This is the thread for everyone with strong positions on Bitcoin (for or against) to engage in productive debate. Please be mindful, be respectful, stick to objective analysis and check emotions in the door!
Added: In the two hours since this was stickied, there is already tons of incredible info in this thread. Highly encourage everyone to read the comment threads before starting a new thread!
Years ago, the Bitcoin network became slow and expensive to use. A debate arose over how it should be fixed. One camp was for increasing the block size (allowing more transactions per block on the blockchain). The other camp was for small blocks and using "side chains" to cheaply and quickly process bitcoin transactions. EDIT: off-chain transactions is more accurate than the term sidechain
Coincidentally, a company called Blockstream, funded by Epstein (that's right, funded by Epstein), was developing a system for processing Bitcoin transactions off of the blockchain, using side chains. This system is called the Lightning Network.
Satoshi, the creator of Bitcoin, designed it to have growing block sizes. The more libertarian types in the crypto world (the OG crypto people) were for sticking with Satoshis vision for Bitcoin. But in the end, the noobs fell for the propaganda and Bitcoin was stuck with small blocks, sidechains, and the lightning network.
As a result of the small blockers gaining control of Bitcoin, the big blockers forked the bitcoin blockchain, creating a new bitcoin called Bitcoin Cash. In my opinion, this is what Bitcoin was designed to be, a peer to peer cash system. Cheap, fast transactions.
That's just how I remember it. This happened maybe 6 years ago. Details may be off here or there.
The Lightning Network is not a side chain. It uses Bitcoin scripting itself. It's literally Bitcoin using multisignature channels. Transactions are instant and the fees are pennies or less.
Blockstream did create a side chain, but it's called L-BTC (Liquid). They did not create the Lightning Network.
I'd like to see your proof that Epstein funded Blockstream though.
Thanks for adding nuance. Back then, during the debate, Lightning Network was pretty universally referred to as a sidechain as opposed to a "second layer" or "off chain."
Blockstream was heavily lobbying for small blocks, iirc. It's been years since I read about Epsteins involvement, but I'm sure you'll find it if you want dig.
Bitcoin Cash (aka just the original Bitcoin as it was designed by Satoshi) has transactions that are instant and fees that are pennies or less without needing another layer.
The block size of Bitcoin Cash makes running a node increasingly difficult due to the IBD. Given the same number of blocks, BCH would require approximately 16-32x as much hard drive space, which would also make it incredibly time consuming in areas of low bandwidth, which would de-incentivize node running and therefore, decentralization.
Satoshi discovered a wonderful thing, but he is not the end all, be all regarding Bitcoin. He made many mistakes along the way and with the help of other freedom-minded cypherpunks, was able to solve a lot of problems.
I'm not talking about miners. I'm talking about nodes. I'm also referring to internet bandwidth. There are still issues in non-first world countries.
You're free to run whichever version of Bitcoin that you want, but it's clear where developers see the most utility in the present and foreseeable future. There is a reason The Blocksize Wars ended the way they did.
I also don't see any large banks, hedge funds, or intelligent investors placing their bets with Bitcoin Cash. There is good reason for that too.
There is a reason The Blocksize Wars ended the way they did.
To impose a degree of centralization onto a previously decentralized network
I also don't see any large banks, hedge funds, or intelligent investors placing their bets with Bitcoin Cash.
Let's acknowledge that the point of Bitcoin was to destroy those institutions. They're just embracing the coin with the largest market cap. If Bitcoin weren't hijacked, they would be embracing pure, decentralized, big-blocked Bitcoin.
It was obvious back then that the shady team were the small blockers. The Big Blockers were definitely more liberty focused. As someone who has followed bitcoin since 2010, I can say that those in favor of layer 2 scaling are not the same liberty-loving breed as the OG's.
I'm not recommending that any reader should buy Bitcoin Cash. I'm saying that without a propaganda campaign that changed bitcoin, there'd have been no need to create Bitcoin Cash. Bitcoin Cash is not Bitcoin, however. It's just a copy of what Bitcoin was supposed to be.
As an attendee to many liberty/crypto conferences, I can confidently say that the real anarcho-capitalists/ freedom loving people are the Bitcoin Cashers BCH. The Bitcoin maximalists were those that wanted to play nice with the big banks and governments, pay taxes, ID verification, etc early on. Look up any debate between Roger Ver and Tone Vays to see BCH vs btc. Roger Ver actually understands liberty and Austrian economics and Tone Vays is... well, a jew. Tone never even showed up to the liberty crypto conferences, whereas Roger set me up with a wallet and sent me Bitcoin back in the day just to show me how it works. If you own Bitcoin and don't move it, cool. But I actually used Bitcoin a lot early on and I remember those crazy fees in 2017 with btc. If it's intangible, price should follow it's utility. On the other hand, we don't have rational markets and now that Bitcoin has other mainstream adoption vehicles that are not bitcoin, plus tether and other stable coins etc, btc can be manipulated and I think it is. I think THEY will blow Bitcoin way way up, then crash it, and then roll out CBDCs as the solution to their Hegelian dialectic
You're telling me that in 2024, the average consumer electronic device can't handle downloading and processing more than 1MB of data every 10 minutes? That is less than a floppy disk and the average YouTube video takes more bandwidth.
And running a node does fuck all for the network if it's not contributing hashrate. The only reason to run a node without mining is if you run a business where verifying transactions is mission critical. The average person does NOT need to run their own node. This is part of the small-blocker narrative that makes absolutely no sense when you think about it.
I believe the Epstein connection was to Joichi Ito who created DCI, which was involved with helping Bitcoin Foundation when they were low on funds.
Not sure he is tied to Litecoin, but that does not mean Lighting Network itself is not yet another controlled operation. Long back when litecoin was all the rage on social media, it seemed like there was a suspicious concerted push. I wont be surprised if some links to the Cabal get exposed at some point.
Litecoin and lightning network are not related. Litecoin is basically a clone of BTC with more supply and faster blocks. LN is a secondary network layer that runs on top of BTC (I think LTC gets used to test out new ideas before implementing them in BTC, so it has its own version of LN).
Wow followed BTC all these years and I’ve never heard it this way. But the way bitcoin is, far too slow and expensive for mass adoption. A decade in and people don’t quite know how to set up wallets and private keys
i'm not against crypto as a general rule, in fact I expect Crypto /blockchain to be used in the new stock market that will come to pass. that being said, i believe bitcoin was designed from the ground up to just be another way to steal (among other things). and not simply co opted by black hats
You can make a pretty good case that bitcoin has been positioned to, and is successfully diverting a massive amount of investment away from physical precious metals. This is buying them time and preventing the fraud in those markets from being exposed.
Just about everything bad happening in the world, all of the wars, child sex trafficking, etc, is funded with printed money. The national debt per taxpayer is $260,000+ because of fiat currency. The powers that be exist because of printed money. There is no earthly hope for freedom while we are being evermore enslaved by their debt-based currency system.
Bitcoin is the only earthly hope that I'm aware of. Do you have any arguments for your hunch that it's designed for theft? Do you have a better idea than crypto for saving the world? Keep in mind we tried gold and it failed.
That's a bit disingenuous - gold didn't "fail", they shut it down so they could spend and print to oblivion. The gold window was closed via executive order by Nixon in August 1971, literally over a weekend at Camp David with almost no explanation. Executive orders can be overridden by another executive order.
Another fun fact, the FBI was created via executive order.
My .. large issue with bitcoin, and other non backed cryptos.. it's still a fiat currency. there is nothing backing it.
and it's always sold , as if it isn't. the people that promote it, they always say "well there's a fixed amount of bitcoin, therefore it's limited. but the reality is, that doesn't matter, just because something is scarce doesn't make it valuable, or intrinsically worth anything. and it's all a lie anyway for two reasons, , it's nearly infinitely divisible (just like the fiat dollar) and anyone ANYONE, can make their own cheap crypto and put it on the market. , you cannot do that with gold, , in order for crypto to be worth anything, and become a good currency, it has to be backed by something in real life.
bitcoin is not the savior of the world,, pretty much just the opposite so far, you say the US dollar has been used for all these crimes, so is bitcoin. explain to me how Bitcoin stops any of it? because so far it's just been used as pump and dumps, and manipulations
there is a REASON, these assholes got rid of Gold, . it didn't let them steal as easily.
I sure wouldn't trade gold for bitcoin but you can buy gold with bitcoin and a couple other crypto. So if that becomes more common I could get on board.
That's the thing with bitcoin. It either works or it doesn't. You can't just confiscate it. You can't ban it. You can't do anything about it. Not in theory, at least.
I love the idea of bitcoin, but I think the technology exists to crack or confiscate it. Anything that is created digitally can be destroyed digitally.
There seem to be a few plausible narratives that could support a diabolical strategy with totalitarianism, slavery, eugenics, population reduction, population control and wealth transfer as its end goals:
TPTB want to phase out cash, force through CDBCs to get us to digital IDs and the prison planet, aka digital - or actual - gulag.
Fiat and cash are how the whole thieving, corrupt shitshow survives and thrives: any suggestion to replace with CDBC is fearporn / psyop / distraction / chaos etc
CDBCs are co-opted cryptos. Cryptos are a scam / trap set up by TPTB. Use catastrophic Black Swans to force through the upheaval. (See Cyber Polygon and Catastrophic Contagion)
Bait and switch is now possible: move the slaves to CDBC cryptos and digital ID, rollout the surveillance, social credit and control grid, continue with fiat and printing cash. Or crypto. Or not. At that point, all will be moot. They could introduce barter, Monopoly money or no system at all. The slaves would be powerless.
TPTB want to phase out cash, force through CDBCs to get us to digital IDs and the prison planet, aka digital - or actual - gulag.
Decentralized cryptocurrency is the only tool we have to avoid that, afaik. CBDC's are not decentralized, and are unlikely to be cryptocurrencies at all.
Fiat and cash are how the whole thieving, corrupt shitshow survives and thrives: any suggestion to replace with CDBC is fearporn / psyop / distraction / chaos etc
CBDC are not decentralized cryptocurrencies. Your dollar is already almost 100% digital. Banks are already freezing people's bank accounts. Decentralized cryptocurrency cannot be frozen.
CDBCs are co-opted cryptos. Cryptos are a scam / trap set up by TPTB. Use catastrophic Black Swans to force through the upheaval. (See Cyber Polygon and Catastrophic Contagion)
You're conflating CBDC and crypto again.
Almost all dollars are digital currently. If the grid goes down, the dollar is not going to save us.
It's possible to have paper notes for crypo as well, using the same system as banks used to issue gold certificates. That's how paper money began circulating.
Bait and switch is now possible: move the slaves to CDBC cryptos and digital ID, rollout the surveillance, social credit and control grid, continue with fiat and printing cash. Or crypto. Or not. At that point, all will be moot. They could introduce barter, Monopoly money or no system at all. The slaves would be powerless.
Unlike the dollar and CBDC's, crypto is voluntary. You can't be forced to use it.
Thank you for your patience with this layman. So if cryptos are truly voluntary and independent, dare I say incorruptible by TPTB hands, able to weather a collapse of fiat and cash or a forced push to CDBC but always digital, never physical, then our only concerns about them losing value or indeed being vanished would be:
blockchain sequestering / confiscation
civilisation collapse / no electricity
cyber crime by state / institutional actors
Fungibility is still important right up to the moment the lights go out.
I actually don't have any. I'm not interested in it to get rich. I'm interested in it because it's the only known hope to the biggest problem the world faces.
During the Trump Administration. there was crackdown on illegal criminal activity, especially human trafficking, fueled by Bitcoin and this did change criminal behaviors, especially after Backpage was shutdown.
Back to business under Biden...
Crypto Increasingly Used In Human/Drug Trafficking Says GAO
I'm sorry, I didn't notice your reply. I just wanted to say what I think you already know. These articles are pure propaganda.
Christians aren't looking forward to a one world currency. Well, we already have one. Almost all (if not all) currencies are debt based currencies. They are debt. The one world currency is the precise inverse of money - debt.
I can understand this sentiment, but i have a more nuanced theory. Bitcoin was a "schrodinger's tech" much like everything else that has developed since the turn of the millenium.
By this, what I mean is that both the white hats and black hats allowed the creation of Bitcoin for different reasons. BHs definitely needed a new vehicle to hide their financial crimes after the 2008 Fed money printers were turned on to full speed. The timing of the Bitcoin whitepaper is not a coincidence.
WHs on the other hand realised that the blockchain provides the best way to track criminal activity and allowed this to hit the society, because they knew that it would provide the taste for a "freedom currency", becoming especially crucial in the final stages of Awakening (as in now).
BHs on the other hand made sure that Bitcoin implementation ended up becoming clunky and inefficient, so that it could never actually become the "freedom currency" and give us freedom.
WHs were perfectly fine with this, because the taste of freedom is good enough. Once people hunger for something, even if its yanked away, they will create it for themselves in future.
Over all, Bitcoin has shown us the dream of the future - what a really free free-market society would look like, but at the same time given the BHs the false sense of security that seems to be so prevalent everywhere as part of this Devolution plan.
BHs on the other hand made sure that Bitcoin implementation ended up becoming clunky and inefficient, so that it could never actually become the "freedom currency" and give us freedom.
The way this happened was with Satoshi inserting the 1MB per block limit. It was always meant to be removed but after Satoshi left the project and it was commandeered by Blockstream, they made sure to cement it in permanently to create artificial scarcity so it couldn't scale.
It's like if we talking about the printing press, and if back then they said "we have to limit all printing presses so that no book can be longer than 100 pages, because if books are longer than 100 pages, nobody would be able to afford to print their own books!"
Good analogy, but I have always found it a bit difficult to understand how people fell for a 1MB limit in 2010 - when computational scarcity was already a thing of the past. Its not like they couldnt foresee that it would become a bottleneck soon down the road.
At the time Bitcoin was just a few people running the software on consumer laptops and desktops which was not providing much hashpower. Satoshi wanted to prevent potential bad actors from renting out a massive server farm to spam attack the network with 1GB blocks which would have basically stopped Bitcoin dead in its tracks in those early days.
Satoshi left instructions for how to gradually increase and eventually remove the limit altogether, but Blockstream insisted on making it permanent. Bitcoin Cash is now at a 32MB limit and will be changing to dynamic block limits later this year.
If I remember correctly, wasnt there a point where a huge transaction was in the queue that was going to grind the whole Bitcoin to a halt which forced them to make the change quickly? Or was that something else unrelated to block size?
Bitcoin/crypto was stood up to be the "pressure release valve", for those that know fiat currency and the stock market is a complete scam, but wanted someplace to park their wealth in an attempt to flee the financial system. The Cabal needed a system to "compete" with their fake Central Bank system, they could push, in order to make sure they capture 99% of the wealth when the system they designed to crash in the first place.....fully collapses.
The Cabal always uses sleight of hand to "look here, not over here" and then attacks the systems that are most "counter-Cabal", if you will. Crypto is very well talked about in all of the mainstream financial news, in the year of our Lord two thousand and twenty four. This should be another red flag.
The true "pressure release valve" to the Central Banking system, is and has always been, gold and silver. This is why gold and silver have been continuously manipulated by the COMEX ever since the Hunt brothers tried to corner the physical silver market back in the 70s. Once the Hunt brothers found a flaw in the Cabal system, they quickly moved to correct it - by using COMEX to create fake shares of the physically held precious metals. If precious metals were ever able to show their true colors and they actually were valued in relation to the amount of fake currency in the US petrodollar system, it would be game over for the Cabal - people would quickly realize what "true value" actually is in this day and age. Obviously, the Cabal must stop that at any cost, hence the manipulation.
The "Meme" stock saga has helped show the people that the stock market has been a Cabal design (adult gambling) since the beginning and it's fully manipulated - they can use dark pools and other tricks to essentially make up stock out of thin air and manipulate them at-will. Kudos to the White Hats here, because this exposure is needed to 1) Wake people up to the scam that is our fake financial system 2) Help divert Cabal financial resources that would have gone to prop up other parts of their system on control (e.g human trafficking) 3) Educate people on how the financial system ties into the Globalist system of control (and the implications of it).
Gold and silver are continually attacked in all financial news, even when it goes on a run, and only the "negatives" are discussed and only in relation to the present-day system of credit and debt. Nevermind that we've used gold and silver as MONEY for thousands of years to store our wealth and as a value of the labor we produce with our own two hands.
I feel that bitcoin will never become cash as it has too many flaws, but do think it will remain a store of value like a digital gold.
One of the biggest problems is the 51% attack which as one group already controls over 51% and all the mining hardware is only made by a few people that is a big problem for the future.
They have already been messing with transactions and there is a lot of involvement with blackrock and such to subvert Bitcoin by controlling the mining operations which need loans from blackrock to start up, they could start to deny certain wallet addresses and transactions if they had enough of the hashpower.
I do hope that is not what happens but there are a lot of dark forces at work.
One of the original developers for Bitcoin Synth ended up creating Skycoin to solve the problems of bitcoin, one of the reasons they got rid of mining is they knew that if there was a incentive to mess with the mining and transactions that is what would happen.
You can get Skycoin for running nodes on the Skywire meshnet which is going to be a replacement for the current broken internet, secure and encrypted each packet looks identical so you cannot do deep packet inspection.
They are also designing open source hardware, they made there own wallet, various prototype routers and such, how many other projects have even made anything.
The project has suffered many attacks over the years, the new yorker ran fake news article about it as did others, the people behind this have been threatening Synth and his family for years, he is currently suing them all for this.
But they have continued development and Synth is a great man that hates the cabal as much as we do but does not believe in Q strangely but he wants the same sorts of things as we do and is always talking about the cabal and what they are upto, he has never quit no matter what.
How many other projects are still even going after all these years.
Its one of my favorite projects in crypto even if has not made me rich haha, just the ideas behind it could solve so many of the problems we face.
I know i sound like a shill but i don't care if people got behind this project and helped Synth we could have a whole different future.
To me its not about the "moons" but the future of the internet and i do not see anyone else that is even trying to solve these problems.
Also you can install Skywire meshnet on a raspberry pi or similar and get a small amount of rewards but you can be helping make a better world.
Anyway that is my soapbox for the day.
Skywire can be used as a proxy and also a VPN, its still early days but for example you could use it connect two computers over the internet and have a secure connection.
The Meshnet is meant to run over the top of the internet or from point to point wifi links.
At the moment you get few Skycoin per node up to 8 nodes, not huge money at the current price but in the time i have done it i have made more money than the 8 raspberry pis cost and the power to run them, not life changing but still fun.
Thanks, thats what I wanted to know. Second question - what do you gain currently if you hold any skycoins? Does the meshnet require, for instance, payment in skycoin ? Can you buy anything with the skycoin right now?
Bitcoin is meant to be highly scalable and some of the branches like Bitcoin Cash follow this path while the original was subverted. This was gone into quite a bit in the Crypto Conspiracy series. Quite a few connections to Epstein were looked into as well and discussed Evergrande, Tether, FTX, Executive Order 13818, etc.
I think this is the episode, Kurt Wuckert is very knowledgeable in the history of Bitcoin and went into when it got subverted in one of his first appearances. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yafHqOTlyao
Security researcher and developer Antoine Riard is stepping down from the Lightning Network’s development team, citing security issues and fundamental challenges to the Bitcoin ecosystem.
According to a thread on the Linux Foundation’s public mailing list, Riard believes the Bitcoin community faces a “hard dilemma” as a new class of replacement cycling attacks puts Lightning in a “perilous position.“
I trust Cardano over others. There's a lot of positives about Cardano the deeper you dive into the technicals on how it works. I encourage you to not just hear it from me but take a look yourself.
Cardano is a cool science project, but it isn't a commodity like Bitcoin and Bitcoin Cash, it's a centralized security with a known creator, a Proof of Stake (piece of shit when it comes to currency utilization, Satoshi used PoW for a reason to solve a very important problem), and funded by a foundation that takes money from the very people Bitcoin was created to deplatform. We the people were to rally around Bitcoin and use it, and in time force the governments and their ilk to play by our rules, not us play by theirs.
Bitcoin Cash (and Monero you could argue) is the only coin that is attempting to carry on Satoshi's design, sharing the genesis block and all other blocks prior to the fork in 2017. Kaspa seems to be the new sweetness around in regards to peer-to-peer currency but I've heard that before with RaiBlocks/NANO so time will tell whether Kaspa develops into an actual contender or not.
A Proof of Stake (piece of shit when it comes to currency utilization,
Cardano's proof of stake is liquid so you can stake and unstake at will. Also it is non custodial no matter what stake pool you stake to with a minimum stake of 1 Ada.
The proof of stake protocol is used to secure the protocol so you are essentially voting with your tokens what stake pool you want to secure the protocol, getting paid for it if your stake pool is picked, and incurring no risk of losing Ada when staking. Proof of stake is also at least 20,000 times more energy efficient than Bitcoin in practice.
Bitcoin Cash is trash with no smart contracts and no users. I'll tip my hat to Monero, that one is actually useful.
Yes, it was co-opted to be slow and expensive. This was the reason for the split to Bitcoin cash BCH. That's where the real Bitcoin is IMO. I was involved since 2014, and I think the world will eventually come around to bch more and more. The Bitcoin minimalist crowd is brainwashed and co-opted, and most of them don't use Bitcoin to transact or understand it. Transactions need to be fast and cheap to be useful
I was in BCH for a time. The numerous bitcoin variations was too much for me. I was in ETH for a time then EOS with the promise of fast and fee less transactions. I even got to using their limited dapps. But the ecosystems never amounted to anything.
So many promising ideas but very little came to fruition
Help me understand. If the creators of banking, let’s call these ultra-rich families “leaders of the cabal”, if they can print endless fiat money, said money can be used to buy Bitcoin! They print infinite money and then buy infinite bitcoin- and of course perhaps its derivatives (alt coins) too.
Then what this means is the cabal has digitized their printing press and can also manipulate and control bitcoin. Am I wrong?
What does this change for the working man? The cabal’s purchasing power is still infinity relative to the average Joe.
Just because it was first doesn't make it "the one". Just because it's currently valued the highest doesn't make it "the best". I'm sure everyone counting on Bitcoin still uses Napster to download music.
The idea of blockchain was already in a whitepaper that came out in late 90s, but did not address the double spend problem.
BTC got implemented and was usable because it solved the double spend problem. I am not sure if others had already solved this problem before this (hard to imagine no one had come up with a solution).
You are damn right about the ENDLESS amount of energy. That is the biggest obvious flaw in the idea of bitcoin.
A digital currency should represent potential energy, not energy already expended simply to prove that you did not double spend the coin you had.
The energy usage of Bitcoin is a feature, not a bug.
It creates an incentive for seeking out the most efficient energy sources. It turns greed into a productive value. Miners look for the cheapest energy possible, they do not benefit from being wasteful.
Any currency requiring an internet connection should be scrutinized. Certificates backed by gold produce private transactions. Governments have no right to any transaction information.
I understand there are bitcoin investors here, just remember. You can eat your betting money, but never bet your eating money.
24-18-16 as already been adopted by 100s of banks for cross boarder payment. Contracts already signed; waiting for just the right moment to flip the switch. 2-20-3 discussed is a massive red herring.
Anything that can be bought with fiat is controlled by those with the most money.
It really is that simple.
IF you can buy bitcoin, so can they, but they can buy/sell enough volume to move the market putting you at their mercy and whims.
I wouldn't bother arguing with folks on this fren. Crypto currency supporters really are highly intelligent. They know that our fiat money is worthless and they think that they've found a way to beat the system without realizing that it's just a ponzi scheme. As long as there's someone to sell their crypto to before it goes bust, they'll make a profit and that's all they really want. However, the institutional buyers will sell before regular people even know what's going on and then there will be no one to sell their crypto to. Most people will lose it all. I'm betting on sliver. I probably won't make much of a profit when I do sell, but I won't lose a penny of value and I may actually make a dollar or two.
This isn't quite right. Bitcoin started out very much as a cash system, not a ponzi. People were exchanging Bitcoin for pizza, alpaca socks, Steam purchases, Newegg, and various other places, both physical and on the internet.
It wasn't until later, around 2015 or so when Bitcoin went from ~$300 to ~$1,000 (maybe due to maleficence) that this digital gold narrative came about and didn't fully develop fully until the 2017 bull run when people all over began hearing about Bitcoin around the Thanksgiving dinner table.
In 2011 Gavin Andresen went to the CIA to talk about Bitcoin. He held the keys to the git repo for Bitcoin after Satoshi handed them to him after visiting the CIA. He held the keys until they were revoked around 2016 (I want to say) due to supporting Craig Wright as Satoshi Nakamoto (He was wrong but he later admitted to being fooled).
It was when Gavin Andresen lost commit access to Bitcoin Core (the lead bitcoin node software) that Blockstream, a company started by Adam Back (and funded by such greats as MIT DCI, AXA SV, and other DS interests) in 2014 began the takeover of Bitcoin as we know it.
Adam Back, while credited in the whitepaper as a source (for his Hashcash PoW system) was not really involved in Bitcoin until the creation of Blockstream. It was then that he along with others such as Gregory Maxwell (a shitposting Wikipedia editor turned Bitcoin Core developer) began to direct the masses to the idea that Bitcoin can never hard-fork and that layer-2 creations (such as the Lightning Network (funnily enough in the LN whitepaper they stated that the base layer would need ~133mb for world scaling adoption) would be where transaction traffic would be diverted to and so Blockstream along with Lightning Labs began developing the layer-2 solutions (creating the problem and selling the solution).
During 2015 and all the way leading up to the middle of 2017 Bitcoin became more and more expensive to transact on. It was no longer fast and cheap. If you wanted to be included in the next block you had to pay up. Prior to the start of 2017 a Bitcoin tx would cost around $0.05 or so, but in January of 2017 fees jumped up to $0.30 - $0.40. The blocks were getting full and concerns addressing scaling (while they were brought up much earlier, they became very real and needed to be addressed) began to become more commonplace. In December of 2017 at the height of the run, fees went as high as $40+ to place a single transaction (and they only spike upwards as Bitcoin reaches higher).
The topic was brought up and through PsyOps and deceptive campaigns, Blockstream was able to keep the Blocksize at 1mb (The 1mb cap was implemented by Satoshi to prevent spam attacks and never intended it to stay at that limit) (adding the SegWit soft-fork that separated witness data into it's own 3mb block, effectively giving Bitcoin a ~1.7mb of data per block with a throughput of about 7tps). It was then, after numerous attempts by the "big-blockers" to get Bitcoin to scale the way Satoshi had intended, began to create forks of Bitcoin such as Bitcoin XT offering larger blocksizes and hopes of a scaling Bitcoin. Bitcoin XT (forked in 2015) failed but in August of 2017 Bitcoin Cash (BCH) was forked from Bitcoin.
Bitcoin Cash shares the same genesis block as Bitcoin but it's goal is to develop Bitcoin the way Satoshi intended, a peer-to-peer electronic cash system. It has had it's setbacks with Craig "I am Satoshi" Wright weaseling his way into the community and Amaury "The Benevolent Dictator" Sechet forking off and creating eCash after his attempts to steer Bitcoin in the direction he desired failed.
Bitcoin Cash is attempting to take power back from the bankers and Scum That Be (STB) that want to turn Bitcoin into a gold 2.0 where they have control (settlement layer) (think staying on the gold standard but we're given IOU slips, usury madness and the like) and ensuring that Bitcoin stays a peer-to-peer money that scales for the world.
Bitcoin Cash is nailing the scaling debate once-and-for-all with it's Adjusted Blocksize Limit Algorithm (ABLA) coming out in May, is developing it's recently launched Cash Tokens ecosystem (after messing with SLP, a protocol similar to Bitcoin Ordinals but BCH found it to be a poor implementation) that competes with ETHs (sky-high fees there too) token systems.
Most of the crypto space is full of coins that don't really do anything, are expensive to transact on, are centralized (which could be useful in the tokenization of businesses and products to perform like decentralized stocks), or are just blatant pump-and-dump ponzis (I believe that the STB steered the crypto-space into such a numbers go up mentality but that is not how Bitcoin started and it is not where BCH will lead) but Bitcoin Cash, Monero, and MAYBE a few more are the only coins that address the need for peer-to-peer electronic cash.
If anyone wants to know more, feel free to reply or DM me if you made it this far and I'll answer what I can.
Wow, as I said, you crypto fans are really intelligent. Lot's of great info here, but it doesn't change anything. The financial heavyweights will control crypto. These heavyweights are the banking cartels. They are actively lobbying our legislators to implement financial instruments that they don't understand that will ultimately be used to control crypto. They can't let you operate outside of their system for long.
They will know when the time is right and then they'll dump it and drive the price down to nothing. By the time you and I hear about it, it will be worth pennies on the dollar of what we paid for it, unless we got in really early. Most of us didn't. The only way to beat them is to hold physical assets that they can't touch and will always have value. If you're one of those that got in early, you could probably sell and buy a nice chunk of land or something else with real value. I hope all of the best for you and I hope that I'm wrong and you come out on top. It just seems financially risky to me, but that may just be because I'm old and I don't have anything that I can afford to lose.
The whole point of crypto is to self-custody AND use it. Not keep it on exchanges or self-custody and hold it in cold-storage until it hits a price that you deem acceptable to sell at. They can't control it if you pull your coins off the exchange and shift your mindset from asset to currency and begin to use it in a looped economy.
I have no problems with gold or silver, but you can't transact with silver over the internet in a decentralized, trustless way. That's what Bitcoin was supposed to address and Bitcoin Cash actually aims to accomplish.
I am actually of the opinion that this bull-market is short on time (be greedy when the masses are fearful and be fearful when the masses are greedy, and there's a lot of hopium and greed going on right now in the cryptosphere) and will actually lead to a big crash (as we get closer to or at the same time as our expected financial crisis that is to come).
Bitcoin was created to solve a problem (a big problem but not THE problem) before Q ever came out publicly to us anons. Crypto may have been brought into the operation and will have a real use after the operation succeeds, or it may crumble away and the experiment will have failed.
Either way it doesn't matter if you are for crypto or silver, in the end you can't take it with you when you die.
There was also tons of work put into bitcoin to make it slow and it was very intentional. Anyone wanting faster transactions in bitcoin was banned on Reddit bitcoin for a while. This was why bitcoin cash was made but it was kind of a flop initially and I lost interest
Security researcher and developer Antoine Riard is stepping down from the Lightning Network’s development team, citing security issues and fundamental challenges to the Bitcoin ecosystem.
According to a thread on the Linux Foundation’s public mailing list, Riard believes the Bitcoin community faces a “hard dilemma” as a new class of replacement cycling attacks puts Lightning in a “perilous position.“
That's the thing about a free market. Anyone is free to make a better product and there are many projects being worked on.
That I could see through glancing through those links, no cycling attack had been identified and it's only a theory for a potential attack. I've never had an issue or even heard of any from other node runners.
There is a reason why a core lightning network developer there from the beginning left. Why would regular people take the chance to use lightning when it has been proven to have systemic flaws?
Lightning network keeps having glitches and bugs even years after being released. It even says in the white paper that Bitcoin blocks would need to be 130MB+ to support Billions of people.
Cardano's scaling solution Hydra at least actually stands a chance of scaling to billions by being able to convert stake pools to Hydra nodes that each run 1000 TPS. There are over 2500 stake pools on Cardano right now (you can make a stake pool for as little as $200)
So 1000 x 2500 = potential 2500000 TPS. Its horizontal scaling as compared to Ethereum vertical scaling.
This is the thread for everyone with strong positions on Bitcoin (for or against) to engage in productive debate. Please be mindful, be respectful, stick to objective analysis and check emotions in the door!
Added: In the two hours since this was stickied, there is already tons of incredible info in this thread. Highly encourage everyone to read the comment threads before starting a new thread!
Years ago, the Bitcoin network became slow and expensive to use. A debate arose over how it should be fixed. One camp was for increasing the block size (allowing more transactions per block on the blockchain). The other camp was for small blocks and using "side chains" to cheaply and quickly process bitcoin transactions. EDIT: off-chain transactions is more accurate than the term sidechain
Coincidentally, a company called Blockstream, funded by Epstein (that's right, funded by Epstein), was developing a system for processing Bitcoin transactions off of the blockchain, using side chains. This system is called the Lightning Network.
Satoshi, the creator of Bitcoin, designed it to have growing block sizes. The more libertarian types in the crypto world (the OG crypto people) were for sticking with Satoshis vision for Bitcoin. But in the end, the noobs fell for the propaganda and Bitcoin was stuck with small blocks, sidechains, and the lightning network.
As a result of the small blockers gaining control of Bitcoin, the big blockers forked the bitcoin blockchain, creating a new bitcoin called Bitcoin Cash. In my opinion, this is what Bitcoin was designed to be, a peer to peer cash system. Cheap, fast transactions.
That's just how I remember it. This happened maybe 6 years ago. Details may be off here or there.
The Lightning Network is not a side chain. It uses Bitcoin scripting itself. It's literally Bitcoin using multisignature channels. Transactions are instant and the fees are pennies or less.
Blockstream did create a side chain, but it's called L-BTC (Liquid). They did not create the Lightning Network.
I'd like to see your proof that Epstein funded Blockstream though.
Thanks for adding nuance. Back then, during the debate, Lightning Network was pretty universally referred to as a sidechain as opposed to a "second layer" or "off chain."
Blockstream was heavily lobbying for small blocks, iirc. It's been years since I read about Epsteins involvement, but I'm sure you'll find it if you want dig.
Bitcoin Cash (aka just the original Bitcoin as it was designed by Satoshi) has transactions that are instant and fees that are pennies or less without needing another layer.
The block size of Bitcoin Cash makes running a node increasingly difficult due to the IBD. Given the same number of blocks, BCH would require approximately 16-32x as much hard drive space, which would also make it incredibly time consuming in areas of low bandwidth, which would de-incentivize node running and therefore, decentralization.
Satoshi discovered a wonderful thing, but he is not the end all, be all regarding Bitcoin. He made many mistakes along the way and with the help of other freedom-minded cypherpunks, was able to solve a lot of problems.
Hard drives have fallen in cost substantially since segwit and will continue to fall into the future. Really not an issue for any serious miner.
I'm not talking about miners. I'm talking about nodes. I'm also referring to internet bandwidth. There are still issues in non-first world countries.
You're free to run whichever version of Bitcoin that you want, but it's clear where developers see the most utility in the present and foreseeable future. There is a reason The Blocksize Wars ended the way they did.
I also don't see any large banks, hedge funds, or intelligent investors placing their bets with Bitcoin Cash. There is good reason for that too.
To impose a degree of centralization onto a previously decentralized network
Let's acknowledge that the point of Bitcoin was to destroy those institutions. They're just embracing the coin with the largest market cap. If Bitcoin weren't hijacked, they would be embracing pure, decentralized, big-blocked Bitcoin.
It was obvious back then that the shady team were the small blockers. The Big Blockers were definitely more liberty focused. As someone who has followed bitcoin since 2010, I can say that those in favor of layer 2 scaling are not the same liberty-loving breed as the OG's.
I'm not recommending that any reader should buy Bitcoin Cash. I'm saying that without a propaganda campaign that changed bitcoin, there'd have been no need to create Bitcoin Cash. Bitcoin Cash is not Bitcoin, however. It's just a copy of what Bitcoin was supposed to be.
Here's a random article about it that even mentions Epstein's name for anyone following along. No idea how accurate it is. https://medium.com/coinmonks/lightning-network-the-trojan-horse-of-the-crypt-industry-f26e3cc8cd46
As an attendee to many liberty/crypto conferences, I can confidently say that the real anarcho-capitalists/ freedom loving people are the Bitcoin Cashers BCH. The Bitcoin maximalists were those that wanted to play nice with the big banks and governments, pay taxes, ID verification, etc early on. Look up any debate between Roger Ver and Tone Vays to see BCH vs btc. Roger Ver actually understands liberty and Austrian economics and Tone Vays is... well, a jew. Tone never even showed up to the liberty crypto conferences, whereas Roger set me up with a wallet and sent me Bitcoin back in the day just to show me how it works. If you own Bitcoin and don't move it, cool. But I actually used Bitcoin a lot early on and I remember those crazy fees in 2017 with btc. If it's intangible, price should follow it's utility. On the other hand, we don't have rational markets and now that Bitcoin has other mainstream adoption vehicles that are not bitcoin, plus tether and other stable coins etc, btc can be manipulated and I think it is. I think THEY will blow Bitcoin way way up, then crash it, and then roll out CBDCs as the solution to their Hegelian dialectic
You're telling me that in 2024, the average consumer electronic device can't handle downloading and processing more than 1MB of data every 10 minutes? That is less than a floppy disk and the average YouTube video takes more bandwidth.
And running a node does fuck all for the network if it's not contributing hashrate. The only reason to run a node without mining is if you run a business where verifying transactions is mission critical. The average person does NOT need to run their own node. This is part of the small-blocker narrative that makes absolutely no sense when you think about it.
I believe the Epstein connection was to Joichi Ito who created DCI, which was involved with helping Bitcoin Foundation when they were low on funds.
Not sure he is tied to Litecoin, but that does not mean Lighting Network itself is not yet another controlled operation. Long back when litecoin was all the rage on social media, it seemed like there was a suspicious concerted push. I wont be surprised if some links to the Cabal get exposed at some point.
Litecoin and lightning network are not related. Litecoin is basically a clone of BTC with more supply and faster blocks. LN is a secondary network layer that runs on top of BTC (I think LTC gets used to test out new ideas before implementing them in BTC, so it has its own version of LN).
Ah, thanks for the clarification.
Wow followed BTC all these years and I’ve never heard it this way. But the way bitcoin is, far too slow and expensive for mass adoption. A decade in and people don’t quite know how to set up wallets and private keys
i'm not against crypto as a general rule, in fact I expect Crypto /blockchain to be used in the new stock market that will come to pass. that being said, i believe bitcoin was designed from the ground up to just be another way to steal (among other things). and not simply co opted by black hats
You can make a pretty good case that bitcoin has been positioned to, and is successfully diverting a massive amount of investment away from physical precious metals. This is buying them time and preventing the fraud in those markets from being exposed.
absolutely
Just about everything bad happening in the world, all of the wars, child sex trafficking, etc, is funded with printed money. The national debt per taxpayer is $260,000+ because of fiat currency. The powers that be exist because of printed money. There is no earthly hope for freedom while we are being evermore enslaved by their debt-based currency system.
Bitcoin is the only earthly hope that I'm aware of. Do you have any arguments for your hunch that it's designed for theft? Do you have a better idea than crypto for saving the world? Keep in mind we tried gold and it failed.
That's a bit disingenuous - gold didn't "fail", they shut it down so they could spend and print to oblivion. The gold window was closed via executive order by Nixon in August 1971, literally over a weekend at Camp David with almost no explanation. Executive orders can be overridden by another executive order.
Another fun fact, the FBI was created via executive order.
That's how it failed. Woodrow Wilson, FDR, and Nixon killed it.
that isn't a Fail, that's deliberate maleficence.
My .. large issue with bitcoin, and other non backed cryptos.. it's still a fiat currency. there is nothing backing it. and it's always sold , as if it isn't. the people that promote it, they always say "well there's a fixed amount of bitcoin, therefore it's limited. but the reality is, that doesn't matter, just because something is scarce doesn't make it valuable, or intrinsically worth anything. and it's all a lie anyway for two reasons, , it's nearly infinitely divisible (just like the fiat dollar) and anyone ANYONE, can make their own cheap crypto and put it on the market. , you cannot do that with gold, , in order for crypto to be worth anything, and become a good currency, it has to be backed by something in real life.
bitcoin is not the savior of the world,, pretty much just the opposite so far, you say the US dollar has been used for all these crimes, so is bitcoin. explain to me how Bitcoin stops any of it? because so far it's just been used as pump and dumps, and manipulations there is a REASON, these assholes got rid of Gold, . it didn't let them steal as easily.
edit pardon the run ons.
No, it's not a fiat currency. A fiat currency is one that exists through fiat - decree.
a semantic argument, that doesn't change the fact that bitcoin isn't backed by anything... which is the point.
I sure wouldn't trade gold for bitcoin but you can buy gold with bitcoin and a couple other crypto. So if that becomes more common I could get on board.
Tried gold and failed or had gold confiscated and people back in 1933 didn’t have any recourse besides watering the tree of liberty?
That's the thing with bitcoin. It either works or it doesn't. You can't just confiscate it. You can't ban it. You can't do anything about it. Not in theory, at least.
I love the idea of bitcoin, but I think the technology exists to crack or confiscate it. Anything that is created digitally can be destroyed digitally.
Look into how private keys work.
Just a few of the many wonderful qualities it has.
There seem to be a few plausible narratives that could support a diabolical strategy with totalitarianism, slavery, eugenics, population reduction, population control and wealth transfer as its end goals:
Decentralized cryptocurrency is the only tool we have to avoid that, afaik. CBDC's are not decentralized, and are unlikely to be cryptocurrencies at all.
CBDC are not decentralized cryptocurrencies. Your dollar is already almost 100% digital. Banks are already freezing people's bank accounts. Decentralized cryptocurrency cannot be frozen.
You're conflating CBDC and crypto again.
Almost all dollars are digital currently. If the grid goes down, the dollar is not going to save us.
It's possible to have paper notes for crypo as well, using the same system as banks used to issue gold certificates. That's how paper money began circulating.
Unlike the dollar and CBDC's, crypto is voluntary. You can't be forced to use it.
Thank you for your patience with this layman. So if cryptos are truly voluntary and independent, dare I say incorruptible by TPTB hands, able to weather a collapse of fiat and cash or a forced push to CDBC but always digital, never physical, then our only concerns about them losing value or indeed being vanished would be:
Fungibility is still important right up to the moment the lights go out.
good luck with your bitcoin.
I actually don't have any. I'm not interested in it to get rich. I'm interested in it because it's the only known hope to the biggest problem the world faces.
I think the next gen stock market/ exchange will use gold backed crypto. I do not think it will be bitcoin thou.
Virtual currencies, especially Bitcoin, are often used by criminal drug and human trafficking operations.
Not quite sure I follow your logic here.
The ability to print money is the ring of power. Printed money pays for every evil thing that governments do.
And what do you mean especially bitcoin? It's a public ledger. Darknet drug markets won't even accept it because it's too easily tracked.
2014 article -
Bitcoin Fuels the Human Trafficking Market
https://humantraffickingsearch.org/bitcoin-fuels-the-human-trafficking-market/
What happened in 2017 after Trump was elected?
Follow the Bitcoin to Find Victims of Human Trafficking
New Machine Learning Algorithms Will Trace Authors of Exploitative Advertising
https://engineering.nyu.edu/news/follow-bitcoin-find-victims-human-trafficking
During the Trump Administration. there was crackdown on illegal criminal activity, especially human trafficking, fueled by Bitcoin and this did change criminal behaviors, especially after Backpage was shutdown.
Back to business under Biden...
Crypto Increasingly Used In Human/Drug Trafficking Says GAO
https://www.forbes.com/sites/tedknutson/2022/01/10/crypto-increasingly-used-in-humandrug-trafficking-says-gao/?sh=411466c5637e
I'm sorry, I didn't notice your reply. I just wanted to say what I think you already know. These articles are pure propaganda.
Christians aren't looking forward to a one world currency. Well, we already have one. Almost all (if not all) currencies are debt based currencies. They are debt. The one world currency is the precise inverse of money - debt.
I can understand this sentiment, but i have a more nuanced theory. Bitcoin was a "schrodinger's tech" much like everything else that has developed since the turn of the millenium.
By this, what I mean is that both the white hats and black hats allowed the creation of Bitcoin for different reasons. BHs definitely needed a new vehicle to hide their financial crimes after the 2008 Fed money printers were turned on to full speed. The timing of the Bitcoin whitepaper is not a coincidence.
WHs on the other hand realised that the blockchain provides the best way to track criminal activity and allowed this to hit the society, because they knew that it would provide the taste for a "freedom currency", becoming especially crucial in the final stages of Awakening (as in now).
BHs on the other hand made sure that Bitcoin implementation ended up becoming clunky and inefficient, so that it could never actually become the "freedom currency" and give us freedom.
WHs were perfectly fine with this, because the taste of freedom is good enough. Once people hunger for something, even if its yanked away, they will create it for themselves in future.
Over all, Bitcoin has shown us the dream of the future - what a really free free-market society would look like, but at the same time given the BHs the false sense of security that seems to be so prevalent everywhere as part of this Devolution plan.
The way this happened was with Satoshi inserting the 1MB per block limit. It was always meant to be removed but after Satoshi left the project and it was commandeered by Blockstream, they made sure to cement it in permanently to create artificial scarcity so it couldn't scale.
It's like if we talking about the printing press, and if back then they said "we have to limit all printing presses so that no book can be longer than 100 pages, because if books are longer than 100 pages, nobody would be able to afford to print their own books!"
Good analogy, but I have always found it a bit difficult to understand how people fell for a 1MB limit in 2010 - when computational scarcity was already a thing of the past. Its not like they couldnt foresee that it would become a bottleneck soon down the road.
At the time Bitcoin was just a few people running the software on consumer laptops and desktops which was not providing much hashpower. Satoshi wanted to prevent potential bad actors from renting out a massive server farm to spam attack the network with 1GB blocks which would have basically stopped Bitcoin dead in its tracks in those early days.
Satoshi left instructions for how to gradually increase and eventually remove the limit altogether, but Blockstream insisted on making it permanent. Bitcoin Cash is now at a 32MB limit and will be changing to dynamic block limits later this year.
If I remember correctly, wasnt there a point where a huge transaction was in the queue that was going to grind the whole Bitcoin to a halt which forced them to make the change quickly? Or was that something else unrelated to block size?
Doesn't ring a bell. What time frame was that?
Bitcoin/crypto was stood up to be the "pressure release valve", for those that know fiat currency and the stock market is a complete scam, but wanted someplace to park their wealth in an attempt to flee the financial system. The Cabal needed a system to "compete" with their fake Central Bank system, they could push, in order to make sure they capture 99% of the wealth when the system they designed to crash in the first place.....fully collapses.
The Cabal always uses sleight of hand to "look here, not over here" and then attacks the systems that are most "counter-Cabal", if you will. Crypto is very well talked about in all of the mainstream financial news, in the year of our Lord two thousand and twenty four. This should be another red flag.
The true "pressure release valve" to the Central Banking system, is and has always been, gold and silver. This is why gold and silver have been continuously manipulated by the COMEX ever since the Hunt brothers tried to corner the physical silver market back in the 70s. Once the Hunt brothers found a flaw in the Cabal system, they quickly moved to correct it - by using COMEX to create fake shares of the physically held precious metals. If precious metals were ever able to show their true colors and they actually were valued in relation to the amount of fake currency in the US petrodollar system, it would be game over for the Cabal - people would quickly realize what "true value" actually is in this day and age. Obviously, the Cabal must stop that at any cost, hence the manipulation.
The "Meme" stock saga has helped show the people that the stock market has been a Cabal design (adult gambling) since the beginning and it's fully manipulated - they can use dark pools and other tricks to essentially make up stock out of thin air and manipulate them at-will. Kudos to the White Hats here, because this exposure is needed to 1) Wake people up to the scam that is our fake financial system 2) Help divert Cabal financial resources that would have gone to prop up other parts of their system on control (e.g human trafficking) 3) Educate people on how the financial system ties into the Globalist system of control (and the implications of it).
Gold and silver are continually attacked in all financial news, even when it goes on a run, and only the "negatives" are discussed and only in relation to the present-day system of credit and debt. Nevermind that we've used gold and silver as MONEY for thousands of years to store our wealth and as a value of the labor we produce with our own two hands.
I feel that bitcoin will never become cash as it has too many flaws, but do think it will remain a store of value like a digital gold. One of the biggest problems is the 51% attack which as one group already controls over 51% and all the mining hardware is only made by a few people that is a big problem for the future. They have already been messing with transactions and there is a lot of involvement with blackrock and such to subvert Bitcoin by controlling the mining operations which need loans from blackrock to start up, they could start to deny certain wallet addresses and transactions if they had enough of the hashpower. I do hope that is not what happens but there are a lot of dark forces at work.
One of the original developers for Bitcoin Synth ended up creating Skycoin to solve the problems of bitcoin, one of the reasons they got rid of mining is they knew that if there was a incentive to mess with the mining and transactions that is what would happen. You can get Skycoin for running nodes on the Skywire meshnet which is going to be a replacement for the current broken internet, secure and encrypted each packet looks identical so you cannot do deep packet inspection. They are also designing open source hardware, they made there own wallet, various prototype routers and such, how many other projects have even made anything.
The project has suffered many attacks over the years, the new yorker ran fake news article about it as did others, the people behind this have been threatening Synth and his family for years, he is currently suing them all for this.
But they have continued development and Synth is a great man that hates the cabal as much as we do but does not believe in Q strangely but he wants the same sorts of things as we do and is always talking about the cabal and what they are upto, he has never quit no matter what. How many other projects are still even going after all these years.
Its one of my favorite projects in crypto even if has not made me rich haha, just the ideas behind it could solve so many of the problems we face. I know i sound like a shill but i don't care if people got behind this project and helped Synth we could have a whole different future. To me its not about the "moons" but the future of the internet and i do not see anyone else that is even trying to solve these problems.
Also you can install Skywire meshnet on a raspberry pi or similar and get a small amount of rewards but you can be helping make a better world. Anyway that is my soapbox for the day.
Skycoin Website
Skywire Github
So what do you gain specifically by running a skywire node?
Skywire can be used as a proxy and also a VPN, its still early days but for example you could use it connect two computers over the internet and have a secure connection. The Meshnet is meant to run over the top of the internet or from point to point wifi links.
At the moment you get few Skycoin per node up to 8 nodes, not huge money at the current price but in the time i have done it i have made more money than the 8 raspberry pis cost and the power to run them, not life changing but still fun.
Thanks, thats what I wanted to know. Second question - what do you gain currently if you hold any skycoins? Does the meshnet require, for instance, payment in skycoin ? Can you buy anything with the skycoin right now?
Bitcoin is meant to be highly scalable and some of the branches like Bitcoin Cash follow this path while the original was subverted. This was gone into quite a bit in the Crypto Conspiracy series. Quite a few connections to Epstein were looked into as well and discussed Evergrande, Tether, FTX, Executive Order 13818, etc.
Go here and search for Crypto Conspiracy (unfortunately he doesn't have a playlist). https://www.youtube.com/@silverguru/search?query=crypto%20conspiracy
I think this is the episode, Kurt Wuckert is very knowledgeable in the history of Bitcoin and went into when it got subverted in one of his first appearances. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yafHqOTlyao
(Oct-2023) Bitcoin core developer steps back from Lightning Network over ‘hard dilemma’ https://cointelegraph.com/news/bitcoin-core-developer-antoine-riard-steps-back-lightning-network-dilemma
Bitcoin Core Dev exposes Lightning Network flaw, departs project - "All your mempool are belong to us" https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2023-October/022032.html
How does a lightning replacement cycling attack work? https://x.com/mononautical/status/1715736832950825224
Github - List of Lightning Network technical issues, bugs, flaws, and exploits. https://github.com/davidshares/Lightning-Network
@BoringSleuth shows that members of the Ethereum Foundation were involved in orchestrating The DAO hack through on-chain addresses. https://twitter.com/BoringSleuth/status/1715215682898469287
I trust Cardano over others. There's a lot of positives about Cardano the deeper you dive into the technicals on how it works. I encourage you to not just hear it from me but take a look yourself.
Cardano is a cool science project, but it isn't a commodity like Bitcoin and Bitcoin Cash, it's a centralized security with a known creator, a Proof of Stake (piece of shit when it comes to currency utilization, Satoshi used PoW for a reason to solve a very important problem), and funded by a foundation that takes money from the very people Bitcoin was created to deplatform. We the people were to rally around Bitcoin and use it, and in time force the governments and their ilk to play by our rules, not us play by theirs.
Bitcoin Cash (and Monero you could argue) is the only coin that is attempting to carry on Satoshi's design, sharing the genesis block and all other blocks prior to the fork in 2017. Kaspa seems to be the new sweetness around in regards to peer-to-peer currency but I've heard that before with RaiBlocks/NANO so time will tell whether Kaspa develops into an actual contender or not.
I got tangled in the web of ADA and Dan larimer’s EOS proof of stake. Held on for way too long. Now ETH has gone to PoS as well
Wrong look into CIP 1694 for Cardano. Also if anything is a security, it is Ethereum.
Cardano: NerdOut - Voltaire Governance | Andrew Westberg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhxPlWh8gFg
Learn about the upcoming CIP-1694 and how voting and governance might work in the Voltaire era!
Links: https://github.com/cardano-foundation/CIPs/blob/3a0d2824fe502a8593d63bbf00bf8d9a7b5cbdeb/CIP-1694/README.md
CIP-1694 Workshop Edinburgh - Recap https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QFYBocWzaFg
Cardano's proof of stake is liquid so you can stake and unstake at will. Also it is non custodial no matter what stake pool you stake to with a minimum stake of 1 Ada.
The proof of stake protocol is used to secure the protocol so you are essentially voting with your tokens what stake pool you want to secure the protocol, getting paid for it if your stake pool is picked, and incurring no risk of losing Ada when staking. Proof of stake is also at least 20,000 times more energy efficient than Bitcoin in practice.
Bitcoin Cash is trash with no smart contracts and no users. I'll tip my hat to Monero, that one is actually useful.
Yes, it was co-opted to be slow and expensive. This was the reason for the split to Bitcoin cash BCH. That's where the real Bitcoin is IMO. I was involved since 2014, and I think the world will eventually come around to bch more and more. The Bitcoin minimalist crowd is brainwashed and co-opted, and most of them don't use Bitcoin to transact or understand it. Transactions need to be fast and cheap to be useful
I was in BCH for a time. The numerous bitcoin variations was too much for me. I was in ETH for a time then EOS with the promise of fast and fee less transactions. I even got to using their limited dapps. But the ecosystems never amounted to anything.
So many promising ideas but very little came to fruition
Help me understand. If the creators of banking, let’s call these ultra-rich families “leaders of the cabal”, if they can print endless fiat money, said money can be used to buy Bitcoin! They print infinite money and then buy infinite bitcoin- and of course perhaps its derivatives (alt coins) too.
Then what this means is the cabal has digitized their printing press and can also manipulate and control bitcoin. Am I wrong?
What does this change for the working man? The cabal’s purchasing power is still infinity relative to the average Joe.
Just because it was first doesn't make it "the one". Just because it's currently valued the highest doesn't make it "the best". I'm sure everyone counting on Bitcoin still uses Napster to download music.
The idea of blockchain was already in a whitepaper that came out in late 90s, but did not address the double spend problem.
BTC got implemented and was usable because it solved the double spend problem. I am not sure if others had already solved this problem before this (hard to imagine no one had come up with a solution).
You are damn right about the ENDLESS amount of energy. That is the biggest obvious flaw in the idea of bitcoin.
A digital currency should represent potential energy, not energy already expended simply to prove that you did not double spend the coin you had.
The energy usage of Bitcoin is a feature, not a bug.
It creates an incentive for seeking out the most efficient energy sources. It turns greed into a productive value. Miners look for the cheapest energy possible, they do not benefit from being wasteful.
https://www.vice.com/en/article/jgxg3b/someone-mysteriously-sent-almost-dollar1-billion-in-bitcoin
https://news.bitcoin.com/jeffrey-epstein-confidant-ghislaine-maxwell-reddit-post-bitcoin/
https://thenextweb.com/news/jeffrey-epstein-bitcoin
They tried to destroy the technology, but the REAL BITCOIN is still alive and kicking in the form of bitcoin cash.
The only chain that still care about the original whitepaper.
Collin likes to complain about Bitcoin, but his ideology - Bitcoin ma(r)xist - forbids him to do so.
He will still bankers before the fuctional Bitcoin chain.
BTC ....bite the cheese.
You will own nothing and be happy.
That would be an NFT
Any currency requiring an internet connection should be scrutinized. Certificates backed by gold produce private transactions. Governments have no right to any transaction information.
I understand there are bitcoin investors here, just remember. You can eat your betting money, but never bet your eating money.
24-18-16 as already been adopted by 100s of banks for cross boarder payment. Contracts already signed; waiting for just the right moment to flip the switch. 2-20-3 discussed is a massive red herring.
From my understanding it is limited in transaction speed for the ledgers. I'm to non tech tonknow if that can be corrected without starting over.
Bitcoin's invention is credited to one Satoshi Nakamoto.
SAmsung
TOSHIba
NAKAmichi
MOTOrola
Anything that can be bought with fiat is controlled by those with the most money. It really is that simple. IF you can buy bitcoin, so can they, but they can buy/sell enough volume to move the market putting you at their mercy and whims.
That's fine, Ethereum 2.0 should do around 100,000 transactions a second, roughly 50% more than the Visa network can process.
Bitcoin's Lightning Network is 1,000,000 TPS.
😂😂😂
Blockchain is the way of the future…. Bitcoin is for retards since it is compromised just like the market….
bitcoin white paper was called "digital gold" it was never meant to replace fiat
The white paper title is "Bitcoin: A Peer-to-Peer Electronic Cash System".
It was never refered to as "digital gold" until the CIA started pushing that narrative to convince people not to ever spend it.
I wouldn't bother arguing with folks on this fren. Crypto currency supporters really are highly intelligent. They know that our fiat money is worthless and they think that they've found a way to beat the system without realizing that it's just a ponzi scheme. As long as there's someone to sell their crypto to before it goes bust, they'll make a profit and that's all they really want. However, the institutional buyers will sell before regular people even know what's going on and then there will be no one to sell their crypto to. Most people will lose it all. I'm betting on sliver. I probably won't make much of a profit when I do sell, but I won't lose a penny of value and I may actually make a dollar or two.
This isn't quite right. Bitcoin started out very much as a cash system, not a ponzi. People were exchanging Bitcoin for pizza, alpaca socks, Steam purchases, Newegg, and various other places, both physical and on the internet.
It wasn't until later, around 2015 or so when Bitcoin went from ~$300 to ~$1,000 (maybe due to maleficence) that this digital gold narrative came about and didn't fully develop fully until the 2017 bull run when people all over began hearing about Bitcoin around the Thanksgiving dinner table.
In 2011 Gavin Andresen went to the CIA to talk about Bitcoin. He held the keys to the git repo for Bitcoin after Satoshi handed them to him after visiting the CIA. He held the keys until they were revoked around 2016 (I want to say) due to supporting Craig Wright as Satoshi Nakamoto (He was wrong but he later admitted to being fooled).
It was when Gavin Andresen lost commit access to Bitcoin Core (the lead bitcoin node software) that Blockstream, a company started by Adam Back (and funded by such greats as MIT DCI, AXA SV, and other DS interests) in 2014 began the takeover of Bitcoin as we know it.
Adam Back, while credited in the whitepaper as a source (for his Hashcash PoW system) was not really involved in Bitcoin until the creation of Blockstream. It was then that he along with others such as Gregory Maxwell (a shitposting Wikipedia editor turned Bitcoin Core developer) began to direct the masses to the idea that Bitcoin can never hard-fork and that layer-2 creations (such as the Lightning Network (funnily enough in the LN whitepaper they stated that the base layer would need ~133mb for world scaling adoption) would be where transaction traffic would be diverted to and so Blockstream along with Lightning Labs began developing the layer-2 solutions (creating the problem and selling the solution).
During 2015 and all the way leading up to the middle of 2017 Bitcoin became more and more expensive to transact on. It was no longer fast and cheap. If you wanted to be included in the next block you had to pay up. Prior to the start of 2017 a Bitcoin tx would cost around $0.05 or so, but in January of 2017 fees jumped up to $0.30 - $0.40. The blocks were getting full and concerns addressing scaling (while they were brought up much earlier, they became very real and needed to be addressed) began to become more commonplace. In December of 2017 at the height of the run, fees went as high as $40+ to place a single transaction (and they only spike upwards as Bitcoin reaches higher).
The topic was brought up and through PsyOps and deceptive campaigns, Blockstream was able to keep the Blocksize at 1mb (The 1mb cap was implemented by Satoshi to prevent spam attacks and never intended it to stay at that limit) (adding the SegWit soft-fork that separated witness data into it's own 3mb block, effectively giving Bitcoin a ~1.7mb of data per block with a throughput of about 7tps). It was then, after numerous attempts by the "big-blockers" to get Bitcoin to scale the way Satoshi had intended, began to create forks of Bitcoin such as Bitcoin XT offering larger blocksizes and hopes of a scaling Bitcoin. Bitcoin XT (forked in 2015) failed but in August of 2017 Bitcoin Cash (BCH) was forked from Bitcoin.
Bitcoin Cash shares the same genesis block as Bitcoin but it's goal is to develop Bitcoin the way Satoshi intended, a peer-to-peer electronic cash system. It has had it's setbacks with Craig "I am Satoshi" Wright weaseling his way into the community and Amaury "The Benevolent Dictator" Sechet forking off and creating eCash after his attempts to steer Bitcoin in the direction he desired failed.
Bitcoin Cash is attempting to take power back from the bankers and Scum That Be (STB) that want to turn Bitcoin into a gold 2.0 where they have control (settlement layer) (think staying on the gold standard but we're given IOU slips, usury madness and the like) and ensuring that Bitcoin stays a peer-to-peer money that scales for the world.
Bitcoin Cash is nailing the scaling debate once-and-for-all with it's Adjusted Blocksize Limit Algorithm (ABLA) coming out in May, is developing it's recently launched Cash Tokens ecosystem (after messing with SLP, a protocol similar to Bitcoin Ordinals but BCH found it to be a poor implementation) that competes with ETHs (sky-high fees there too) token systems.
Most of the crypto space is full of coins that don't really do anything, are expensive to transact on, are centralized (which could be useful in the tokenization of businesses and products to perform like decentralized stocks), or are just blatant pump-and-dump ponzis (I believe that the STB steered the crypto-space into such a numbers go up mentality but that is not how Bitcoin started and it is not where BCH will lead) but Bitcoin Cash, Monero, and MAYBE a few more are the only coins that address the need for peer-to-peer electronic cash.
If anyone wants to know more, feel free to reply or DM me if you made it this far and I'll answer what I can.
Wow, as I said, you crypto fans are really intelligent. Lot's of great info here, but it doesn't change anything. The financial heavyweights will control crypto. These heavyweights are the banking cartels. They are actively lobbying our legislators to implement financial instruments that they don't understand that will ultimately be used to control crypto. They can't let you operate outside of their system for long.
They will know when the time is right and then they'll dump it and drive the price down to nothing. By the time you and I hear about it, it will be worth pennies on the dollar of what we paid for it, unless we got in really early. Most of us didn't. The only way to beat them is to hold physical assets that they can't touch and will always have value. If you're one of those that got in early, you could probably sell and buy a nice chunk of land or something else with real value. I hope all of the best for you and I hope that I'm wrong and you come out on top. It just seems financially risky to me, but that may just be because I'm old and I don't have anything that I can afford to lose.
The whole point of crypto is to self-custody AND use it. Not keep it on exchanges or self-custody and hold it in cold-storage until it hits a price that you deem acceptable to sell at. They can't control it if you pull your coins off the exchange and shift your mindset from asset to currency and begin to use it in a looped economy.
I have no problems with gold or silver, but you can't transact with silver over the internet in a decentralized, trustless way. That's what Bitcoin was supposed to address and Bitcoin Cash actually aims to accomplish.
I am actually of the opinion that this bull-market is short on time (be greedy when the masses are fearful and be fearful when the masses are greedy, and there's a lot of hopium and greed going on right now in the cryptosphere) and will actually lead to a big crash (as we get closer to or at the same time as our expected financial crisis that is to come).
Bitcoin was created to solve a problem (a big problem but not THE problem) before Q ever came out publicly to us anons. Crypto may have been brought into the operation and will have a real use after the operation succeeds, or it may crumble away and the experiment will have failed.
Either way it doesn't matter if you are for crypto or silver, in the end you can't take it with you when you die.
Best wishes fren!
There was also tons of work put into bitcoin to make it slow and it was very intentional. Anyone wanting faster transactions in bitcoin was banned on Reddit bitcoin for a while. This was why bitcoin cash was made but it was kind of a flop initially and I lost interest
r/bitcoin is still like that.
r/btc is the uncensored bitcoin subreddit.
We already have instant transactions using Bitcoin itself on the Lightning Network. It works by creating multisignature channels between peers.
(Oct-2023) Bitcoin core developer steps back from Lightning Network over ‘hard dilemma’ https://cointelegraph.com/news/bitcoin-core-developer-antoine-riard-steps-back-lightning-network-dilemma
Bitcoin Core Dev exposes Lightning Network flaw, departs project - "All your mempool are belong to us" https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2023-October/022032.html
How does a lightning replacement cycling attack work? https://x.com/mononautical/status/1715736832950825224
Github - List of Lightning Network technical issues, bugs, flaws, and exploits. https://github.com/davidshares/Lightning-Network
That's the thing about a free market. Anyone is free to make a better product and there are many projects being worked on.
That I could see through glancing through those links, no cycling attack had been identified and it's only a theory for a potential attack. I've never had an issue or even heard of any from other node runners.
There is a reason why a core lightning network developer there from the beginning left. Why would regular people take the chance to use lightning when it has been proven to have systemic flaws?
Lightning network keeps having glitches and bugs even years after being released. It even says in the white paper that Bitcoin blocks would need to be 130MB+ to support Billions of people.
Cardano's scaling solution Hydra at least actually stands a chance of scaling to billions by being able to convert stake pools to Hydra nodes that each run 1000 TPS. There are over 2500 stake pools on Cardano right now (you can make a stake pool for as little as $200)
So 1000 x 2500 = potential 2500000 TPS. Its horizontal scaling as compared to Ethereum vertical scaling.