wikipedia it would seem...
Tell me you’re not really interested in the truth without telling me you’re not really interested in the truth.
Jeeze-o-flip 🤦🏻♂️
what is the truth? what you get from google searches? really?
That was for the moronic OP, not you fren 😘
Link to the actual book, sauce again...
Don't come at me with AI, Google, and Wikipedia whataboutisms as counter points. The quote I originally linked is literally taken out of Morals & Dogma. You can read the book if you like or just keep believing canned AI search queries.
You want additional proof? Read up on Manly P Hall and other prominent "members" spilling the beans on the organization...
One cannot serve two masters. If you take the Masonic pledge then you've already compromised your faith and opened yourself up to spiritual degradation.
Yeah, stop lying to us.
I put this into google search:
"maintained in the purity of the Luciferian Doctrine" site:sacred-texts.com
Results: 0
Goog ai says:
In his writings, such as Morals and Dogma, Pike used "Lucifer" in its original Latin sense—the "light-bearer" or "Morning Star"—referring to the search for knowledge rather than a satanic entity.
I always found it strange that knowledge symbolized by light is literally demonized by religion.
Yeah that is odd…
I bet he didn't start the KKK either.
Killed my friend Rick insidiously through blackmail. Took a little over 2 years. He told me what they were doing. Asked me to be a pallbearer 9 months before his death. Was a sherriff's deputy, small town, all Masons. he purposefully left his family and binge drank until he died.
I told him to get out and he'd always say, "I can't " A nationally prominamt House of Reps member from here, who was a Dr and my friend!, was involved.
Rick was raised dirt poor, not the brightest bulb, loyal to a fault, and before he could turn back they blackmailed him sexually. Got him so out of his mind, passed out and posed him w teen mex girl. Also abused.
I loathe Masons above all others and am working on forgiveness, thereof.
Nextdoor neighbor demon Mason in the mid-60s, abused me and it stole 55 of my 63 yrs until Jesus healed me of cPTSD June 2, 2022; I acted normal and "succeeded " until i exhausted my reserves. My family knew, my closest friends knew, but co-workers, patients and aquaintances were oblivious. Just thought i was a fun party guy
No more nightmares, no more flashbacks, no more debilitating anxiety and agorophobia, no more self-loathing, no more self-isolation, no more praying for death, no more demons, no more blackness and anguish. No more meds, weed or alcohol x almost 5 years now. Gone in a twinkling. Got my family back, too.
I. AM. ALIVE.
I had no idea people lived like this and in color, too! All truth. Happiest man alive! I'd trade just one day of now for every hellish day i endured in the past. The Joy outweighs the pain exponentially. It's that good.
No words exist in man's language, the best i can do is EXUBERANT !
Romans 12:12 Psalm 40:1-5
Praise God for your healing! cPTSD is no joke.
Thanks, fren. Means so much.
Sounds like a lie.
Ignorance, mockery, denial of truth and the sowing of discord is not worth the time or emotional expense, nor is douche-baggery.
You sound vaxxed.
Petty b.s. is blocked.
You are actually so naive and blind that I don’t think anything we say here would really get through to your brain lmao
Well that's the problem, you're saying, not showing. Anyone can say anything.
I was looking into one of the historical hoaxers who was claiming that Freemasons were evil and it seem that he spent his time writing anti-Catholic books - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L%C3%A9o_Taxil
How do we know, exactly, that the conspiracy theorists are not simply people who hate Christians/Catholics/Religion?
I'm gonna help ya out here a little, take it or leave it. If you want any respect and want to be taken seriously, stop saucing wiki and AI slop. If you use AI at least go to the sources it's drawing from and confirm and take things into context..
I applaud you for questioning and asking. That's what we do. Even if it goes against the so called status quo of the group.
The Wiki page I linked to said it was a widely known hoax. You're going to have to address that and show that it's not. If prominent Freemasons were writing in books that they worship the devil that should be pretty easy to prove, right? But no, instead you choose to deny that the matter is in question.
I'm not denying shit. Just tryin to help ya out. Shill away and slide on bud. We see you.
Who or what is "The Great Architect of the Universe"? Is it/they/them tied to any religion?
What does the "G" stand for In the middle of the Compass and Square?
Who cares? You guys are pointing to stupid shit like special handshakes and jump to the conclusion that they are controlling the world and eating babies. The Boy Scouts also have special symbols and have a special handshake. Several US Presidents were Boy Scouts. By the same logic exhibited about the Freemasons, the Boy Scouts were controlling the US Government during those presidencies.
Seriously, look in the mirror on how stupid you sound when you say things like that.
When I 'say' things like that? I asked questions, Einstein. Questions you won't answer.
Hey guys, this person whom has never even bothered to look into the issue AT ALL in ANY way, shape or form says theres nothing to look at, and he KNOWS this, because he's... never looked into it.
Mainstream media brainwashees assume that "if it's real, it would be all over the news", not realizing that the "news" is just another facet of an active brainwashing system.
if you feel the freemasons are such good folk, why not just join with them? then you can tell us from the inside....
I'm suspicious of secret societies and ancient cults in general, as JFK was. All the behind-the-scenes organizations are part of the reason why we're in the mess we're in to begin with.
Where do they describe themselves as a secret society? The boy scouts and various sororities have a special handshake to identify themselves too.
The Boy Scouts don’t swear an oath to be cut in half, burned and spread to the four corners of the earth if they reveal Boy Scout secrets.
Do you have an actual working brain? Your presence here doesn’t seem to be rooted in trying to get to the truth so much as it is to defend the honor of the freemasons.
Is this your little personal project to attain the next rank?
OP is probably just trying to reach Master Mason so he can be a Shriner, get one of the little red cars, and wear the lampshade hat.
As far as I can see from researching that is that oath references something Fremasons were reciting in the 1800's, which mirrors various military organizations and other groups. The Catholic organization who united against mass immigration, the Knight's Templar, made a similar oath promising to submit themselves to death if they betray their brethren. The dramatic wording is meant to convey seriousness.
You shouldn't betray your brothers, even if you are a religious group who worships God. They get a pass from me.
According to their own book: Dogma & Morals: Man is above system.
Tell me: how has that been going for them?
Clearly there is a distinction between what OP thinks is being seen, and what really is going on.
Apparently you have no clue about the dark forces behind the illuminate🤦♂️
Don’t you realize the Vatican was infiltrated by the illuminate? In 1823! If they’ve ran the Vatican and the Catholic Church since then, how long since they first infiltrated the freak masons?!?
Much to learn, you have, my young padawan
It's murkier than most let on. The bottom rungs are largely good people{though not all, another misnomer}.
The upper rungs have been usurped by the bad Masons (which originate from other sources), but over a long period of time. I believe there's always been different sects to it, and much like any organization that will accept human leadership, one tries to force the other into their way of doing things.
It appears for the past 125 years, the bad sect has had majority control.
My assessment as well. Just look at the roster of 20th century Freemasons.
Have heard it said that the org has been cleansed / purged in recent decades, but I remain skeptical.
You really don't have any proof to the contrary and you should not be calling someone else a liar. I read a book a long time ago written by a man who was an ex-mason, and it opened my eyes to the corruption within that organization. I can't remember the name of the book or the man who wrote it, wish I could, but you probably won't believe it any way. I do not trust Google search, Wikipedia, or AI, and maybe you shouldn't put so much stock in it. Just my humble opinion. Continue your search for the truth.
Masons don't swear an oath to Jesus or Christianity. Knowing that go read their oaths.
Then ask yourself if they aren't doing sketchy shit and just giving back. Why have these oaths in place?
Its not like new members or the public are exposed to whats happening behind the curtain. It shocks me that people think you will just walk into a lodge and see evil in plain sight. Naive jabrones.
I did freemasonry one time...
It totally sucked.
First bad experience with a hoe... Couldn't be "too wet"... but not too dry either. SO HOT!
I got Shanghai'd into it - late July...15 shovels of sand to a bag of mortar...BIG ass mortar box. 4 bags at a time...Crew yelling to hurry up...I think I was like 14 or 15.
u/#sassypopcorn
And you didn’t even get paid!
…since you did free masonry 🤣
Ed Zachary!
Can always count on u/TaQo to bring kek worthy levity to the discussion!
Speaking of which, I might need me some of this so-called good free masonry. I've been wanting to build a new shit-house using forbidden sacred geometry with the all seeing eye of Ra as the light fixture so that whenever someone pops a squat they can count on dark forces shining down on them when they are their most vulnerable!
Grandpa was a High Priest. He said it requires belief in a Supreme Being. It's rather vague to outsiders. Mom said they never went to church until he joined.
My grandpa was a Mason, never went to church that I know of. 🤷♂️
Church is 2 or more people discussing God, many of us would like to get closer to God outside of a building called church…
I agree, and am not a churchgoer myself except for occasional holiday service.
My grandfather was not religious at all, far as I know. He never spoke about God. So the point remains - not all Masons are Christian.