Yep stepped into yet other wastes of money right after like the Commodore 128 Atari 800 and then my first 386DX Gateway...I still have it's swank 30 megabyte HD.
Never programmed anything back then as I was too young but a C64 was the first PC for me and I was unknowingly sailing the seas every day on that thing.
There was definitely a spike due to data centers. But prices were slowly climbing prior to. As demand was inching up due to the fact more and more of the world was increasingly online. And tech demands were growing. They also had a better idea than most that AI was likely to send Demand to the Moon.
The main problem we are having. Is the manufacturers despite being fully aware of the escalating demand. And a better idea than most on where AI was heading. Invested exactly 0 into expanding production.
As to prices. You can generally find some Chinese stuff at cheaper than Western or other Asian countries counterparts. But that can be a bit of a dice roll as Chinese QC can be debatable
in 1988, i started a small business in a spare room, bought a used computer, upgraded from 2baud modem to 4baud, and thought i was rockin’out that dial-up!
My first 90MHz Pentium at the end of 1995 was around £3,500 including their insurance package, keyboard, mouse and a massive 17" monitor. It cost an extra £400 if you wanted the 100MHz version. Nowadays, you can buy an OK laptop for the price of that upgrade even without allowing for inflation.
16TB hard drives are out of sight compared to a year or two ago. They are in the $700 range now.
Amazon has the 64GB of DDR5 for over $800 a stick.
I have two JBODs that could hold eight drives each, but I can't fill them right now. I have one that is full, meaning 128TB of space. I need more, but I will have to wait until either manufacturing catches up or AI goes bust.
I have and it's A LOT...ESPECIALLY FOR THE NO-NAME BRAND CHIPS!!!!!
Everyone warned these idiots that memory prices was going to increase and these chip manufactures ARE NOT GOING TO EAT THE OVERHEAD...they don't realize that these "AI Datacenters" are NOTHING but a drain on everything downstream. Watch what happens when one of these Datacenters goes KAPUT!!!!!!! Memory Prices will come back in-line.
NOTE: I am a programmer (retired) and these "datacenters" are NOTHING more than sinks for all the nonsense they are advocating.
Watch what happens when one goes online and the coolant (water) is no longer available and at a price the center can't afford!!!!! 🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡
Close to 40 years ago I had a friend that said the same thing to me - but it was 256k instead of 64g. Not everyone uses their computers for Fakebook and Games.
If it is your traditional surfing, droplinking a video, or writing a letter ..... 8 gigs are enough.
Technically, if you take care of your old laptops and desktops, using a lightweight linux-version: think: bootloader -> init [runit, open-rc, sysVinit, dunit] -> desktop (LXQT, or Herbstluft), you'll find any DDR3 based system will serve you well.
Heck, your ssd and even hdd's may serve without a hickup. You'll find that transfer rates are somewhat limited, but, with the limited scope, there is no issue.
So, why DDR5 memory, combined with high-end Video Cards and high-end CPU:
Time to do things:
compile software
[re-]author music, film, high def images,
running an LLM locally, etc.
running QubesOS or: running Virtualizations where each virt.env. has assigned a range of CPU and memory.
For instance, I could try and run Qubes on 16G. It works. But 32 is a smoother experience, let alone 64, or 128G.
So, what reason could there be to want virt.env?
security
curiousity
business
fun.
In a way: why would you want to buy a car that could run 150 miles per hour, when you get at your destination with 20 miles an hour?
Or, why do you buy a pickup truck when your travels is daily hampered by traffic jams for 2 hours?
Or, worse, you do not need a 30 round magazine to hunt ..... So, we should be restricting your right to carry and bear arms. ....
I mean I occasionally game or use some software but 16 gigs is plenty...
64 gigs were generally only for servers and really memory hungry applications...
Not judging just trying to understand.
I probably have hundreds filled with various "stuff." Most of it is information related.
I have a large home office that is over full with stacks of banker boxes. Some are already collapsing. I plan to rent a storage unit that can be delivered to my house, similar to a POS, move all the boxes to it, buy racks for the boxes, then move things back in. At least I'll be able to access individual boxes, once I actually look inside them and label them. Right now, there are boxes on the bottom in the middle I haven't accessed in over 10 years. It's like the warehouse scene at the end of the Indiana Jones movie where the Ark was stashed.
About 3 years ago I built a new computer with 32 GB of DDR 5 memory. It cost about a $160 for the memory. Last year, I looked and it was over $300 for 32GB.
My first entire computer system, including a memory upgrade to 16K, was $88. It was a Timex-Sinclair using the Z80 chip, same as the TRS-80 Model I, II, etc. I used a Radio Shack book on machine language programming to make it do neat stuff, but the memory limited the length of programs.
The 5" floppy disks for the Radio Shack computers were 128K. The 3.5" floppies for PCs were 720K or 1.44M for double density. But the insides were identical for ease of inventory and manufacturing, so I bought a hand punch that would punch a square hole in the case of the disk so the computer would see it as 1.44M. The 5" floppy disks had a notch you could cover to make them read-only and a small hole near the center which allowed the computer to tell every time the disk rotated. You could punch a notch on the opposite side and a small hole in the opposite position on both sides of the jacket, careful not to damage the disk, and you had what we called a "flippy." There was a recording surface on both sides of the disk, but the Radio Shack computers used only one side. With a "flippy," you could flip the disk and save stuff on the other side.
You may like these - and a bunch of other people on this site will as well. I just replaced my old Steelcase desk (the giant metal desks with the wood-like top that was also metal) with a new 81"x59" L-shaped executive desk. It actually has wood, so I wanted coasters.
When I saw these I absolutely had to have them. I use them every day.
I have plenty of old AOL disks that I could use as coasters, as well as all the other disks I've ever owned. There are all still here in boxes, along with the 5" disks, some Zip disks, and one 8" floppy I bought to use at work 40 years ago.
I can't replace my desk, which I've had for over 30 years. It won't go through any door without disassembly, which I'm not able to do anymore. I've done it twice before, once when I bought it from work for $50, and then again when I moved to my current house. Just the top is more than I can carry now. It's a 3'x6', all metal with wood grain Formica on the top. The wood pattern means I don't have to use a mouse pad.
My first IBM clone was a Tandy 3000NL, which was a 286 clone. I paid over $700 to include a 20MB "hard card" for storage. At the time, I kept all files on floppies. Now, with so much hard drive storage, I keep all files on hard drives with multiple backups.
That values one of my PCs at over $800,000,000,000. If only I could go back in time and cash in! It is amazing how far we have come in a single lifetime.
I still remember writing simple programs on the Commodore Pet and saving them to an audio cassette in a tape drive.
Apple //e for me!
That’s what I started with! Writing programs out of book and magazines at 10 - now I’m an Oracle systems engineer lol
Tandy TRS80 for me.
aka "Trash 80"
;-)
Yep stepped into yet other wastes of money right after like the Commodore 128 Atari 800 and then my first 386DX Gateway...I still have it's swank 30 megabyte HD.
Built everything I use myself since.
TI 99/4A here.
Mine was that little Timex Sinclair 1000 around '82. Taught myself Basic programming on it.
Never programmed anything back then as I was too young but a C64 was the first PC for me and I was unknowingly sailing the seas every day on that thing.
‘It’s but a data center
6 hundo buys brand new computer w/ more RAM on temu kek
Bonus! Comes with free Chinese monitoring and tech support.
There was definitely a spike due to data centers. But prices were slowly climbing prior to. As demand was inching up due to the fact more and more of the world was increasingly online. And tech demands were growing. They also had a better idea than most that AI was likely to send Demand to the Moon.
The main problem we are having. Is the manufacturers despite being fully aware of the escalating demand. And a better idea than most on where AI was heading. Invested exactly 0 into expanding production.
As to prices. You can generally find some Chinese stuff at cheaper than Western or other Asian countries counterparts. But that can be a bit of a dice roll as Chinese QC can be debatable
in 1988, i started a small business in a spare room, bought a used computer, upgraded from 2baud modem to 4baud, and thought i was rockin’out that dial-up!
I still have an old PC Magazine from when the first 386 computers came out. It says “$10,000 and worth it”. Not kidding.
My first 90MHz Pentium at the end of 1995 was around £3,500 including their insurance package, keyboard, mouse and a massive 17" monitor. It cost an extra £400 if you wanted the 100MHz version. Nowadays, you can buy an OK laptop for the price of that upgrade even without allowing for inflation.
Translate that into today's dollars= OUCHIE
I remember the dial-up days lol :)
Yes, then someone picked up the phone to call and you lost your internet connection.
I remember when my dad use to tell me my mom. Don’t pick up the phone 😂
Psh, memory and SSDs are absurd as of late.
I bought an Asus NUC a few months back and looked to up it's 8gb and fill the 2.5" bay, was ridiculous.
I ended up finding a used 8gb DDR5 module on eBay for $45 and used an old 256gb SSD I had on hand.
I spent a good minute looking up prices of both at various outlets, some places didn't even have modules under 16gb.
I built a PC at the end of 2023 just before the prices went up. £260 (GBP) for 96GB.
I wish it was still like that!
16TB hard drives are out of sight compared to a year or two ago. They are in the $700 range now.
Amazon has the 64GB of DDR5 for over $800 a stick.
I have two JBODs that could hold eight drives each, but I can't fill them right now. I have one that is full, meaning 128TB of space. I need more, but I will have to wait until either manufacturing catches up or AI goes bust.
I have and it's A LOT...ESPECIALLY FOR THE NO-NAME BRAND CHIPS!!!!!
Everyone warned these idiots that memory prices was going to increase and these chip manufactures ARE NOT GOING TO EAT THE OVERHEAD...they don't realize that these "AI Datacenters" are NOTHING but a drain on everything downstream. Watch what happens when one of these Datacenters goes KAPUT!!!!!!! Memory Prices will come back in-line.
NOTE: I am a programmer (retired) and these "datacenters" are NOTHING more than sinks for all the nonsense they are advocating.
Watch what happens when one goes online and the coolant (water) is no longer available and at a price the center can't afford!!!!! 🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡
Nice to talk to another programmer. I am not retired yet.
I agree with you.
64 gigs is overkill, what are you using it for?
Helps with music production and 3d modeling.
Close to 40 years ago I had a friend that said the same thing to me - but it was 256k instead of 64g. Not everyone uses their computers for Fakebook and Games.
Depends on what you wanne do:
If it is your traditional surfing, droplinking a video, or writing a letter ..... 8 gigs are enough.
Technically, if you take care of your old laptops and desktops, using a lightweight linux-version: think: bootloader -> init [runit, open-rc, sysVinit, dunit] -> desktop (LXQT, or Herbstluft), you'll find any DDR3 based system will serve you well.
Heck, your ssd and even hdd's may serve without a hickup. You'll find that transfer rates are somewhat limited, but, with the limited scope, there is no issue.
So, why DDR5 memory, combined with high-end Video Cards and high-end CPU:
Time to do things:
For instance, I could try and run Qubes on 16G. It works. But 32 is a smoother experience, let alone 64, or 128G.
So, what reason could there be to want virt.env?
In a way: why would you want to buy a car that could run 150 miles per hour, when you get at your destination with 20 miles an hour?
Or, why do you buy a pickup truck when your travels is daily hampered by traffic jams for 2 hours?
Or, worse, you do not need a 30 round magazine to hunt ..... So, we should be restricting your right to carry and bear arms. ....
I mean I occasionally game or use some software but 16 gigs is plenty... 64 gigs were generally only for servers and really memory hungry applications... Not judging just trying to understand.
A lot of local AI agents running.
-_-
Bro is out here talking smack about Data Centers and is himself a Data Center.
lol
...banker boxes are still reasonably priced...
I probably have hundreds filled with various "stuff." Most of it is information related.
I have a large home office that is over full with stacks of banker boxes. Some are already collapsing. I plan to rent a storage unit that can be delivered to my house, similar to a POS, move all the boxes to it, buy racks for the boxes, then move things back in. At least I'll be able to access individual boxes, once I actually look inside them and label them. Right now, there are boxes on the bottom in the middle I haven't accessed in over 10 years. It's like the warehouse scene at the end of the Indiana Jones movie where the Ark was stashed.
About 3 years ago I built a new computer with 32 GB of DDR 5 memory. It cost about a $160 for the memory. Last year, I looked and it was over $300 for 32GB.
My first computer memory cost 179 for 16 k, floppy drives when they came out were 500 and disks held either 64 k or 128 k (I don’t remember)
My first entire computer system, including a memory upgrade to 16K, was $88. It was a Timex-Sinclair using the Z80 chip, same as the TRS-80 Model I, II, etc. I used a Radio Shack book on machine language programming to make it do neat stuff, but the memory limited the length of programs.
The 5" floppy disks for the Radio Shack computers were 128K. The 3.5" floppies for PCs were 720K or 1.44M for double density. But the insides were identical for ease of inventory and manufacturing, so I bought a hand punch that would punch a square hole in the case of the disk so the computer would see it as 1.44M. The 5" floppy disks had a notch you could cover to make them read-only and a small hole near the center which allowed the computer to tell every time the disk rotated. You could punch a notch on the opposite side and a small hole in the opposite position on both sides of the jacket, careful not to damage the disk, and you had what we called a "flippy." There was a recording surface on both sides of the disk, but the Radio Shack computers used only one side. With a "flippy," you could flip the disk and save stuff on the other side.
This brings back some good memories, thank you
You may like these - and a bunch of other people on this site will as well. I just replaced my old Steelcase desk (the giant metal desks with the wood-like top that was also metal) with a new 81"x59" L-shaped executive desk. It actually has wood, so I wanted coasters.
When I saw these I absolutely had to have them. I use them every day.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01N4GOSDF
They are fairly cool alright 👍
I have plenty of old AOL disks that I could use as coasters, as well as all the other disks I've ever owned. There are all still here in boxes, along with the 5" disks, some Zip disks, and one 8" floppy I bought to use at work 40 years ago.
I can't replace my desk, which I've had for over 30 years. It won't go through any door without disassembly, which I'm not able to do anymore. I've done it twice before, once when I bought it from work for $50, and then again when I moved to my current house. Just the top is more than I can carry now. It's a 3'x6', all metal with wood grain Formica on the top. The wood pattern means I don't have to use a mouse pad.
Cool info, I had an Atari 800, then an Atari ST, then a 386 IBM clone
My first IBM clone was a Tandy 3000NL, which was a 286 clone. I paid over $700 to include a 20MB "hard card" for storage. At the time, I kept all files on floppies. Now, with so much hard drive storage, I keep all files on hard drives with multiple backups.
Magnetic core memory was $1 per bit at one time.
That values one of my PCs at over $800,000,000,000. If only I could go back in time and cash in! It is amazing how far we have come in a single lifetime.
Mine was a Commodore VIC 20 with the cassette tape drive, and then a Tandy 1000SL with a 20mb (yes - mb) hard card.