Nah, just sanction the shit out of them and if they don't want to pay up, then throw them in the clink and forfeit their company's profits while they're locked up.
Should tell the illegals to rat on who hired them, and if they do they get a $1000
Then fine the business the thousand dollars plus the cost of deportation, and then it doesn't cost the tax payer anything, and the illegal is in a better position to support themselves in their own country.
I expect they will eventually punish the employers. Similar to the squeeze they put on people to get the vax, I think they’ll steadily ramp up consequences. Right now it’s rounding up the criminals and allowing others to self deport. Later it will be shutting off illegal bank accounts and confiscating their assets (tens of millions will self deport when this happens), and lastly it will be penalizing employers who knowingly hire illegals.
Fair, but keep them at the ready if you are out of work, looking for a job, or looking for a better career, because this is going to scare a lot of illegals.
But share this line of thinking to any other patriots who it might apply to, and also use the reasoning to coax any radicals who aren't working to get a job and get respectable with it. A good paying job can turn their life around into a patriot!
lets get Americans good jobs and working again at good wages, which can be a real thing if it's suddenly difficult for illegals to work and employers to undercut wages by hiring illegals.
Trump needs to make Worker ID as important as Voter ID and lay out some hefty fines and jail time for those caught giving them work. They would probably start walking back to wherever they came from on their own.
I'd love to know why I, as a citizen, have to present my passport or two other forms of ID to be hired. How do these companies get away with this? Maybe if we abolish the payroll tax it will be easier to hire Americans. Also, Obamacare requires the employer to provide Healthcare if you work 40 hours a week. This is making us a nation of part-timers. How about the government just get the F out of everything? I'd rather have a full-time job and pay for my own healthcare.
And when we have to pay for our own healthcare, the market will set the price. That price will be significantly lower than what is currently being charged.
A lot of it is done through subcontractors. So a building company will subcontract out to different companies for framing, plumbing, electric, drywall, etc., and the subcontractors show up with their team, composed of under-the-table day laborers. Sometimes the subcontractors even subcontract and the people onsite become even more obscured.
That's a tough one. Technically they can own the company, hire legal workers and pay appropriate fees and taxes. What they are not supposed to do is work in the US with an I-9. Where does that enforcement occur and who is responsible to implement it?
I don't know, but it certainly seems to conflict with the "you can't harbor illegal aliens" statutes that James Woods just posted today. I'll try to copy that here.
When they were doing the build-out for the 4-floor anchor tenant in 2023 I chatted with drywall installers who were making 20 bucks an hour cash. No FICA, no Unemployment, no Workers comp, no vacation, sick, or holiday pay, no insurance, no 1.5 for OT (they rarely worked OT because their American supervisors OT) These weren't all highly skilled illegals and the workmanship shows it.
I tried hiring a couple gringos at Lowe's to move a bunch of crushed stone on my property last year. They wanted 30.00/hr. I rented a skid steer and did it myself.
The destruction of the working class is necessary to dominate a people. If you have work that provides for your family then you won’t rely on the government and you might get your own ideas of how to live. This was NEVER an unintended consequence of woke policies it was the real purpose of those policies. A cheap controllable labor force so the elites can farm us like cattle and work us like chattel.
There's a place near me, just a big parking lot where the illegals would go every morning. They damned near filled the lot, and by nine o'clock it was empty. Every single day.
Who better to shine light on this than a major developer turned POTUS? If anyone is aware of just how many skilled labor jobs have gone to illegals, it would be POTUS45/47.
Yup, that's about what we see on the job sites. The general contractors are just as much at fault for hosting the safety orientation in Spanish and not checking immigration status
It looks like all able bodied Americans collecting unemployment better get off the dole and get their shoulders to the wheel. I'd bet most of them would like nothing more.
A local construction owner bragged in the local rag that he wouldn’t hire smokers, but that asshole hires illegals. As soon as ICE gets the worst devils do the right thing and report every yard care, construction, farmer, trucking company that hires illegals. Believe me, local citizens need work and taxpayers shouldn’t have to cover the cost of their greasy help.
Deporting “Cheap immigrant labor” means an economic renegotiation occurs. County does not keep operating at current quality of life without evaluation. I am not seeing plans to reduce layer on layer of people. When 18 people are involved per doctor visit. That is 15 layers not producing the service.
No so. In 1980 I could earn $25 an hour doing piece work, about 4 times what could be made delivery pizza. Today, you're lucky to make $25 an hour in construction. Why would a legal American want to work for $25 an hour when they can make $27 an hour for delivering pizza? That's what my granddaughter made 2 years ago when she was only 18. Doing the math clearly indicates construction should be paying $100 an hour. If construction paid that much, most young adults would skip college and work in construction.
Now, I'm not suggesting that we should pay construction workers $100 an hour, but we must acknowledge that there's a serious imbalance in our economy. The free market should dictate wages, but it must also be fair and just. If illegal aliens are coming to work for less. This undercuts American jobs because the contractors can bid lower because they have unlimited cheap labor. This is entirely the point. $25.00 in 1980 when factoring inflation is $95.17 today.
I just did a “legal proceeding” where I critiqued a contractor in price for labor. When it was figured out, the subs were being paid a little less than $2.00/hour. The contractor said that was correct!!!! He was freaking proud of his lowball estimated amount. That’s a huge amount of the problem—contractors don’t understand their value and the cost of doing business.
It's not a free market when illegal immigrants make up the majority of the labor pool. Just like free trade isn't free trade if the country importing the product is using slave labor or dumping toxic chemicals in neighborhoods.
One of my daughter’s used to be manager of a couple hotels and we had many an argument over employing immigrant workers. Her argument was that American workers would not work for the pay and if they did they were crappy workers, where as immigrants worked harder for less pay. I believe it is problematic with some of these lower end jobs trying to have good pay to draw Americans, but then not break a company thru high payroll or crappy service.
No, it's financial lies to make the hoi polloi not think they are being screwed. I have been able to get hotel rooms for $89.99 a night since the 00s. What were american workers in 2000 are illegal workers now.
All to make us believe that inflation and taxation aren't killing us.
I’ve been in construction my whole life. Fourth generation builder. Build custom homes mainly. No one wants to work like we do. It’s either hot or cold. Rain and windy. No 401k’s. No benefits. No paid vacation. No guarantee weekly or even monthly paycheck. And most people you work for don’t wanna pay. Or you have to chase them down. Then they want to sue because they can’t pay for it. Work is hard and heavy. Back breaking. No medical or insurance. So don’t get hurt. So you can go work at McDonald’s or Walmart, or maybe make another $2 more and try not to fall off the house when it’s 20 degrees outside with a 20mph wind blowing. Thrilling! Also make sure to do a perfect job. One wrong hit or crack, be ready to work for free. Who wouldn’t want to do this!? 🙄
I feel your pain brother. Quit doing GC work in 2012 when we were spending 10-20 hours a week chasing payments. People would pay the first 2 out of 3 advances and gush over the work then not want to pay. Never will I forget my last complete house rebuild after a fire. Was accused of messing up final paint touch up and it came out in court the kids took markers to the walls since we had completion pics of every room. That was the last straw for me $57,000 payment owed and $36,000 in lawyer and court costs. At least she lost her job in government security since if you’re in business as long as I was you get to “know people”.
See my reply above. It should be paying about 4x what it currently pays to keep pace with wages in 1980. They slowly filtered in the illegal immigrants and slowly reduced the value of the labor until it became exactly as you say. It's tough work and will definitely make a man out of you. I've been framing for almost 48 years (strictly management since I turned 60) but I still do a lot of labor work to keep my guys productive
It makes you hard, but broken. See guys my age doing things my body is already giving up on. Knees and wrists. Joints/hip and my back got screwed up about 14 years ago. Sciatic nerve pain almost daily. Sucks. It’s probably how we build. We don’t use skyhooks or the like. Cost is to high for the use. Got my right shoulder for beams and heavy lifting. Yea, “look” wise I look fit and built. But reality is, quite the opposite. It’s just like song from Toby Keith. “Not as good as I once was, but I’m as good once, as I ever was”.
Oh, and all my shirts are wore clean through on my right shoulder too. Just 1 sheet of plywood at a time, no more 2 or 3 sheets. My friends used to call me the human crane
My joints have suffered but they are definitely getting better the past few years. Lift lighter weights as you get older. It's hard to discipline yourself when you still have the strength to lift heavy things. Slow your pace but keep busy. It does hit harder but when you notice men the same age that don't have half your capacity and you notice how many prescriptions they take, it starts to hit you that you're in better shape than you realize. Slow the pace, lift lighter things (I mess this up too often and will hurt for days), and take some breaks throughout the day.
Good advice. Yeah it’s that time of life when your brain knows you can lift it, but the body starts to fail. Easy to get hurt in those years. We definitely work smarter nowadays. Lots of pulley’s and lever tactics. Of course it only takes one dumb decision and, done. That’s what happened to my grandad. He tried to save someone rolling down the roof. He stopped the man, but got thrown off, through some scaffolding boards and to the ground. Broke his hip terribly. Never was the same after that. Sometimes working around lesser experienced people is very dangerous. Their incompetence gets other people hurt. I prefer just working around my brother. We know each other. Been working together forever. So we know each others moves and capabilities.
It takes a few years for those joints to get better. I feel worthless when I'm not pushing myself but I need to remember that my value is in teaching others how to be more productive and the techniques to make it easier
You don't make it sound great, but hopefully it pays all the bills your family incurs. Good luck to you and your family. It does sound very rewarding when things go right, the money comes in, and people who contract with you actually pay you what was negotiated.
"Cheap labor" allows for overregulation and over taxation of business.. its makes business complicit in overbearing government because "cheap labor" becomes the only way in which business can survive in that climate.
Now do small businesses in America....NOT MANY GET THIS!!!
Small businesses would support other small businesses that MADE THINGS HERE IN THE USA
Right now... small businesses buy imported/Chinese SHIT that squeezes out other small businesses and producers from competing.
Tariffs protect ALL OF US - Especially those of us that either run a small business AND those who want to get out from under their boss' thumb and "Do it better my way" - THAT'S the real American dream.
Tariffs are gonna hurt for a while until we can produce everything we need HERE.
The dollar store "everything is so cheap why not?" Free for all HOARDING is coming to an end. There's no reason you need motif coordinated party supplies for a 2 year old and other trinkets that ultimately wind up in the trash.
Producing here means keeping the money HERE... which means keeping our communities healthy and wealthy by having the extra money to support local suppliers, artists and people that make our lives better.
The "value of a dollar" needs to be reevaluated...Few have any clue about what it takes to produce anything - including kids that maybe could get a job illegals have been occupying and start understanding the value of working, satisfaction and the power of buying their own stuff... That stays with you for life.
And they wonder why a whole generation just stopped trying.
More like 2 1/2 generations. I know plenty of Gen -Xers and Gen Z kids who have skills but have a hard time finding quality paying work.
::raises hand for family::: IT contract worker... Barely any work for husband the past two years.
Companies should be heavily fined for outsourcing and offshoring
Yup. But we need to take this further. Deport Pajeet too.
Hey I know an American born Pajeet... let's not deport him, he's a cool dude.
Deport the bosses who hired them as well. Don't want to break up the family.
definitely!
Nah, just sanction the shit out of them and if they don't want to pay up, then throw them in the clink and forfeit their company's profits while they're locked up.
Should tell the illegals to rat on who hired them, and if they do they get a $1000 Then fine the business the thousand dollars plus the cost of deportation, and then it doesn't cost the tax payer anything, and the illegal is in a better position to support themselves in their own country.
Good idea
I expect they will eventually punish the employers. Similar to the squeeze they put on people to get the vax, I think they’ll steadily ramp up consequences. Right now it’s rounding up the criminals and allowing others to self deport. Later it will be shutting off illegal bank accounts and confiscating their assets (tens of millions will self deport when this happens), and lastly it will be penalizing employers who knowingly hire illegals.
Polish up your resumes!
NO JOKE
All this deporting going on is going to leave a massive vacuum of vacated workspots!!!
Most polished resume on the desk as early as possible will get the best leverage and bargaining power!! don't wait!!
Think like Trump!
Fair, but keep them at the ready if you are out of work, looking for a job, or looking for a better career, because this is going to scare a lot of illegals.
But share this line of thinking to any other patriots who it might apply to, and also use the reasoning to coax any radicals who aren't working to get a job and get respectable with it. A good paying job can turn their life around into a patriot!
lets get Americans good jobs and working again at good wages, which can be a real thing if it's suddenly difficult for illegals to work and employers to undercut wages by hiring illegals.
Trump needs to make Worker ID as important as Voter ID and lay out some hefty fines and jail time for those caught giving them work. They would probably start walking back to wherever they came from on their own.
I'd love to know why I, as a citizen, have to present my passport or two other forms of ID to be hired. How do these companies get away with this? Maybe if we abolish the payroll tax it will be easier to hire Americans. Also, Obamacare requires the employer to provide Healthcare if you work 40 hours a week. This is making us a nation of part-timers. How about the government just get the F out of everything? I'd rather have a full-time job and pay for my own healthcare.
And when we have to pay for our own healthcare, the market will set the price. That price will be significantly lower than what is currently being charged.
Yes!!! to all of this.
A lot of it is done through subcontractors. So a building company will subcontract out to different companies for framing, plumbing, electric, drywall, etc., and the subcontractors show up with their team, composed of under-the-table day laborers. Sometimes the subcontractors even subcontract and the people onsite become even more obscured.
They use an I-9 and Federal law prohibits asking the immigration status of a subcontractor
They use an I-9 and Federal law prohibits asking the immigration status of a subcontractor
Aha! Well, that's something that needs to change!!
That's a tough one. Technically they can own the company, hire legal workers and pay appropriate fees and taxes. What they are not supposed to do is work in the US with an I-9. Where does that enforcement occur and who is responsible to implement it?
I don't know, but it certainly seems to conflict with the "you can't harbor illegal aliens" statutes that James Woods just posted today. I'll try to copy that here.
https://x.com/RealJamesWoods/status/1883406623735169065/photo/1
There's a specific mention that harboring aliens for "commercial or financial gain" is illegal.
100% fren. Wish in retrospect that we had pointed this out more to our grown sons a decade ago. I think they'd be happier in their careers now.
When they were doing the build-out for the 4-floor anchor tenant in 2023 I chatted with drywall installers who were making 20 bucks an hour cash. No FICA, no Unemployment, no Workers comp, no vacation, sick, or holiday pay, no insurance, no 1.5 for OT (they rarely worked OT because their American supervisors OT) These weren't all highly skilled illegals and the workmanship shows it.
How much would a legal worker cost corporations?
My lefty mother says Americans won't do those jobs. They will when;
They will be hired.
They aren't paid to stay home.
The wage will balance out pretty quick when projects are stagnant and GC will use force majeure to get out of the contract and renegotiate the cost.
I'm tired of the, oh Americans won't do that...
Who the fuck did that before all the immigrants! Americans used to do the job until we undercut them with immigration.
I tried hiring a couple gringos at Lowe's to move a bunch of crushed stone on my property last year. They wanted 30.00/hr. I rented a skid steer and did it myself.
At least now you know what you're worth per hour.
It'll cost them some money, but that's not the issue. The issue is the owners, C-suite execs, and board members demanding wages that are far too high.
Yeah, no one is worth 1,000 X the blue collar wages.
The destruction of the working class is necessary to dominate a people. If you have work that provides for your family then you won’t rely on the government and you might get your own ideas of how to live. This was NEVER an unintended consequence of woke policies it was the real purpose of those policies. A cheap controllable labor force so the elites can farm us like cattle and work us like chattel.
There's a place near me, just a big parking lot where the illegals would go every morning. They damned near filled the lot, and by nine o'clock it was empty. Every single day.
Let Holman know where it is.
Home Deport parking lots
It's not longer there because a big CVS is there now. But I'm sure there are others.
That sounds like a good place to round them up. A lot of bang for your buck.
One of our guys called from Phoenix this week and said they rounded up a bunch of guys standing around for day labor
Who better to shine light on this than a major developer turned POTUS? If anyone is aware of just how many skilled labor jobs have gone to illegals, it would be POTUS45/47.
POTUS45-47
only 8 of those mfers was legal?
Yup, that's about what we see on the job sites. The general contractors are just as much at fault for hosting the safety orientation in Spanish and not checking immigration status
Surprised? No, we all knew the Denomcrats were pro slavery.
It looks like all able bodied Americans collecting unemployment better get off the dole and get their shoulders to the wheel. I'd bet most of them would like nothing more.
A local construction owner bragged in the local rag that he wouldn’t hire smokers, but that asshole hires illegals. As soon as ICE gets the worst devils do the right thing and report every yard care, construction, farmer, trucking company that hires illegals. Believe me, local citizens need work and taxpayers shouldn’t have to cover the cost of their greasy help.
Deporting “Cheap immigrant labor” means an economic renegotiation occurs. County does not keep operating at current quality of life without evaluation. I am not seeing plans to reduce layer on layer of people. When 18 people are involved per doctor visit. That is 15 layers not producing the service.
Don't forget the H1Bs that bathe in cow poo.
These are the jobs Americans don't want to do.
No so. In 1980 I could earn $25 an hour doing piece work, about 4 times what could be made delivery pizza. Today, you're lucky to make $25 an hour in construction. Why would a legal American want to work for $25 an hour when they can make $27 an hour for delivering pizza? That's what my granddaughter made 2 years ago when she was only 18. Doing the math clearly indicates construction should be paying $100 an hour. If construction paid that much, most young adults would skip college and work in construction.
Now, I'm not suggesting that we should pay construction workers $100 an hour, but we must acknowledge that there's a serious imbalance in our economy. The free market should dictate wages, but it must also be fair and just. If illegal aliens are coming to work for less. This undercuts American jobs because the contractors can bid lower because they have unlimited cheap labor. This is entirely the point. $25.00 in 1980 when factoring inflation is $95.17 today.
I just did a “legal proceeding” where I critiqued a contractor in price for labor. When it was figured out, the subs were being paid a little less than $2.00/hour. The contractor said that was correct!!!! He was freaking proud of his lowball estimated amount. That’s a huge amount of the problem—contractors don’t understand their value and the cost of doing business.
Devalue the man and then devalue the job
It's not a free market when illegal immigrants make up the majority of the labor pool. Just like free trade isn't free trade if the country importing the product is using slave labor or dumping toxic chemicals in neighborhoods.
Amen fren!
One of my daughter’s used to be manager of a couple hotels and we had many an argument over employing immigrant workers. Her argument was that American workers would not work for the pay and if they did they were crappy workers, where as immigrants worked harder for less pay. I believe it is problematic with some of these lower end jobs trying to have good pay to draw Americans, but then not break a company thru high payroll or crappy service.
No, it's financial lies to make the hoi polloi not think they are being screwed. I have been able to get hotel rooms for $89.99 a night since the 00s. What were american workers in 2000 are illegal workers now.
All to make us believe that inflation and taxation aren't killing us.
yup, its cheep
And hopefully it is not because Americans won't do the work.
I’ve been in construction my whole life. Fourth generation builder. Build custom homes mainly. No one wants to work like we do. It’s either hot or cold. Rain and windy. No 401k’s. No benefits. No paid vacation. No guarantee weekly or even monthly paycheck. And most people you work for don’t wanna pay. Or you have to chase them down. Then they want to sue because they can’t pay for it. Work is hard and heavy. Back breaking. No medical or insurance. So don’t get hurt. So you can go work at McDonald’s or Walmart, or maybe make another $2 more and try not to fall off the house when it’s 20 degrees outside with a 20mph wind blowing. Thrilling! Also make sure to do a perfect job. One wrong hit or crack, be ready to work for free. Who wouldn’t want to do this!? 🙄
I feel your pain brother. Quit doing GC work in 2012 when we were spending 10-20 hours a week chasing payments. People would pay the first 2 out of 3 advances and gush over the work then not want to pay. Never will I forget my last complete house rebuild after a fire. Was accused of messing up final paint touch up and it came out in court the kids took markers to the walls since we had completion pics of every room. That was the last straw for me $57,000 payment owed and $36,000 in lawyer and court costs. At least she lost her job in government security since if you’re in business as long as I was you get to “know people”.
It's funny how the people who actually have the money to pay love the work and the people who don't have money look for any reason to not pay.
See my reply above. It should be paying about 4x what it currently pays to keep pace with wages in 1980. They slowly filtered in the illegal immigrants and slowly reduced the value of the labor until it became exactly as you say. It's tough work and will definitely make a man out of you. I've been framing for almost 48 years (strictly management since I turned 60) but I still do a lot of labor work to keep my guys productive
It makes you hard, but broken. See guys my age doing things my body is already giving up on. Knees and wrists. Joints/hip and my back got screwed up about 14 years ago. Sciatic nerve pain almost daily. Sucks. It’s probably how we build. We don’t use skyhooks or the like. Cost is to high for the use. Got my right shoulder for beams and heavy lifting. Yea, “look” wise I look fit and built. But reality is, quite the opposite. It’s just like song from Toby Keith. “Not as good as I once was, but I’m as good once, as I ever was”.
Oh, and all my shirts are wore clean through on my right shoulder too. Just 1 sheet of plywood at a time, no more 2 or 3 sheets. My friends used to call me the human crane
I used to have slight aches and pains I attributed to the tolls the physical labor jobs took on my body.
However, after I quit eating the Standard American Diet full of seed oils and processed carbs, and went carnivore, the aches and pains went away.
My joints have suffered but they are definitely getting better the past few years. Lift lighter weights as you get older. It's hard to discipline yourself when you still have the strength to lift heavy things. Slow your pace but keep busy. It does hit harder but when you notice men the same age that don't have half your capacity and you notice how many prescriptions they take, it starts to hit you that you're in better shape than you realize. Slow the pace, lift lighter things (I mess this up too often and will hurt for days), and take some breaks throughout the day.
Good advice. Yeah it’s that time of life when your brain knows you can lift it, but the body starts to fail. Easy to get hurt in those years. We definitely work smarter nowadays. Lots of pulley’s and lever tactics. Of course it only takes one dumb decision and, done. That’s what happened to my grandad. He tried to save someone rolling down the roof. He stopped the man, but got thrown off, through some scaffolding boards and to the ground. Broke his hip terribly. Never was the same after that. Sometimes working around lesser experienced people is very dangerous. Their incompetence gets other people hurt. I prefer just working around my brother. We know each other. Been working together forever. So we know each others moves and capabilities.
It takes a few years for those joints to get better. I feel worthless when I'm not pushing myself but I need to remember that my value is in teaching others how to be more productive and the techniques to make it easier
You don't make it sound great, but hopefully it pays all the bills your family incurs. Good luck to you and your family. It does sound very rewarding when things go right, the money comes in, and people who contract with you actually pay you what was negotiated.
It's tough work but I'm one bad ass grandpa. It has been good for my health (except when I fell off a second floor roof. That hurt
I am almost certain that hurt quite a bit. Glad you got through it well enough to continue working.
That should give our young men who aren't afraid of hard work some excellent opportunities.
"New construction defects" is the fastest growing sector of lawsuits
The good news is they are gonna all go MMGA!!! (or where the fuck ever)
We can do our own fucking work.
"Cheap labor" allows for overregulation and over taxation of business.. its makes business complicit in overbearing government because "cheap labor" becomes the only way in which business can survive in that climate.
This is hell here on earth
Now do small businesses in America....NOT MANY GET THIS!!!
Small businesses would support other small businesses that MADE THINGS HERE IN THE USA
Right now... small businesses buy imported/Chinese SHIT that squeezes out other small businesses and producers from competing.
Tariffs protect ALL OF US - Especially those of us that either run a small business AND those who want to get out from under their boss' thumb and "Do it better my way" - THAT'S the real American dream.
Tariffs are gonna hurt for a while until we can produce everything we need HERE.
The dollar store "everything is so cheap why not?" Free for all HOARDING is coming to an end. There's no reason you need motif coordinated party supplies for a 2 year old and other trinkets that ultimately wind up in the trash.
Producing here means keeping the money HERE... which means keeping our communities healthy and wealthy by having the extra money to support local suppliers, artists and people that make our lives better.
The "value of a dollar" needs to be reevaluated...Few have any clue about what it takes to produce anything - including kids that maybe could get a job illegals have been occupying and start understanding the value of working, satisfaction and the power of buying their own stuff... That stays with you for life.
Everyone knew it was happening for decades!
They could have enforced the law on the employers and it would have been stopped.