UPDATE: Turning Point USA Admits The Candace Owens Text Messages Are REAL!
(wltreport.com)
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People need to make the distinction between Israelites and Israelis, they are NOT the same.
"Israelites are the ancient people described in the Hebrew Bible (Tanakh) and other historical texts as the descendants of the patriarch Jacob (also named Israel). They are considered the ancestors of the Jewish people."
"Israelis are citizens or residents of the modern State of Israel, established in 1948."
There are no more Israelites by God's standard. To call oneself and Israelite one had to show their genealogy... Which was stored in the temple that was destroyed in 70 AD
This is not true. Only the priests (Levites) needed to prove lineage for service in the temple. These were the records that were stored in the temple and destroyed in 70AD.
Not every Jew carried a mini scroll in their pocket to prove ancestry.
Also, one could still be considered Israel or an Israelite if they joined themselves to the God of Israel. For example, Ruth the Moabitess wasn’t born an Israelite, but she left her people and said to Naomi, “Your people will be my people, and your God my God.” (Ruth 1:16–17)
She fully assimilated into Israel and even became part of the Messianic line- King David’s great-grandmother (Ruth 4:17, 22; Matt 1:5).
Same thing with Rahab from Jericho (Josh 2; 6:25) and the mixed multitude that left Egypt (Ex 12:38, 48–49).
Soo, foreigners could still become part of Israel through faith and allegiance to Israel’s God.
There are no more "true Israelites" since God destroyed the temple in 70AD
When Titus marched into Jerusalem in 70 AD and the temple went up in flames, it wasn’t just the end of the sacrificial system, it was the shredding of Israel’s family tree. The genealogical records were kept in the temple. You needed them to prove what tribe you were from, who your ancestors were, and, critically, whether you could serve as a priest. Once those records went up in smoke, the ability to prove tribal descent went with them.
So today, when someone claims to be a “true Israelite,” it’s a little like a guy insisting he’s the rightful heir to the throne of Gondor. Sounds impressive, but the paperwork is missing, pal. You can say you’re from Levi, but without records, you’ve got as much proof as the guy in the tin-foil crown at the bus stop.
And this isn’t an accident of history—it was God’s own judgment. Christ fulfilled the temple, the priesthood, and the sacrifices, and then God pulled the plug on the whole system. No more temple, no more records, no more endless genealogies (Paul warned against those in Titus 3:9). Because the true Israelite has already come. Jesus is the seed of Abraham, the Lion of Judah, and all who are in Him are the Israel of God (Galatians 6:16).
In short: after 70 AD, the only way to be a “true Israelite” is to be grafted into Christ. Everyone else is just rummaging around in the ashes of a burned-down filing cabinet.
The early church fathers didn’t miss the significance of 70 AD. They saw it as God Himself putting His own exclamation mark on the end of the old covenant system. Here are some examples:
Justin Martyr (2nd century)
In Dialogue with Trypho the Jew (chapters 16, 19), Justin argues that with the destruction of the temple, Jews lost the ability to fulfill the law’s requirements. No sacrifices, no priesthood, no genealogical proof. He tells Trypho plainly that Christians are now the true heirs of Abraham, because faith, not bloodlines, makes you a son of the covenant.
Tertullian (early 3rd century)
In An Answer to the Jews, he notes that after 70 AD, the Jews were scattered and temple worship was impossible. He sees this as proof that God had shifted His favor and covenant promises to those in Christ. He essentially says, “You can’t even prove your lineage anymore, because God Himself cut off that avenue.”
Eusebius (early 4th century)
In his Ecclesiastical History (Book 3, chapter 5), he records how Jerusalem was judged in 70 AD, and connects this to Christ’s prophecy in Matthew 24. He underscores that the temple’s destruction was the divine sign that the old covenant order had passed away, and with it the genealogical distinctions that propped up Jewish identity.
Irenaeus (2nd century)
In Against Heresies (Book 4, chapter 2), Irenaeus ties the promise to Abraham to Christ and those who believe in Him. He argues that fleshly descent doesn’t matter anymore, because God had deliberately removed that whole scaffolding by which Jews could boast.
So the patristic point was this: Once the genealogical records went up in smoke, Jewish claims to tribal purity were unprovable. And that wasn’t a historical accident, it was God’s judgment and mercy rolled into one. Judgment on unbelieving Israel, mercy in that the only Israel that matters now is the one united to Christ by faith.
To borrow a Wilsonism: the fathers understood that God didn’t just burn the temple down, He padlocked the genealogy office. From that point on, the only roll call that matters is the Lamb’s Book of Life.
I actually agree with a lot of what you’re saying here, but, if I understand you correctly, what your saying kinda mixes two separate things - covenant standing before God vs. ethnic identity.
I agree, 70 AD ended the Levitical system - the sacrifices, priesthood, and temple service. But the loss of records doesn’t mean the people themselves vanished. Paul still called himself “of the tribe of Benjamin” (Phil 3:5), and James still wrote “to the twelve tribes scattered abroad” (James 1:1). So clearly, Israel still existed even after Christ’s resurrection and before the temple’s fall.
The genealogies burning in 70 AD just ended the priestly verification, not the existence of Israelite bloodlines. God knows exactly who’s who (2 Tim 2:19), and He’s preserving a remnant that will one day call on His name (Zech 13:9).
Honestly, I think this whole “who’s a real Israelite” thing is kinda a giant red herring. Scripture’s focus isn’t on who can prove their lineage - it’s on where God’s plan unfolds. And that’s Jerusalem. The prophets and Revelation both point there as the center stage for what’s still coming.
Soo yeah, the paperwork’s gone, but the people aren’t. And the location - Jerusalem - is what really matters in the big picture IMO.
You’re right to separate covenant standing from ethnic identity, but let’s not pretend those two can run off in opposite directions like toddlers in a Walmart. In Scripture, they were always bound together in God’s redemptive plan, and the moment Christ fulfilled the covenant, the ethnic scaffolding was pulled down by design.
Yes, Paul was of the tribe of Benjamin—but that was before 70 AD, when such claims could still be verified. After the fire, anyone claiming tribal descent is basically saying, “My great-great-grandmother told me I’m a Levite, cross my heart.” Sure, God knows who’s who (2 Tim 2:19), but that’s not an argument for us still treating tribal Israel as a distinct covenant category. God also knows who His elect are, and that doesn’t mean we hand out name tags.
The point about the remnant is fine—Paul already handled that in Romans 9–11. There is a remnant, but that remnant is defined by faith, not DNA. The New Covenant doesn’t run on bloodlines; it runs on belief. And when Zechariah talks about that remnant calling on His name, he’s not promising a nationalistic revival complete with temple blueprints and red heifers—he’s pointing to the same gospel call that has already gone out to the nations, Jew and Gentile alike.
Now, about Jerusalem being the “center stage.” Let’s be careful not to confuse the set dressing with the script. The old Jerusalem played her part. But the New Jerusalem—the bride of Christ, the church—is the main act. If you’re still waiting for the camera to pan back to the old city, you’re standing in the theater lobby while the real story’s already rolling on the screen.
So yes, the people didn’t vanish, but their covenantal role did. The genealogical records didn’t just burn—they were divinely deleted. God hit “Save As,” renamed the file “The Church,” and moved it to the New Covenant folder.
Haha arguing with AI, gotta love it 😂
But seriously - I think you’re slipping into a bit of preterism here, man. 70 AD ended the Levitical system, not Israel itself. Burning the genealogies didn’t delete people any more than burning your birth certificate deletes you.
Paul still called himself “of the tribe of Benjamin” (Phil 3:5) and James wrote “to the twelve tribes scattered abroad” (James 1:1). God knows exactly who’s who (2 Tim 2:19).
Again, the whole “who’s a real Israelite” convo is kinda a giant red herring designed to get people to hate Israel. Scripture’s focus isn’t on who can prove descent but where God’s redemptive plan unfolds…and that’s Jerusalem.
Luke 21:24 says it’ll be “trampled until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.” Zech 12–14, Matt 24, and Rev 11 all point back to that city as the end-time stage - siege, national repentance, and the Lord’s feet on the Mount of Olives.
So yeah, I agree the New Covenant brings Jew and Gentile together in Christ, but the location of Jerusalem still plays a role in prophecy.
The people didn’t vanish, the covenant didn’t move to a new “folder” - God’s still writing the same story, and the final chapters take place right where He said they would.
Romans 11:2 literally says:
In Romans, Paul makes a clear distinction between individual salvation (by faith) and national calling (by God’s sovereign election).
Romans 9:4-5 - Paul lists Israel’s unique privileges:
Paul says these belong to Israel according to the flesh, not “spiritual Israel.”
Romans 11:1-2 - He straight-up asks:
That alone dismantles the idea that Israel’s identity or covenantal role ended at 70 AD.
Romans 11:25-29 – Paul says a partial hardening has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles comes in, and then, “All Israel will be saved… For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.”
You cant spiritualize that away without gutting Paul’s argument. He’s saying national Israel’s hardening is temporary, not permanent.
So yes - the remnant right now is defined by faith, but Paul still looks forward to a future restoration of ethnic Israel once the fullness of the Gentiles is complete.
In other words, your quoting Romans 9-11 to say “Israel’s done”, but Paul wrote Romans 9-11 to say “Israel’s not done yet.”
Something else to consider.
Revelation was written after 70 AD, which means Jerusalem clearly still matters.
John calls the harlot “the great city where our Lord was crucified” (Rev 11:8). That’s Jerusalem, not Rome. And the Beast turning on her (Rev 17:16) shows that she still plays a prophetic role right up until the end.
So unless you’re a full preterist who thinks Revelation already happened, you kinda have to admit - Jerusalem’s still on God’s stage
Pretty sure the ruling party in modern day Israel is spoken about explicitly in Revelation 2:9 and 3:9.
Those who say they are Jews but are not. They are a synagogue of Satan.
Oh, so you’re a futurist now when it comes to Revelation? 😏
How can Revelation be talking about modern-day Israel if you just said everything in Revelation “will happen soon” (1:1, 1:3, 1:7, 22:10) - meaning it already happened in 70 AD?
Which one is it? Is Revelation all past or does it still speak about the future?
You can’t have it both ways unless you’re a Partial Preterist or a Futurist who recognizes the dual nature of Hebrew prophecy - near fulfillment first, ultimate fulfillment later. Otherwise, you’re just cherry-picking whatever fits the argument in the moment.
There are no more "true Israelites" since God destroyed the temple in 70AD
When Titus marched into Jerusalem in 70 AD and the temple went up in flames, it wasn’t just the end of the sacrificial system, it was the shredding of Israel’s family tree. The genealogical records were kept in the temple. You needed them to prove what tribe you were from, who your ancestors were, and, critically, whether you could serve as a priest. Once those records went up in smoke, the ability to prove tribal descent went with them.
So today, when someone claims to be a “true Israelite,” it’s a little like a guy insisting he’s the rightful heir to the throne of Gondor. Sounds impressive, but the paperwork is missing, pal. You can say you’re from Levi, but without records, you’ve got as much proof as the guy in the tin-foil crown at the bus stop.
And this isn’t an accident of history—it was God’s own judgment. Christ fulfilled the temple, the priesthood, and the sacrifices, and then God pulled the plug on the whole system. No more temple, no more records, no more endless genealogies (Paul warned against those in Titus 3:9). Because the true Israelite has already come. Jesus is the seed of Abraham, the Lion of Judah, and all who are in Him are the Israel of God (Galatians 6:16).
In short: after 70 AD, the only way to be a “true Israelite” is to be grafted into Christ. Everyone else is just rummaging around in the ashes of a burned-down filing cabinet.
The early church fathers didn’t miss the significance of 70 AD. They saw it as God Himself putting His own exclamation mark on the end of the old covenant system. Here are some examples:
Justin Martyr (2nd century)
In Dialogue with Trypho the Jew (chapters 16, 19), Justin argues that with the destruction of the temple, Jews lost the ability to fulfill the law’s requirements. No sacrifices, no priesthood, no genealogical proof. He tells Trypho plainly that Christians are now the true heirs of Abraham, because faith, not bloodlines, makes you a son of the covenant.
Tertullian (early 3rd century)
In An Answer to the Jews, he notes that after 70 AD, the Jews were scattered and temple worship was impossible. He sees this as proof that God had shifted His favor and covenant promises to those in Christ. He essentially says, “You can’t even prove your lineage anymore, because God Himself cut off that avenue.”
Eusebius (early 4th century)
In his Ecclesiastical History (Book 3, chapter 5), he records how Jerusalem was judged in 70 AD, and connects this to Christ’s prophecy in Matthew 24. He underscores that the temple’s destruction was the divine sign that the old covenant order had passed away, and with it the genealogical distinctions that propped up Jewish identity.
Irenaeus (2nd century)
In Against Heresies (Book 4, chapter 2), Irenaeus ties the promise to Abraham to Christ and those who believe in Him. He argues that fleshly descent doesn’t matter anymore, because God had deliberately removed that whole scaffolding by which Jews could boast.
So the patristic point was this: Once the genealogical records went up in smoke, Jewish claims to tribal purity were unprovable. And that wasn’t a historical accident, it was God’s judgment and mercy rolled into one. Judgment on unbelieving Israel, mercy in that the only Israel that matters now is the one united to Christ by faith.
To borrow a Wilsonism: the fathers understood that God didn’t just burn the temple down, He padlocked the genealogy office. From that point on, the only roll call that matters is the Lamb’s Book of Life.
Israel is the only situation where a government or their intelligence agency does something evil, and detractors pour out of the woodwork to implicate every living member of the race instead of the government/intelligence agency.
There could be a thread about the Taliban, you won't see comments in the thread about hatred of Sunni muslims or Bacha Bazi where they rape boys.
There could be a thread about China, you won't have comments in the thread about how Chinese are committing genocide against Uyghurs, harvesting their organs.
There could be a thread about India, you won't see comments in the thread about how its the rape capital of the world and their roving rape gangs, or the barbaric mindset that would need to be ingrained into a population to allow it to happen.
There could be a thread about Muslims, you won't see 100s of unsourced hot takes on how muh Quran is evil.
But for some very odd, very unnatural reason, there are a never ending supply of bots wanting to disparage every living Jew.
Chinese are 17.2% of the world population. Muslims are 25.6% of the world's population. Indians are 17.8% of the world population. Those groups alone account for over 60% of the world's population, but you'll never hear a peep about these groups from the Jew haters.
In fact, most of the time they're standing up for Palestinians. They care so much about Quran believers as they rant for hours against Talmud believers.
The idea of Jewish no-go zones is ridiculous. The idea of roving Jewish rape gangs is ridiculous. The notion that Jews rape boys is preposterous. The notion that Jews are currently exterminating a group as large as the 12 million Uyghurs is ridiculous. But these idiots will rant for hours about muh USS Liberty, which would be fine if they were using it as an example of how to hate the Israeli government, but instead they use it as why every living Jew should be hated.
It's all a psyop. 1000s of bots and handfuls of weak-minded fools who believed the psyop. It makes no sense that such a large group of forum users would be ranting against 0.2% of the world's population while simultaneously not caring about 60% of the world's population with equally, if not more disturbing characteristics.
The Jew haters of GAW are the digital equivalent of Patriot Front.
No ACTS clearly states they worship Remphan and that’s what the Star of David really is.
The Kirk assassination is quickly resulting in a crisis of confidence in this administration for those paying attention.
The data assembled by John Cullen and Candice Owens points to Kirk's murder being a State-sponsored act.
Elements of the Israeli govt and/or intel community cannot be ruled out. Though I'm concerned at the number of people who have already made up their mind that Israel is to blame.
Regardless, I find it deeply concerning that an FBI that is ostensibly under President Trump's control continues to push the absurd narrative surrounding Tyler Robinson.
This narrative was tailor made to create division and rationalize the crackdown on violent Leftists. Mind you, I think this crackdown is long overdue, but I do not like being manipulated.
We need to pressure Kash Patel on X. We must get real answers and not this absurd lone wolf theory.
Candance responds: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5autG89PW6w
Charlie wasn’t flipping sides when it came to Israel. He just wasn’t going to use his influence. I don’t think it rises to the level for assassination. Not a good look for those Jews though.
It depends on what else was going on in the background.
"Leaving me no choice but to leave the pro- Israel cause."
But did they know that?
I don't know if that specifically rises to the level of assassination either, but maybe it's not just about him? He was fairly close to Trump, so what if he started talking to Trump about Israel? I think he was a convenient target and a message.
He said Israel was gonna ethnically cleanse Gaza and that Epstein was a Mossad Agent
I mean is it really that much less probable than the official narrative? I think we know now that Gaza talks were in a critical stage behind the scenes.
Ashkanazi at it again.
Just a thought:
Instead of people using this thread to argue about distinctions between Jews and the Israeli government, how about we pressure the FBI Director on X to drop their ridiculous narrative and tell us the truth?
This was almost assuredly a State-Sponsored assassination. Let's push for the truth and worry about Israeli semantics some other day.
I am becoming more and more convinced the "Israel killed Kirk" stuff that is being pushed so hard is a distraction from the fact that the US currently has an activated class of leftist drones primed to kill with a modicum of media programming.
Seems like every time Israel is brought up, it kills any and all discussing about deactivating and disarming these assets, because people seem to have this naive hope that we don't actually have an extreme leftist problem, and it's all just Israel super-assassins and media coverups.
The leftist drones are controlled by Israel.
Jews basically invented the left - just look at any founder of a leftist organization or philosophy... you will find a Jew at ground zero.
Even if you want to take that stance of leftists are exclusively controlled by Israel, you have to clean up your house first. You can't win a war when you have daggers to your back, and not fixing the leftist problem is just that, daggers to your back.
And the world is finally realizing this shitshow these people make. Islam and Judaism are both controlled by Satan. It isn't a coincidence that the most peaceful religion (Christianity) is attacked relentlessly, while those two are the real cancers of the world.
My Dad was a police officer and Israel has way more motive than the left. Why would a a leftist just hand the mid terms over. If Charlie Kirk officially denounced Israel it would be over for them. It’s not that hard.
Because leftism in the US populace is heavily tied with not understanding the concept of 2nd order effects. It's as simple as looking at the "eat the rich, import 3 billion illegals" that is constantly demanded without understanding how it suppresses wages or causes economic stagnation.
As far as Kirk denoucing them, first Kirk was not a god-king with unlimited power behind his words, he was a political activist with decent networking inroads into Trump's political machine. Even if he 180ed on Israel, it'd be at least years before anything percolated to actual anti-Israel policy, especially with older demographics still being heavy zionists.
Secondly, if Israel was so worried about their image, why would they assassinate the guy who was 80% on their side instead of 100%? Why not nip hostiles like Owens or Catboy Fuentes instead, and get the Lefty Golem tard wrangled instead? Purity spiraling and killing your allies doesn't really jive with the "Israel/MOSSAD is a political mastermind puppeting the US to it's own benefit" idea.
I think you SEVERELY under estimate how desperate Israel is with young people. People under 40 dgaf about Israel.
Only stupid dispensationalist boomers support them
That's kind of my point though, between the boomers and what AIPAC is currently in gives them another 5-10 years at least, barring the Plan, before any real action is taken by the US.
So, with that in mind, why risk the blow back by assassinating the guy who was mostly on your side but saw room for improvement, but flat out ignore the large Candice Owens parade float in the room screaming "Israel bad". Why risk tarnishing your image further by shooting the guy with a "...deep love for Israel and the Jewish people" instead of drone striking Hasan "Death to Israel" Piker?
Why risk the blowback they're currently getting for attacking Iran and Qatar, and levelling Gaza? The two state solution has never been this close and this is probably the most pivotal moment for them since the 6 day war. I'm not saying I'm 100% convinced, but Charlie had way more influence on that than Owens or Piker.
Is it also possible that some lone-wolf catboy, inspired by forbidden love and a semester of online college, grabbed a WW2 era rifle and nimbly assembled and disassembled it multiple times while bouncing around with partial leg paralysis on a rooftop, then hid it in his skinny jeans before he jumped from a roof, before dumping it in a clearing and texting a full message that filled in the whole timeline for investigators and providing the only motive - since the physical letter he wrote was accidentally destroyed by federal investigators? Sure.
In my opinion, it seems like an inside job. Somebody didn’t wanna lose the donations when it’s not about the money it’s about the money.
Not necessarily proof that Israeli government was behind it, but doesn't look good for them.
To be part of Israel, one's tribe has to be connected to the tribes of Joseph, which were given the birthright.
1 Chronicles 5... 1Now the sons of Reuben the firstborn of Israel—he was indeed the firstborn, but because he defiled his father’s bed, his birthright was given to the sons of Joseph, the son of Israel, so that the genealogy is not listed according to the birthright; 2yet Judah prevailed over his brothers, and from him came a ruler, although the birthright was Joseph’s— 3the sons of Reuben the firstborn of Israel were Hanoch, Pallu, Hezron, and Carmi...
The scepter was given to Judah (in Genesis), so when the tribes were all united (ie under King David) it was Judah that ruled (David was from Judah)... AND they got to use the name of Israel, which the tribes of Joseph had the right to.
As soon as they split, what happened? The northern tribes kept the name Israel because the tribes of Joseph (Ephraim and Manesseh) were in that group, and the remainder had to give up the name Israel and became known simply as Judah.
NOT Israel.
The Bible is quite clear in this distinction.
Modern day Israel claims to be populated by Jews from Judah (genetically, there's a whole other bag of beans going on there - they're about 50% Edomite because Judah absorbed Edom around 100BC - and then of course they have a ton of Ashkenazi blood which descends from Gog and Magog - not Abrahamic lineage at all.
Anyhow, for modern day Israel (Jews) to claim the name Israel actually goes against Biblical convention. They should be calling themselves Judah, if anything, until such time as they can show they have Ephraim or Manasseh there too.
I think trying to turn this into Israel had Charlie assassinated is ridiculous.
Maybe in your imagination but not in reality.
I don't need to refute it. You need to prove it. And you haven't.
Well? Prove it!
Almost as if most stereotypes/memes are true 🤔
Almost as if they all come about for a reason 🤔
Almost as if certain shitty behaviours are repeated so often through history that people start recognising patterns 🤔
Note: "Admits" has a negative connotation. it implies deceptive behavior forced into a corner.
Has TPUSA ever denied that these text messages existed or did they ever denounce them?
I watched the TPUSA video in the article - I didn't pick up anything like that.
Instead, he gives a very plausible (I think) reason for not sharing those text thread publicly up until now.
Almost 6 stories until we got to the Jewish thing today. I think we can do better.
Being hooked on donors is bad... I know that he has a mission to fulfil, but being ordered around by donors is one of the big problems with our political system...
That said, this could be a viable road for those on the "trap door he is not dead..." Wagon.
Because that n really set up Turning Point to be hugely popular a d independent of one big donor....