Apparently this stuff will turn into hydro-chloric acid rain after some time, and who knows how long that will go on. Decades maybe? More than 50 years? Suffice it to say this is one of the worst disasters to ever happen on American soil, because now the air, rain, and soil will become pure poison. Any crops sown there will be poison to eat, and may not even grow as intended anyway. My guess is there's going to be a mass depopulation in and around that area, even to the east coast, very soon. If the vax wasn't killing people fast enough for the elites this stuff in the air certainly will.
Lots of very good discussions here..... after all thats what this site is for. I learned a lot but I still have this question:
If the train derails and 'they' are concerned about hazardous chemicals, why would you add to the fire already in progress by detonation making the fire much, much worse? Who ordered the detonation?
I know the area well, I recently moved from there so I paid attention to the local news and I shrieked and gasped when I heard it was a 'controlled detonation' of hazardous material and saw the mushroom cloud that developed.
I was reading GGRockz posts below. I also read through all of her posts for the last few days. She has 3 pages of angry posts attempting to stop the dialogue on this subject.
She has been claiming the railroad is at fault. Blaming a railroad company pushes the guilt away from specific individuals. You can't arrest a railroad company.
She keeps throwing her stepson into the conversation, he took a picture but gave it to lawyers. All pictures these days are digital, if you made one copy, you can make another.
She claims many people are being negatively affected by this incident, "Have some compassion" she says.
I wonder if she said the same thing when people started researching 9/11? Internet patriots looking for answers were called conspiracy theorists. If not for the persistence of "conspiracy theorists" the truth about 9/11 would still be a mystery.
Her account here is 8 months old and she has a post score of 6200, she has not added much to the conversation since she has been here.
DeathRayDesigner always steps in to give defense to the deep state side of the conversation. A couple years back, the hot topic was DOD Law of War Manual. He tried to convince me my theories were wrong. He seems to step in at the right time to take the heat off the deep state with rationalizations that make no sense.
Death Ray's account is 2 years old, he has a post score of 557, he has added nothing to the conversation here but always steps in when hot topics are being discussed. He is a cleaner. Comes in after the murder and cleans up the room and cover up the evidence.
Like someone said below, you are glowing very brightly.
When me and my hubs heard on the news they were going to burn it I was like wth are they doing.He couldn't believe they were burning it either and he isnt fully red pilled yet. Never the less what goes up eventually comes down. Get your food in order everyone they want us all gone.
Don't worry. Its all being blown over Great Lakes and across Ontario.
Americans are fine. The Canadians however have a big problem.
Unfortunately the media and government won't tell them so all of this will blow over.
I have absolutely seen water supplies plumbed with PVC, especially newer installations. This Old House has also done it before, for a slightly easier to reference TV show I am 90% sure.
If you search "PVC pipe for potable water" you get a lot of results about its constant use for this purpose.
Sorry, but PVC pipe IS used for potable water. It is usually used as the supply line from the meter to just inside the house where the shut off valve is located. It’s usually a 1in or 3/4 in inner diameter pipe. Source: I have seen it used in many houses.
Not in my area, it is absolutely not recommended as PVC can leach chemicals. If you have a pvc pipe on your water lines you'd be smart to replace it. CPVC is ok but I'm not convinced that doesn't leach either.
At one time in my area, almost all the water lines coming from the meter were PVC. Now it’s mostly PEX being used, but PVC is still very common. Most people here would not be able to afford replacing the main line from the road. Copper is best IMHO.
I like pex myself... Just because it can freeze and not burst. 1st hand experience, it held up for a week completely frozen. Copper is excellent though for its antibacterial properties.
You know the miracle our founding fathers had against England? Themselves along with years of sacrifice, hardship, and loss. Eventually, they prevailed and established the Republic. We should be looking to them for inspiration on how to handle the tyranny we face today.
So now they have real reason to shoot down any foreign "weather balloons."
Railways have defect detectors that monitor for dragging equipment, overheated axles, etc. These systems may have frequent false alarms. So if they got a warning 30 miles before, they might have ignored it and continued on.
Vinyl chloride gas is one thing and bad enough. If memory serves me correctly, one of the combustion products of v/c is phosgene gas which is nerve agent that was used in WW1 and will drop you in your tracks. I used to work for a state "EPA" in a nearby state who were Nazi a-holes with industrial emissions, but when it came to "accidental" releases, they were idiots, cowards and liars. I'd expect the same in OH. In theory, dispersion modeling could be applied to give you some idea, but with the scale of this one I'd think any "good" news would be hard to find, if not nonexistent. Pray for Ohio...
Yea I think it is the chlorine part that breaks down to to Phosgene gas when heated to high temps. There are a few cases of welders cleaning parts with chlorinated brake cleaner. When they begin welding they get a plume of phosgene under the mask and drops them from just one breath.
Fucker has a link to stormfront up on his site.............
Yes, there is info to be found there but I think I will wade the sludge that is godlike for info before I make a habit of visiting that place(no point in handing DS and their reeing masses any ammo...)
If you and I were rude enough to not take their "no questions asked" jab, they are not going to be too sad if these chemicals accomplish the same goal.
That is exactly where I am considering what our government has done to us over the last 3 to 4 years. how can anyone not question this event? I understand there are people that work on the railroad that understand the policies and how they handle things, But considering all the death and everything that's going on there's something at play here. I am usually a trust but verify person, but No there's something nefarious here...
I am somewhat nearby.... A few days after, local reporting was that all dangerous materials had been disposed of or burnt off. More or less ending with "All of this is ok, and nothing to worry about." Which sounded astonishing to me....mere days after and it's all taken care of? In 2 days I don't think it would even stop burning.
Well either way, the "nothing to worry about" report was false.
Is anyone starting to think this (the explosion) is the real reason the MSM made up a conspiracy theory of 'unknown objects'? It's like almost proving this is a real bad chemical.
But hopefully we can get sources, can anyone confirm that this is the chemical that is going into the atmosphere?
I believe the reason for "muh UFOs" is to cover up EVERYTHING that's been coming out over the last month or so. The only thing bigger than all of those stories put together is "muh UFOs."
It was total negligence on the railroad. I saw the picture of the axle it was given to lawyers. I wish I could post it. The person who released it could lose his job. Trust me I am the first to believe in false flags. This isn't one.
The axle, what they call the hot box, was on fire 30 miles outside of East Palestine. The railroad told them do not stop keep going. This is standard procedure direct from the horses mouth.
NS had a town meeting last night. My husband's son said they are doing everything to screw them over. Handing out checks to shut them up.
Lawyers are involved. This is far from over.
His son is devastated and fears of living in a house he just purchased this summer. The lawyers told them to get a baseline on their health in case they develop illnesses.
I am infuriated because the government didn't do this as a false flag. The employee who gave the picture stated this is protocol.
How would you feel if you knew someone in this situation and you knew the truth and saw people turning this into a Deep State thing?
Yes, GGRockz had the same response to my post on this incident. She was infuriated at my post. I showed that the toxic cloud would fall into a heavy conservative section of Pennsylvania.
Blaming everything on a train wheel.
She has a picture that hasn't been produced.
Her stepson is devastated? So this means we should stop talking about it?
She talks about a coverup, handing peoples checks to shut them up. She seems to be doing her own coverup...HOW DARE YOU!!! LOL
The glowies come out when you are over the target, keep firing.
We need to keep the dialogue going. This shit was done intentionally. I read the tanks were in a burn pit. This means they dug a pit to put the tanks in, set it on fire and then covered the tanks up with soil when they were finished. Reporters getting arrested for asking the wrong questions? The communications of everyone involved needs to be pulled and find out who did this.
The official narrative is that the derailed tankers were under pressure and would have caused a massive explosion if they didn't burn off the toxic chemicals. It's a plausible-enough explanation, although I'm not really sure what to believe.
At room temperature, vinyl chloride is a gas. Its boiling point is about 8 deg F. The tanks contained liquified vinyl chloride, which works only if it is under pressure or liquified. If the tanks were going to fail, the resulting vinyl chloride death cloud would be huge and would roll over the countryside, killing everything in its wake. The only alternative was to pre-empt THAT disaster by relieving the tanks of contents and burning them immediately to LESS DANGEROUS products. Still a bad scene, but it could have been MUCH worse.
It's entirely possible that an innocent clean-up crew was forced to make the tough decision you describe. I don't dismiss the possibility, so I'll upvote you. However, we have also seen numerous corrupt local governments over the years make questionable and sometimes deadly decisions that are obviously intended to harm this country. We don't know, and we have little reason to believe the official explanation of anything anymore.
It is epistemological procedure: the presumption of innocence, until guilt (of falsity) is proven. A perfectly justifiable procedure, based on thousands of years of experience.
I am mindful of the EPA breach of the contaminated water in the Gold King mine into the Colorado River. But we had to learn the facts before we could blame anyone. Same thing here. We have to wait and see. Jumping on the "it's a lie" wagon is unwarranted and leads to an unhealthy prejudice against information.
It is irrelevant whether the cleanup crew was "innocent." The only relevant consideration is whether that decision was warranted. Nobody has identified any practical or viable alternative. Sometimes you have to shoot the rampaging elephant before he gets into the village. Tough luck for the elephant.
Nobody has identified any practical or viable alternative.
Alternative: Bad actors interested in causing a major environmental disaster over farmland lied about the amount of pressure in the tankers so that local officials were forced to burn off the toxic chemical "out of an abundance of caution."
We simply don't know. And frankly, neither the government, the "experts," or the official narrative deserve the "presumption of innocence" these days.
Then you are lost, because it is never possible to prove innocence.
But you still haven't identified any alternative to the burn-off. Supposedly, it was an emergency response team that decided to conduct the burn-off, not local officials. Just because you are ignorant now, does not justify concluding someone is lying. If they are, we need to catch them in the lie. But that requires more information.
It was total negligence on the railroad. I saw the picture of the axle it was given to lawyers. I wish I could post it. The person who released it could lose his job. Trust me I am the first to believe in false flags. This isn't one.
The axle, what they call the hot box, was on fire 30 miles outside of East Palestine. The railroad told them do not stop keep going. This is standard procedure direct from the horses mouth.
NS had a town meeting last night. My husband's son said they are doing everything to screw them over. Handing out checks to shut them up.
Lawyers are involved. This is far from over.
His son is devastated and fears of living in a house he just purchased this summer. The lawyers told them to get a baseline on their health in case they develop illnesses.
I am infuriated because the government didn't do this as a false flag. The employee who gave the picture stated this is protocol.
How would you feel if you knew someone in this situation and you knew the truth and saw people turning this into a Deep State thing?
Intentionally sunk only in someone's fevered imagination. I guess the reality of a ghastly accident is too pathetic to accept. It has to be the product of a dastardly plot.
Ok doucebag. Why would Captain Smith, a devoted Jesuit, travel full speed through an 80sq mile ice field during the night, ignoring EIGHT telegrams warning him of the danger and to slow the ship down. Why did J.P. Morgan bail the day of departure? You know John Jacob Astor, Isidor Straus, Benjamin Guggenheim opposed the created of a central bank, and they perished?
Yeah, you are. All kinds of questions. And there are all kinds of answers. Were eight telegrams sent, or eight telegrams received? This was Morse Code, remember, and radio signal reception was always spotty. Here is an explanation (scroll down a bit to find the entry):
https://www.quora.com/Why-did-the-captain-ignore-the-warnings-on-the-Titanic?share=1
Vinyl chloride is extremely toxic. Look it up.
Its combustion products (phosgene and hydrogen chloride; look them up, too) are also toxic, but not as bad. You have your choice between "worse" and "bad." Which do you pick?
You guys believe what the hell YOU THINK YOU KNOW.
Do you understand what a hotbox is?
It is where the bearings are housed. They very often catch fire per the NS employee. Protocol is keep the trains moving. This happens almost daily he said. You can't sabotage this unless they do it daily.
The fire started 30 miles away and they were told to keep moving don't stop.
Trust me I am the first to believe in false flags. This isn't one.
Respectfully, we should not dismiss the possibility that a bad actor intentionally sabotaged the train or train track with the intention of causing a major disaster.
I live here. Hearing same thing about engineer called it in miles out and they said ignor it and keep going. It's bad. That said, the epa folks and national guard going around taking measurements in the streams and air are not wear hazmats or respirators. If they were, and telling us all don't worry, yeah right.
Again, that doesn't mean there wasn't a bad actor. I respect everything said by those close to the scene. It's valuable input. But you have to think it's possible that there was some ill intent, not just negligence right? Not just possible but highly likely??
It is where the bearings are housed. They very often catch fire per the NS employee. Protocol is keep the trains moving. This happens almost daily he said. You can't sabotage this unless they do it daily.
The fire started 30 miles away and they were told to keep moving don't stop.
Interesting how you ignored the part where I suggested that the actual track may have been sabotaged. ANTIFA has been known to do this Source 1Source 2Source 3.
Look, I understand being blinded with anger about the situation, but the militant way you keep insisting that we stick to the official narrative and don't question if sabotage was involved comes off as a suspicious.
I am angered because his son's family is in fear. They are being told to baseline their health.
He is based and reads this site. He is a first hand witness leading the charge to hold NS accountable. I can only tell you between him and the employee the one and only cause was the hotbox caught fire over 30 miles away and called it in. He was told keep moving.
I didn't ignore it. There was NOTHING wrong with the track.
Respectfully, you don't know that, I don't know that, and we, the public, don't know that. Hell, even the railroad employee might not know that (he be might just as in the dark as the rest of us about the track condition). We also don't know if the bearings you mentioned were intentionally sabotaged. We only know the official narrative and what you, random internet stranger, claim some railroad employee told your son. Frankly, after the last several years, there isn't a whole lot of reason to trust any of those things and with very good reason. I see zero reason to go, "Oh okay, well I guess we should dismiss the idea that the train was intentionally sabotaged over farmland and totally go with this random stranger's explanation that the bearings just happened to break in an extremely inconvenient place." That's just not happening, and if your son is indeed "based and reads this site," then he'll understand this position.
I understand completely. But isn't it official that some sort of 'detonation' was used by police? And do you think the culprit could have been a 'random stooge' placed there by the DS?
He said and was told the railroad placed shape charges under those cars. They dug trenches on either side put lit flares in the trenches then blew a small hole in the bottom of each tanker. This allowed the contents to ignite immediately.
All right, then. Here's more to consider. The explosions were only shaped charges to puncture the tanks to allow the drainage of the vinyl chloride. They took measures to trap the liquid and set it afire. The combustion products of vinly chloride are phosgene and hydrogen chloride. Phosgene is a poison gas and hydrogen chloride, when inhaled, will form hydrochloric acid in the lungs. Now, as bad as this sounds...it was not as bad as allowing the vinyl chloride to be released by itself. Think about that. Sometimes, the only choice available is between terrible bad and not-as-terrible bad. What would you do differently? What COULD you do differently?
I am not too impressed with the problems of "convincing" ignorant "anons" of the correctness of facts. I don't think anything I have said is "conjecture." The facts of the case have been disclosed. The facts of chemistry are available with a little search in Wikipedia. If the tanks were in prospect of failing from the derailment damage, it sounds like letting the vinyl chloride simply leak out and dissipate was a non-starter.
And there have been worse industrial accidents (e.g., Bhopal, India), so get a sense of perspective. It's not good. It could have been handled better. It sounds like the responsible parties are trying to cover it over. But there are no obvious alternatives to what they thought they needed to do for the sake of reducing risk.
Let me ask his son if something was detonated. I don't believe that to be true. Remember the original story a car hit the train? I knew immediately that wasn't true he told us yet everyone here was saying it.
I can explain the picture. Look at a train axle that sticks out through the wheel. You see the bolts and the axle sticking out.
The wheel when it was removed, the picture I saw, the entire axle that comes out was a rounded off nub. It caught fire over 30 miles out from here.
I would post the picture but the evil government lurkers could see it and wonder how the hell we got it. This puts the NS employee in danger.
The uncured, liquid form is just called vinyl Chloride. Do you think this is why they are downing weather balloons disguised as UFOs/chinese spy balloons so no one detects whats going on in the public??
"What's going on..."? Fren, all kinds of industrial chemicals, most of which are toxic, are transported by rail on a daily basis. Safely. How else would we get them from place to place? This is what DoT safety placards are for, to make sure that commodities are treated in accordance with their safety procedures. This has been going on since the development of the chemical industry, almost two centuries ago.
Can the gas cloud disperse to larger areas such as New England, and if so how concentrated/lethal can it be? Can it induce symptoms such as headache, etc? Anyone have a migraine come out of no where last few hours?
Yes these toxins will be taken with the wind and where the wind is blowing. It also depends on the concentration (ppm) which determines lethality/danger level. I wont necessarily know that and the government will most likely wont tell us. A few things that I would do is collect rain and air samples. Checking weather constantly to see where winds are blowing at the spot of disaster. Invest in clean water filtration
Apparently this stuff will turn into hydro-chloric acid rain after some time, and who knows how long that will go on. Decades maybe? More than 50 years? Suffice it to say this is one of the worst disasters to ever happen on American soil, because now the air, rain, and soil will become pure poison. Any crops sown there will be poison to eat, and may not even grow as intended anyway. My guess is there's going to be a mass depopulation in and around that area, even to the east coast, very soon. If the vax wasn't killing people fast enough for the elites this stuff in the air certainly will.
Lots of very good discussions here..... after all thats what this site is for. I learned a lot but I still have this question:
If the train derails and 'they' are concerned about hazardous chemicals, why would you add to the fire already in progress by detonation making the fire much, much worse? Who ordered the detonation?
I know the area well, I recently moved from there so I paid attention to the local news and I shrieked and gasped when I heard it was a 'controlled detonation' of hazardous material and saw the mushroom cloud that developed.
I was reading GGRockz posts below. I also read through all of her posts for the last few days. She has 3 pages of angry posts attempting to stop the dialogue on this subject.
She has been claiming the railroad is at fault. Blaming a railroad company pushes the guilt away from specific individuals. You can't arrest a railroad company.
She keeps throwing her stepson into the conversation, he took a picture but gave it to lawyers. All pictures these days are digital, if you made one copy, you can make another.
She claims many people are being negatively affected by this incident, "Have some compassion" she says.
I wonder if she said the same thing when people started researching 9/11? Internet patriots looking for answers were called conspiracy theorists. If not for the persistence of "conspiracy theorists" the truth about 9/11 would still be a mystery.
Her account here is 8 months old and she has a post score of 6200, she has not added much to the conversation since she has been here.
DeathRayDesigner always steps in to give defense to the deep state side of the conversation. A couple years back, the hot topic was DOD Law of War Manual. He tried to convince me my theories were wrong. He seems to step in at the right time to take the heat off the deep state with rationalizations that make no sense.
Death Ray's account is 2 years old, he has a post score of 557, he has added nothing to the conversation here but always steps in when hot topics are being discussed. He is a cleaner. Comes in after the murder and cleans up the room and cover up the evidence.
Like someone said below, you are glowing very brightly.
When me and my hubs heard on the news they were going to burn it I was like wth are they doing.He couldn't believe they were burning it either and he isnt fully red pilled yet. Never the less what goes up eventually comes down. Get your food in order everyone they want us all gone.
Don't worry. Its all being blown over Great Lakes and across Ontario. Americans are fine. The Canadians however have a big problem. Unfortunately the media and government won't tell them so all of this will blow over.
https://earth.nullschool.net/#current/wind/surface/level/orthographic=-81.59,42.52,3374
No if you change the wind height. This is blowing across PA farmland into DC
I wouldn't want to eat any fish from the great lakes after this.
It’s vinyl chrloide NOT poly vinyl chloride. Anon is wrong
So, uh, give me details. How much less bad is that for us?
Vinyl chloride is the more bad version.
It's not PVC if it's "uncured", the curing is what makes VC into PVC.
And I'm starting to think that even the PVC stuff isn't as "fine" as people think.
I mean, you're not intended to consume PVC, and off gassing is measurable with equipment.
The polymerization should be stable.
For its use in plumbing for consumption, you may be correct. But then, lead pipes can lead to Flint with small changes, iron can rust, etc.
Pvc is not used for potable water. Just drains.
I have absolutely seen water supplies plumbed with PVC, especially newer installations. This Old House has also done it before, for a slightly easier to reference TV show I am 90% sure.
If you search "PVC pipe for potable water" you get a lot of results about its constant use for this purpose.
You're thinking of CPVC. What the difference is, I am not sure.
Sorry, but PVC pipe IS used for potable water. It is usually used as the supply line from the meter to just inside the house where the shut off valve is located. It’s usually a 1in or 3/4 in inner diameter pipe. Source: I have seen it used in many houses.
Not in my area, it is absolutely not recommended as PVC can leach chemicals. If you have a pvc pipe on your water lines you'd be smart to replace it. CPVC is ok but I'm not convinced that doesn't leach either.
At one time in my area, almost all the water lines coming from the meter were PVC. Now it’s mostly PEX being used, but PVC is still very common. Most people here would not be able to afford replacing the main line from the road. Copper is best IMHO.
I like pex myself... Just because it can freeze and not burst. 1st hand experience, it held up for a week completely frozen. Copper is excellent though for its antibacterial properties.
We need a miracle to save us from these "people".
You know the miracle our founding fathers had against England? Themselves along with years of sacrifice, hardship, and loss. Eventually, they prevailed and established the Republic. We should be looking to them for inspiration on how to handle the tyranny we face today.
Will medbeds cure my asthma?
Based exopolotics enjoyer
So now they have real reason to shoot down any foreign "weather balloons."
Railways have defect detectors that monitor for dragging equipment, overheated axles, etc. These systems may have frequent false alarms. So if they got a warning 30 miles before, they might have ignored it and continued on.
Vinyl chloride gas is one thing and bad enough. If memory serves me correctly, one of the combustion products of v/c is phosgene gas which is nerve agent that was used in WW1 and will drop you in your tracks. I used to work for a state "EPA" in a nearby state who were Nazi a-holes with industrial emissions, but when it came to "accidental" releases, they were idiots, cowards and liars. I'd expect the same in OH. In theory, dispersion modeling could be applied to give you some idea, but with the scale of this one I'd think any "good" news would be hard to find, if not nonexistent. Pray for Ohio...
Yea I think it is the chlorine part that breaks down to to Phosgene gas when heated to high temps. There are a few cases of welders cleaning parts with chlorinated brake cleaner. When they begin welding they get a plume of phosgene under the mask and drops them from just one breath.
They sure are not going to be in any sort of rush to begin any detailed conversation concerning what is going on.
I'd say it's time to source our own meats and veggies. Hard to trust prepackaged foods now.
Yeah, my backyard is in Ohio though…
so i need to get something corrected here:
And who are 'they'?
Probably you
No they did a “controlled burn” that’s what the New York post article said
I'm aware and that doesn't dispute anything I'm asking thanks.
Looks like this particular post has been removed from 4chan........
And I'm too tired to type it out to use as a comment on reddit..
If anyone has a direct link to it or an archive of it I would definitively appreciate it..
https://archive.4plebs.org/pol/thread/415247150/#415256227
posts only stay on 4chan for a few days, everything gets archived to 4plebs.org. you can search or any old post there.
It's from Jim Stone. Scroll down a bit http://www.voterig.com/.up5.html
Fucker has a link to stormfront up on his site.............
Yes, there is info to be found there but I think I will wade the sludge that is godlike for info before I make a habit of visiting that place(no point in handing DS and their reeing masses any ammo...)
If you can't see the bot activity in this thread you are blind.
It's not always bots. Sometimes people really think a guy is nuts.
I know one on another win. He's quite the impossible one.
"Everyone who doesn't agree with me are bots"
Well, I found Tim Pool's GAW account 🧐
Amen to that
If you and I were rude enough to not take their "no questions asked" jab, they are not going to be too sad if these chemicals accomplish the same goal.
That is exactly where I am considering what our government has done to us over the last 3 to 4 years. how can anyone not question this event? I understand there are people that work on the railroad that understand the policies and how they handle things, But considering all the death and everything that's going on there's something at play here. I am usually a trust but verify person, but No there's something nefarious here...
Odd its PALESTINE OH, like the Middle East PALESTINE, and FISH and Shit Dying, like a Plague...
Endtimes shit!
OHIO: Dead fish and cattle being reported as far as 100 miles away from the site.
Journalists covering the story have been arrested
Also: Some of the most fertile land in the country. Train company mostly owned by Blackrock and Vanguard
Given what has been happening to the food supply, eggs, etc, It's definitely worth an investigation at least. Found on TS
I am somewhat nearby.... A few days after, local reporting was that all dangerous materials had been disposed of or burnt off. More or less ending with "All of this is ok, and nothing to worry about." Which sounded astonishing to me....mere days after and it's all taken care of? In 2 days I don't think it would even stop burning. Well either way, the "nothing to worry about" report was false.
HOW DARE YOU!!
Is anyone starting to think this (the explosion) is the real reason the MSM made up a conspiracy theory of 'unknown objects'? It's like almost proving this is a real bad chemical.
But hopefully we can get sources, can anyone confirm that this is the chemical that is going into the atmosphere?
I believe the reason for "muh UFOs" is to cover up EVERYTHING that's been coming out over the last month or so. The only thing bigger than all of those stories put together is "muh UFOs."
that's a valid point, anon, it's on my mind too.
This is total BS.
It was total negligence on the railroad. I saw the picture of the axle it was given to lawyers. I wish I could post it. The person who released it could lose his job. Trust me I am the first to believe in false flags. This isn't one.
The axle, what they call the hot box, was on fire 30 miles outside of East Palestine. The railroad told them do not stop keep going. This is standard procedure direct from the horses mouth.
NS had a town meeting last night. My husband's son said they are doing everything to screw them over. Handing out checks to shut them up.
Lawyers are involved. This is far from over.
His son is devastated and fears of living in a house he just purchased this summer. The lawyers told them to get a baseline on their health in case they develop illnesses.
I am infuriated because the government didn't do this as a false flag. The employee who gave the picture stated this is protocol.
How would you feel if you knew someone in this situation and you knew the truth and saw people turning this into a Deep State thing?
Do soil and water samples now
Ok, why use explosives and release this shit into the air we breathe? Looking at your previous comments you are glowing bright.
The only explanation I can think of (which is completely unqualified) is that seeping into the groundwater system was a worse alternative?
Yes, GGRockz had the same response to my post on this incident. She was infuriated at my post. I showed that the toxic cloud would fall into a heavy conservative section of Pennsylvania.
Blaming everything on a train wheel.
She has a picture that hasn't been produced.
Her stepson is devastated? So this means we should stop talking about it?
She talks about a coverup, handing peoples checks to shut them up. She seems to be doing her own coverup...HOW DARE YOU!!! LOL
The glowies come out when you are over the target, keep firing.
We need to keep the dialogue going. This shit was done intentionally. I read the tanks were in a burn pit. This means they dug a pit to put the tanks in, set it on fire and then covered the tanks up with soil when they were finished. Reporters getting arrested for asking the wrong questions? The communications of everyone involved needs to be pulled and find out who did this.
Yup, 37 posts on several threads, copy pasta or saying almost the exact same thing every time.
Trying waaay too hard.
The official narrative is that the derailed tankers were under pressure and would have caused a massive explosion if they didn't burn off the toxic chemicals. It's a plausible-enough explanation, although I'm not really sure what to believe.
At room temperature, vinyl chloride is a gas. Its boiling point is about 8 deg F. The tanks contained liquified vinyl chloride, which works only if it is under pressure or liquified. If the tanks were going to fail, the resulting vinyl chloride death cloud would be huge and would roll over the countryside, killing everything in its wake. The only alternative was to pre-empt THAT disaster by relieving the tanks of contents and burning them immediately to LESS DANGEROUS products. Still a bad scene, but it could have been MUCH worse.
It's entirely possible that an innocent clean-up crew was forced to make the tough decision you describe. I don't dismiss the possibility, so I'll upvote you. However, we have also seen numerous corrupt local governments over the years make questionable and sometimes deadly decisions that are obviously intended to harm this country. We don't know, and we have little reason to believe the official explanation of anything anymore.
It is epistemological procedure: the presumption of innocence, until guilt (of falsity) is proven. A perfectly justifiable procedure, based on thousands of years of experience.
I am mindful of the EPA breach of the contaminated water in the Gold King mine into the Colorado River. But we had to learn the facts before we could blame anyone. Same thing here. We have to wait and see. Jumping on the "it's a lie" wagon is unwarranted and leads to an unhealthy prejudice against information.
It is irrelevant whether the cleanup crew was "innocent." The only relevant consideration is whether that decision was warranted. Nobody has identified any practical or viable alternative. Sometimes you have to shoot the rampaging elephant before he gets into the village. Tough luck for the elephant.
Alternative: Bad actors interested in causing a major environmental disaster over farmland lied about the amount of pressure in the tankers so that local officials were forced to burn off the toxic chemical "out of an abundance of caution."
We simply don't know. And frankly, neither the government, the "experts," or the official narrative deserve the "presumption of innocence" these days.
Then you are lost, because it is never possible to prove innocence.
But you still haven't identified any alternative to the burn-off. Supposedly, it was an emergency response team that decided to conduct the burn-off, not local officials. Just because you are ignorant now, does not justify concluding someone is lying. If they are, we need to catch them in the lie. But that requires more information.
see my comment above re: combustion products of vinyl chloride. Phosgene gas is NOT "less dangerous". You're just picking a different poison.
They are close at the threshold limit level. It apparently came down to whether to allow a tank explosion to occur, or burn off the vinyl chloride.
An interesting summary is already available on Wikipedia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Ohio_train_derailment
Can anyone confirm?
Confirm what?
Fox reported it so it's mainstream, so the event did happen:
https://greatawakening.win/p/16aADkfOp5/ohio-mayor-furious-with-norfolk-/c/
As for confirming the cargo, not 100% sure yet.
Fox covering is proof it didn’t happen. I won’t believe it until I see Patriot coverage.
Fox also reported that planes flew into the twin towers and Pentagon, sooo…
My point being, it's too big to hide so fox has to report it.
If it's in the news...
IT'S FAKE
The toxicity of these substances from the chemist's perspective.
(Specifically Anon's claims)
This is BS post.
It was total negligence on the railroad. I saw the picture of the axle it was given to lawyers. I wish I could post it. The person who released it could lose his job. Trust me I am the first to believe in false flags. This isn't one.
The axle, what they call the hot box, was on fire 30 miles outside of East Palestine. The railroad told them do not stop keep going. This is standard procedure direct from the horses mouth.
NS had a town meeting last night. My husband's son said they are doing everything to screw them over. Handing out checks to shut them up.
Lawyers are involved. This is far from over.
His son is devastated and fears of living in a house he just purchased this summer. The lawyers told them to get a baseline on their health in case they develop illnesses.
I am infuriated because the government didn't do this as a false flag. The employee who gave the picture stated this is protocol.
How would you feel if you knew someone in this situation and you knew the truth and saw people turning this into a Deep State thing?
Yea and? The titanic was intentionally sunk too, despite warnings way ahead of time, just like your scenario.
Intentionally sunk only in someone's fevered imagination. I guess the reality of a ghastly accident is too pathetic to accept. It has to be the product of a dastardly plot.
Ok doucebag. Why would Captain Smith, a devoted Jesuit, travel full speed through an 80sq mile ice field during the night, ignoring EIGHT telegrams warning him of the danger and to slow the ship down. Why did J.P. Morgan bail the day of departure? You know John Jacob Astor, Isidor Straus, Benjamin Guggenheim opposed the created of a central bank, and they perished?
OH but I'm just a conthpirathee theeristh
Yeah, you are. All kinds of questions. And there are all kinds of answers. Were eight telegrams sent, or eight telegrams received? This was Morse Code, remember, and radio signal reception was always spotty. Here is an explanation (scroll down a bit to find the entry): https://www.quora.com/Why-did-the-captain-ignore-the-warnings-on-the-Titanic?share=1
So is it a bad chemical?
Vinyl chloride is extremely toxic. Look it up. Its combustion products (phosgene and hydrogen chloride; look them up, too) are also toxic, but not as bad. You have your choice between "worse" and "bad." Which do you pick?
That's what i've heard, but is it that chemical for sure?
You guys believe what the hell YOU THINK YOU KNOW.
Do you understand what a hotbox is?
It is where the bearings are housed. They very often catch fire per the NS employee. Protocol is keep the trains moving. This happens almost daily he said. You can't sabotage this unless they do it daily.
The fire started 30 miles away and they were told to keep moving don't stop.
Why would I know this stuff? I am a damn woman.
Respectfully, we should not dismiss the possibility that a bad actor intentionally sabotaged the train or train track with the intention of causing a major disaster.
Did you see this comment?
justin_tolerable jasqid 11 minutes ago +3 / -0
I live here. Hearing same thing about engineer called it in miles out and they said ignor it and keep going. It's bad. That said, the epa folks and national guard going around taking measurements in the streams and air are not wear hazmats or respirators. If they were, and telling us all don't worry, yeah right.
Again, that doesn't mean there wasn't a bad actor. I respect everything said by those close to the scene. It's valuable input. But you have to think it's possible that there was some ill intent, not just negligence right? Not just possible but highly likely??
Wrong. Do you understand what a hotbox is?
It is where the bearings are housed. They very often catch fire per the NS employee. Protocol is keep the trains moving. This happens almost daily he said. You can't sabotage this unless they do it daily.
The fire started 30 miles away and they were told to keep moving don't stop.
Why would I know this stuff? I am a damn woman.
Interesting how you ignored the part where I suggested that the actual track may have been sabotaged. ANTIFA has been known to do this Source 1 Source 2 Source 3.
Look, I understand being blinded with anger about the situation, but the militant way you keep insisting that we stick to the official narrative and don't question if sabotage was involved comes off as a suspicious.
I am angered because his son's family is in fear. They are being told to baseline their health.
He is based and reads this site. He is a first hand witness leading the charge to hold NS accountable. I can only tell you between him and the employee the one and only cause was the hotbox caught fire over 30 miles away and called it in. He was told keep moving.
I didn't ignore it. There was NOTHING wrong with the track.
Respectfully, you don't know that, I don't know that, and we, the public, don't know that. Hell, even the railroad employee might not know that (he be might just as in the dark as the rest of us about the track condition). We also don't know if the bearings you mentioned were intentionally sabotaged. We only know the official narrative and what you, random internet stranger, claim some railroad employee told your son. Frankly, after the last several years, there isn't a whole lot of reason to trust any of those things and with very good reason. I see zero reason to go, "Oh okay, well I guess we should dismiss the idea that the train was intentionally sabotaged over farmland and totally go with this random stranger's explanation that the bearings just happened to break in an extremely inconvenient place." That's just not happening, and if your son is indeed "based and reads this site," then he'll understand this position.
I understand completely. But isn't it official that some sort of 'detonation' was used by police? And do you think the culprit could have been a 'random stooge' placed there by the DS?
More proof the police are the enemy of liberty.
He said and was told the railroad placed shape charges under those cars. They dug trenches on either side put lit flares in the trenches then blew a small hole in the bottom of each tanker. This allowed the contents to ignite immediately.
All right, then. Here's more to consider. The explosions were only shaped charges to puncture the tanks to allow the drainage of the vinyl chloride. They took measures to trap the liquid and set it afire. The combustion products of vinly chloride are phosgene and hydrogen chloride. Phosgene is a poison gas and hydrogen chloride, when inhaled, will form hydrochloric acid in the lungs. Now, as bad as this sounds...it was not as bad as allowing the vinyl chloride to be released by itself. Think about that. Sometimes, the only choice available is between terrible bad and not-as-terrible bad. What would you do differently? What COULD you do differently?
I am not too impressed with the problems of "convincing" ignorant "anons" of the correctness of facts. I don't think anything I have said is "conjecture." The facts of the case have been disclosed. The facts of chemistry are available with a little search in Wikipedia. If the tanks were in prospect of failing from the derailment damage, it sounds like letting the vinyl chloride simply leak out and dissipate was a non-starter.
And there have been worse industrial accidents (e.g., Bhopal, India), so get a sense of perspective. It's not good. It could have been handled better. It sounds like the responsible parties are trying to cover it over. But there are no obvious alternatives to what they thought they needed to do for the sake of reducing risk.
Let me ask his son if something was detonated. I don't believe that to be true. Remember the original story a car hit the train? I knew immediately that wasn't true he told us yet everyone here was saying it.
I can explain the picture. Look at a train axle that sticks out through the wheel. You see the bolts and the axle sticking out.
The wheel when it was removed, the picture I saw, the entire axle that comes out was a rounded off nub. It caught fire over 30 miles out from here.
I would post the picture but the evil government lurkers could see it and wonder how the hell we got it. This puts the NS employee in danger.
I have nothing to gain by lying.
The uncured, liquid form is just called vinyl Chloride. Do you think this is why they are downing weather balloons disguised as UFOs/chinese spy balloons so no one detects whats going on in the public??
"What's going on..."? Fren, all kinds of industrial chemicals, most of which are toxic, are transported by rail on a daily basis. Safely. How else would we get them from place to place? This is what DoT safety placards are for, to make sure that commodities are treated in accordance with their safety procedures. This has been going on since the development of the chemical industry, almost two centuries ago.
Can the gas cloud disperse to larger areas such as New England, and if so how concentrated/lethal can it be? Can it induce symptoms such as headache, etc? Anyone have a migraine come out of no where last few hours?
Yes these toxins will be taken with the wind and where the wind is blowing. It also depends on the concentration (ppm) which determines lethality/danger level. I wont necessarily know that and the government will most likely wont tell us. A few things that I would do is collect rain and air samples. Checking weather constantly to see where winds are blowing at the spot of disaster. Invest in clean water filtration