Well said!
And totally right.
If you are scrapping to survive but not actually surviving why bother?
I think this is why my daughter is similar to the original post. Not as old yet but the writings on the wall.
I question if her seeing both parents bust ass, and I mean bust ass while they were young and still struggle has made her think "why bother?"
This is exactly why i checked out of relationships. I never saw a happy couple in my childhood. Every hated their partner in my family and friend group and i never wanted to get with someone to just fake happiness and be miserable.
Yeap. I have a friend who has a 17 year old daughter. High anxiety about life.
She told her mum the reason she's stressing over exams / high grades is wanting to be a psychiatrist JUST to be able not to worry about putting food on the table. It's devastating
There is no option for balance, two spouses working full time plus is what is needed just to get the downpayment together for an entry level, very modest home.
Yep, no one does it voluntarily, there's no way to pay for a house, never mind a car and food, unless both spouses work a full time crushing job. And the boomers just sit there with their piles of money from artificially inflated house prices, going "have you tried working harder, you lazy millennials?"
Most men cannot afford to provide a home to a woman. When my grandfather got married he was a draftsman working in a project office on a big construction project. He was able to afford a ring, a wedding and to buy a home for about 2.1X his income. It was a nice semi detached house in a cul-de-sac with 3 bedrooms and a driveway. He and my grandma lived there for 50 years. This was in 1955 - there was still the last auspices of war time rationing in my country that year. I believe Bananas and certain tropical fruits and nuts were very hard to come by.
I live in a 2Mx5M tool shed I rent from a crooked Indian guy for cash. I had to do some work on it to make it habitable. Its cheaper than a room in a house share and nicer than living in my car. I drive a 17 year old car I just had to put a used engine in because the original blew up and I would be screwed if I didn't do all my own work and a good scrapyard to help me out.
I couldn't even afford a ring even if I did have a woman let alone any of the other stuff. I'm just on my own waiting until the globalists finally decide to kill us all or the race war comes.
What is insane to me is that I manage, I even manage to save something some months and I haven't gone hungry or cold. I have no idea how the normies are surviving except by loading up their credit cards.
God is protecting you, apparently. I work full-time, and my wife part-time. We rent, and probably will until the aftermath of the financial collapse settles. We get by, and even thrive a bit. We're autistic about managing our credit scores and never taking on more debt than we can handle. I look at yearly, quarterly, and monthly expenses + overhead and plan out accordingly. Thankfully, we can access really low interest debt and use it as a buffer to maintain our expenses while not suffering for want. It's like juggling a Jenga tower. But we manage.
You know what tended to motivate me? It was reading stories about people that overcame tremendous odds to survive, to make it despite their difficulties.
Every time I felt like quitting, I would think of those that survived the USS Indianapolis sinking or those who were forced to built the Trans Siberian Railroad, or of Shackleton's men trapped on the frozen island who never gave up.
Even the fantasy tales of my youth motivated me, like:
John Henry said to his captain, a man ain't nothing but a man, but before I let that steam drill beat me down, oh, I'll die with this hammer in my hand.
Growing up, when ever I expressed a difficulty, my father would always say, "But you can handle it can't you", and the answer would always be yup.
I memorized things like Tennyson's Ulysses, when I was young, and Act 3 Scene I of Shakespeare's Julius Caesar.
Tennyson's Ulysses:
Come, my friends,
'Tis not too late to seek a newer world.
Push off, and sitting well in order smite
The sounding furrows; for my purpose holds
To sail beyond the sunset, and the baths
Of all the western stars, until I die.
It may be that the gulfs will wash us down;
It may be we shall touch the Happy Isles,
And see the great Achilles, whom we knew.
Though much is taken, much abides; and though
We are not now that strength which in old days
Moved earth and heaven, that which we are, we are,
One equal temper of heroic hearts,
Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.
Let them live there, but they must really help in the home. Laundry, meal planinng, cooking, yard work, put in a garden. There is a great deal they both could do that contributes to the wellbeing of the household. This is up their wheelhouse, learning productive stuff. Can your son do an oil change? Your daughter likes to crochet, she could do family mending. Expand your thinking. Sounds like your daughter wants to be a traditional wife. But she needs the skills to go with it. If they can’t work at home make them volunteer for like the local gleaners organization or another non-profit. Your house, your rules. As for you, red pill them everyday. Teach them to be patriots. Are you a person of faith? Start teaching them what will trully give them the confidence in life.
You wanna know how many parents would KILL for this opportunity you have right now?
First, tell any thoughts or neighbors or "friends" trying to whisper shame into your ear for letting your kids live at home to piss right off. Traditionally, children never left home. Traditionally, whether nomadic or stagnant, families stick together. Our bullshit modern society taught us to kick our offspring out as soon as they reach a certain number. Why? So that they can go buy more shit that they don't actually need and become bogged down and miserable like your daughter claimed.
But now... your daughter is at home and has a lot of home making skills. Cultivate that! Have her consider selling some of her hand crafts. As for your son, keep cultivating his skills, but you and Yours should see this as an opportunity to BOLSTER your household and you all need to stick together as a family to survive the system.
My wife and I live with her dad. We also work part time. We also make time to spend with family and help contribute to the household. Everyone is happy and our spirits are elevated and everyone gets along just fine. Will my wife and I get out own house? Why do we have to? We have room and board provided. If we have kids, we'll find a way to make it work.
The point is, the whole buying a house and having kids = success is really just one person's idea for success. We aren't all required to agree with that. You still have healthy relationships with your children. We get one shot at this life. Even if you believe in the concept of eternity, how you experience this life is one and done. Make memories with your kids especially since they ended up coming back. Your children seem like decent people and they don't hate you. Congratulations, you won parenthood. Now it's time to be more of a mentor.
The hard part is that you must lead by example. Your sincerity and dedication to faith must be authentic. Young people have a way of seeing through things. You should start going yourself. Sharing your experience in deepening your faith.
The first job out of college sucks. It's a slap in the face to everything you learned in college basically and the living style you had. Entering large POs for 8 hours a day at a small company certainly was NOT what I expected. Needless to say, I found the "real world" extremely slow and that job didn't last long. It wasn't until I applied for a job a couple weeks later I thought I wouldn't even have a chance of getting, and that's when Accounting found me. Hey, those POs at my last place actually did something afterall. They need to be searching for Jobs. No ifs ands or buts. Get a LinkedIn account. There are so many recruiters on there. Apply apply apply. Not every company is the same. Tell your son to walk into the local music shop and ask for an application in person. It's about finding a job that they want to strive in that will benefit them to the next step. Life is not easy, it never was, nor will it ever be. That's what vacations are for and I recommend you take one if you can. It's about working towards something knowing it's helping others for your benefit as well. That is what "work" really is. It's not about "being a slave". That is the worst mentality you can have. It's about the natural life of living and what it means to be apart of making others lives better in some way. Attitude goes a long way. Once they find the right job, their lives will start to shape up. Don't let them be lazy about it.
Yeah ha, well what I meant is that most college schedules are 2-3 classes a day where you can sleep in and have time in-between to go back to your dorm/apartment and chill with friends and study or whatever. These classes teach theory and upper level management concepts you won't use in a entry level job. Only to graduate and go into work for 8 hours a day with little breaks, no friends, your asking yourself why you went to college to do basic work like entering in POs all day. On top of that, the salary expectations are way off, most kids think they'll make 80k after graduation but really start off at 40k and can barely get by. This can be tough on the psyche and does take about 2 years to transition or "get broken in" to the real world schedule of work. I know exactly how it feels.
I left college before I graduated and my brother encouraged me to go to Kelly Services (I bet they don't exist anymore. It was a temp agency.) - but any good local temp agency will do - and the good thing about temp jobs is that some of them are temp-to-hire so they can try you and you can try them before they hire you. Some temp jobs are short, some are longer, some are permanent. It might be a good thing for both your children to try different things AND since it's temp work, they can literally walk away from it if they hate it. No stress or pressure to stay.
Necessity is the mother of invention. They're only going to talk about gardening and occasionally pay for shit if you allow this behavior. Act like a head of your house... you are in charge correct?
Cook only enough for you and your wife, give them the gas/electric bill and ask them what they think is a fair portion to pay. Hand her some seeds and shovel and tell her to contribute instead of talk about it.
My best friend and I would still be living together to this day if he hadn't fallen in love. In 6 years I can count on one hand how many times he did the dishes... I swear he was allergic to doing dishes but I always had my laundry folded and on my bed whenever I'd forget and I can't count on my fingers and toes how many times he loaned me money.
You ain't gotta be perfect but you do have to give more than you receive to make the world better. They'll just keep taking instead of giving. Even at the most elemental biological growth only happens... I don't want to lift weights but my muscles grow when they're uncomfortable and ripped to shreds by me. That doesn't mean I hate my body for making it uncomfortable and testing it's capabilities it actually means I care more.
Do you want a fat gut on your lazy children? Do you want them dumb and lazy? Beat them at chess, grow a better garden and keep track of who lost at penny poker. Remind them you produced more lettuce, remind them you're eating crab and steak because you earned something by making yourself uncomfortable and they can go grill up a chicken after they pluck it... hand them the chicken and knife.
Make them uncomfortable or they're never going to grow... the art of being a parent is doing so in such a style that they can't deny you love them.
I see what you mean by this, but I disagree. Yes, being a stay-at-home mom means putting your children's needs first. This may sound like a "bad" thing because you won't have time to draw butterflies, take long baths, watch youtube videos all day, etc. Instead your days are filled with meaning and higher purpose. I am a stay-at-home mom of 3. I homeschool them and take them to all their extra-curriculars (dance, soccer, piano, etc.). I rarely have time for myself, but I have never been happier in my life. Funny how that is. I feel like many childless women are depressed because they lack a higher purpose. And what's the point in even trying in life if you lack any purpose?
Perhaps I used the wrong words. In saying, "You life is not your own", I was merely saying that a stay at home mother is not free to kick up her heels and do as she likes. It may be though that the things which she likes, are the things that center around the well being of her husband, and of the family, , as was the case with my mom.
I'm sure I cannot paint with words a true picture of my mother, but I will do my best.
My mother was very happy, all of her life, but more than happy, as she put it, she was content, always content. I think in her mind, being in a state of discontent put her in conflict with her faith in Jesus Christ. Sure one could fall into a state of discontent, but remaining in that state very long, was a sign of lack of faith in the promises of God obtained through knowing the word, and through prayer.
"If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you." John 15:7
She viewed "happiness" as a condition of circumstances, but true contentment as something that was independent of ones circumstances, and she lived a life that proved out her unshakable faith. I never saw it waver, not one time, not for one second, even in the most trying times, and I learned of many times when faith was the only thing that sustained her and my dad, the family though some tough times. My grandmother was the same kind of woman. Stories were told around the dinner table, so to speak, of my grandmother's faith, and my mothers.
Regrettably, it was me, more than once, that put my mother in desperate conditions where her faith was tested, and under which her faith was proven for all to see.
Example: I was in a head on collision. Doctors did not expect me to live. Yet when my mother arrived at the hospital, all were amazed at her calm and composed demeanor, her since of assurance that I would live, that all would be well.
Obviously I did live, and despite my hip being broken in 10 places, my knees cut up, and a serious concussion, after a month long hospital stay, in four months I was jump starting from a pair of crutches, off the river bank with a waters ski.
During my month long hospital stay, I had many visitors. I heard some of them speak in amazement of how my mother throughout the entire ordeal seemed never in a state of worry. Latter during my recovery, and after hearing other speak of this, I spoke to my mom about it.
After my accident, the police called my dad. My dad drove home and told my mother. My mom said when she got the news, she fell apart, the thought of her baby, I was the youngest of five, critically injured, at deaths door was more than she could handle. She told me that she prayed, told God, "Lord, this is more than I can handle, I am turning this over to you. Your will be done." And at that point she says that that piece beyond understanding described in Philippians 4:7, came over her. The tempest upon which she had been tossed becalmed as though Jesus commanded the raging storm within her, "Piece, be still".
This is only one of the examples where my mothers faith was by trial, weighed in the balance, and proved the measure of it's worth.
This is why my mom was able to find contentment in all situations, because she understood that no matter what the circumstances, when she did all she could do, the rest was in Gods hands.
No reason your two ADULT children can't at least work part time and contribute to the financial burden nor should they have a free pass in the house. All fine and dandy to decide adulting is too much, but that just dumps extra adulting on you and your spouse, which is not right. And yes, I have two adult children - 33 and 24
In fact, the boomers have been sponging off of the generations to come, for decades. Unrepayable deficits? Mass immigration to keep the house prices going up up up? Nation-bankrupting pensions? All retired boomers owe everything they have to the as-yet unperformed labour of their grandkids. And yet, when one asks them to share the wealth....
That's a brilliant viewpoint. We all rode the merry-go-round, naively thinking it would last forever. I knew 40 years ago that something wasn't right. I swore to myself and others that I wasn't getting on the ride, but I fell for the bait and spent the next 25 years hypnotically participating. I was lucky to have had the opportunity to jump off when the merry-go-round slowed down in 2008 and I have been deprogramming myself ever since.
I have sympathy for anyone that is beginning to see through the veil. I'm starting to see homeless people as the smart ones.
I don’t blame you or any other boomer for doing what they do. I appreciate your self reflection. The problem is that the boomers had as much control over their government as we do ours unfortunately that is none. The United States has always been an oligarchy as far back as 1913? 1872?
Boomers haven't been sponging off the generations to come. Boomers have paid their dues. Many were killed off from the clot shots. Many younger people are on SS and Medicare/Medicaid because they cannot function for any reason. Kick off illegals who get welfare etc. There is plenty of money to take care of Americans.
Boomers lived it up on deficits they expected someone else to pay. Their pensions are bankrupting the nation. Many more retired on the gains their houses made under mass immigration, but the effect of this was future generations have to pay 40x as much for a house when starting out. Every one of boomers’ gains has been at the expense of future generations.
The math shows otherwise- if their pension funds and social security funds had not been plundered, if the petro/fiat dollar hadn't been artificially devalued, they would have plenty of their own money to live off of.
The pensions and social security funds were plundered by boomer retirees expecting to live it up for 20+ years without having to work. The generation that came before never had such a thing, no one did. Living within their means is boomer kryptonite.
The devaluation of the dollar was caused by money printing, which was demanded by boomers and their incessant need to spend more than they have.
I don't know how it works in other countries but I paid into the UK government pension scheme for 43 years and into my own private pension fund for at least twenty years. That money was invested (I had no say in it) and, assuming that it was invested wisely, should pay me minimum wage until I'm 100. In other words, the government and the private pension company are paying me back the capital that I lent them plus interest, which obviously should be less than the profits they made by investing my money. If they invested unwisely, and/or allowed someone to steal part of my capital, that's not my fault.
Yikes!
The greatest generation who gave boomers life, taught them to worship God, honest work for honest pay, save for a rainy day, reduce, recycle and reuse things, if you can't buy it in cash, you can't buy it and many more gems. My siblings and I are boomers and none have/are mooching off the system. We have worked very hard all our lives, saving until we could afford items, or down payment for items and now is the time to retire. Now people believe they should have everything they want immediately without saving or working for it. Nor, do they even know what a need is vs a want.
Perhaps there are a few boomers that are taking advantage of the system, but I have not come across one yet. There are many people who are not boomers who are on social security and medicare/medicaid who are screwing the system.
Then, throw the illegals into the medicare/medicaid, social security mix.
Rewind, pedes- the government institutions of daycare and indoctrination did their jobs and brainwashed generations of kids successfully to look to the government and big business for all the answers. We're simply in the dying phase of all that. Those families who stuck to God or returned to God have no problem finding motivation to be productive. There are some self-starters who do it on their own as well. But the drive to make a life for oneself starts optimally with the parents. Not too late to find Christ and start taking on missions for the family or church.
Cities are still poison though. You can't live, grow, breathe; you're surrounded by rats and filth on many levels. If they're not going to work for money, get out someplace where they can grow and raise their food; it's the only logical solution to needing to eat.
Corporate America can do that to a youngster. Especially in I.T. and the coding industry with stiff competition from India etc. The landscape of corporate culture is not the same from 15 years ago. It is much worse in my opinion.
Also, I’m thinking tictok, youtube, etc are more dangerous than we currently even know or realize. I think the ‘enemy’ has had some of the most devious psychologists developing it as a weapon for decades. Some are more susceptible than others but there is no ignoring the dopamine hits with video games etc.
My only suggestion would be to somehow limit the internet usage or ween it down while replacing it with something healthier. No small task, i know, but a thought. Easy to say, but try to find a club, hobby, new interest for them and act on it regularly. If it is possible that you can be involved, maybe all the better depending on the situation.
If your daughter has any interest in working for herself somehow or a ‘remote’ type position, there are more resources than ever due to the double edged sword of the internet. Freelance or consulting work may be a better fit.
Maybe your kids would have to ‘earn’ their internet free time with other productive time. This will not be easy to formulate or work-thru. Prepare for a battle royale, and things might get worse b4 better. I realize they aren’t young teens so this is tough.
Figure out how to spark or encourage healthy time and interests. Do some very off-the-wall brainstorming of ideas that are waaay out of the normal for each of you.
Try looking into Andy Frisella 75-hard - book and program (free program). It isn’t for everyone that is for sure.
Actually it should be said that the IT sector has changed a lot in the last decade or so since all the Indian outsourcing came in. Not just in the US but the same thing has happened in a lot of countries. The culture became a lot more toxic and the back stabbing and the nepotism went off the scale because many of these Indian workers they have shipped in are incompetent and cover it up by causing extreme disruption in the work environment.
My mother lost her last job to outsourcing and the last few years of it were utter hell as the Indians came in, made a dogs dinner of everything and then proceeded to blame every one else but themselves so work became mostly about arse covering and deflecting unfounded allegations.
The only thing that makes India competitive is the price of developers. As for the code, it is utter garbage. I waste hours sifting through bad code in offshore PRs. Then I spend more hours explaining why security checks should never be relied on, solely in Javascript, which they try to excuse and bs their way out of fixing, resulting in me recording videos of myself hacking up the DOM and JS in less than 5 seconds, bypassing their "security".
Agreed......and your scenario is happening in many industries (tech, engineering, healthcare, military...etc) with many foreign countries. With the current ‘outsourcing’ trend, the importance of any corporate patriotism has all but vanished, mostly due to a short sighted view of the bottom line.
I didn’t mean to imply the current ‘foreign’ competition (and outsourcing) was fair, healthy, or good. Just that it has made a mess of things for a newb getting into the industry as was the case with the original post / story.
Ok boomer? Really? Do you have kids? Are you old enough? Just wondering.
It is a fact that video game designers design for dopamine hits in order to create an addictive reaction cycle / scenario.
Not sure I understand your 2nd paragraph. Did something i wrote indicate I am not for free speech? Odd - not my intent. I’m very pro 1st amendment. Not crazy about porn books in grade school being pushed on kids considered as free speech though - you?.
My point is that it is tough to raise kids when they are literally addicted to video games and phone apps. Not everyone who uses is an addict but some can certainly succumb to an unhealthy point just like anything that is designed to be addictive - drugs, sugar, pop-music, gambling, pick your poison..
I am kind of like your daughter- went to college, was excited to get a job at a big company and work my way up. I’ve worked at a huge global a bank for 11 years now, and I’ve worked my way up the ladder. All that time, I was so motivated to get the next pay raise or next better position. Once you do that for awhile, you really do see how you’re just a cog in a machine that is constantly demanding more of you than you can reasonably give. Every month, the goals and expectations get higher and higher. Boss says “wow, you did amazing this month! You completed 100 accounts, so next month I want you to complete 110.” They do this every single month, you have to push yourself harder and harder all the time. At some point, you say to yourself “why am I doing all this.” I started getting more panic attacks and feeling generally fearful of the insane goals. I empathize for sure. She will have to accept that is how the corporate world works and to find ways to live and make it bearable or leave big business altogether and do something else. I took a lower position in the company that is “easier” and less stressful to make it work and so that I can enjoy my life outside of work
I can't imagine being a young person just starting off in the world. Rent is outrageous, the prices of a car, even used, is through the roof. Groceries and goods are nuts. If you do the math for the average starting salary vs bills, it just does not compute. I held onto my first home that will be paid off in 5 years. I'm holding onto it for my boys to have an affordable place to live if they stay in the area. Right now a 3 bedroom house in my old neighborhood is renting out for $2,400.00 a month. That is insane to me.
You're right. When I got married at 29 yrs old, I was only provider, and yet we bought a house, had two cars, a child, did not want for middle class comforts, could save a little, and had some play money left over at the end of the month.
I was not what you would consider a high earner, but if you consider 55k income in 1985 had the same purchasing power as 157K today, that explains it.
I can't imagine a young person making it today in the same fashion.
they sound like patriots to me actually, who do not fit in with this modern failed society. at the same time though, patriots do not take hand-outs or freebies, we must be productive.
its hard to find good work in this particular time because of all the corruption, the forced mandates & peer pressure, but there are a few jobs that sort of "side-steps" all of that. for me, it was:
(1) auto detail, either the lot provides you an outside shop or you work privately
(2) door dash/uber, great for winter time, as most of the time spent on the job is in my car with the heat on
(3) yardwork/mowing/contract, warm weather job, similar to food delivery in that i get my job, show up with me or a couple fellow workers & just work. nobody checking in, breathing down your neck, etc.
these jobs can bring in decent money & if your children are living at home, for a time the bills could be shared or split between you all & money could be saved up for everyone involved.
there are also great benefits to helping other people who need you, rather than focusing so much on our own wealth or current state, which is why i would also recommend some type of job, even if its volunteering, where they help take care of others in need. you get so much out of helping others, it makes you feel good & if its volunteer work, they may get offered jobs along the way. who knows who you could meet & opportunities you could have by meeting people out in the world.
just remember, the Lord God PROVIDES for His people. You & your children sound like people I would like to know, ya'll aren't "drones" & we need more of that in society. We all just need a little "push" every now & then.
Your daughter is unfortunately the product of a society that forces women to be second rate men slaving away in a workplace. Women were designed to be wives and mothers; they naturally find this role fulfilling. Modern society continually lies to them that there’s something bigger and better, but leaves them empty and unsatisfied as you have seen first hand.
The exact same thing is happening with your son and the fulfilling role of being a husband and father, the satisfaction of responsibility.
See if you can get both of your children to watch Dr Jordan Peterson. Not as good as the Bible, but Peterson can provide the gateway to deeper appreciation of God’s divine wisdom.
I second this! Also have her watch/listen to Stefan Molyneux. When I was an aimless young woman, watching his podcasts awakened me to the lies of feminism. I am in my 30's now. I'm married with children and I stay-at-home to homeschool them. I have found a higher purpose and I couldn't be happier. Sounds like the daughter is lacking real meaning to her life and that's something I used to struggle with too.
If it were my kids I would:
1 start by making them pay affordable but not cheap rent. They then at least have to get some job or find somewhere where they will pay even more rent
2 get them out of any counselors or into an actual good psychologist who doesn’t do bullshit and give them the mental health outs.
3 show them that it’s completely possible to live a successful life without high stress. Money isn’t worth everything. Smaller house, cheaper area if you are in an expensive big city, smaller expenses, a job that is part remote, etc.
4 make them serve others. Happiness comes from within and serving people is one of the best ways to spark that. Hey Jenny if you want to stay rent free you need to volunteer at the soup kitchen 1 hour a day and see what it’s like to really struggle. Something like that.
I’m in Alabama and you can still have a good job and live a great life without insane taxes or commutes.
Also one of my favorite life lessons is CHOOSE YOUR HARD. It’s hard to be poor it’s hard to be rich - I’d rather have problems with money than without.
It’s hard to be married it’s hard to be single but at least married you have company and share your struggles. But to each their own.
Ehhh, your looking at this wrong. They've actually found the answer: disconnect. Society and societal success is a soul sucking pursuit that leads to early death and misery.
That dosen't mean they don't need to earn their keep. Let them do what they want, but don't let them take advantage of you or your good graces. Charge them rent. They should be buying their own food, etc. If you don't want them living with you, perhaps they can move out and get a place together.
You're making it too comfortable for them, and that's causing more harm than good. People just go from womb to womb. It's part of our nature.
There's no way to save them. What they want is the lifestyle you boomers enjoyed. They want a house that costs 5 years of one spouse's salary. They want one spouse staying home to keep house and raise the kids. They want a car or two, a vacation or two a year, and a chance at actually retiring.
The best they can hope for is a house that costs 30 years of two spouses' salary. Neither spouse may stay home, both must work a soul-crushing job 40+ hours a week, and so the housework falls by the wayside. A car these days costs as much as a house did when you were young. All jobs today basically expect that you work through your vacation even if you're legally entitled to it. Aside from that, most jobs also expect that you work when you're not working by answering emails etc.
The solution might have been for your generation to live within their means, but they didn't. They racked up unrepayable deficits for decades, invited the entire third world to come here so the pensions don't collapse. Mass immigration also hyperinflated the cost of housing (which boomers have been riding high on) while suppressing the price of labour (making it impossible for subsequent generations to save enough to buy in).
If people from your generation found themselves in the hopeless dire straits today's youth are in, they'd opt out as well.
While that is partially true it is not exactly true in all of the western world. I do agree that younger generations have it tougher but since they have time on their side they can chase and live the dream at some point.
Millennials are a good example of being hit with multiple plandemics and still are rising in home ownership and they haven't even inherited if any of their homes from their parents or grand parents yet aka baby boomers.
Time solves a lot of problems but in the mean time what matters is that you stay focused in the short term.
Millennials are a good example of being hit with multiple plandemics and still are rising in home ownership and they haven't even inherited if any of their homes from their parents or grand parents yet aka baby boomers
"Home ownership" to a millennial means being saddled with a mortgage being worth 2 spouses' full time work for 30 years. It's an impossible-to-repay burden that demands 80+ hours each week of full time work.
"Home ownership" to a boomer meant a 5 year mortgage that one spouse working could pay off.
Millennials are also a generation that save more relative to their age bracket. And they have the aid of technology to be able to make money with side hustles that can be done all at home.
Boomer did have it easier but you are glossing over the fact that interest rates were much higher so you had to make money and put down more money on homes to make a purchase.
So the only real advantage boomers had back then was purchasing power IMO as wages kept up with the cost of housing They didn't have the advantage of technology like millennials do or information at their fingertips.
Millennials are also a generation that save more relative to their age bracket. And they have the aid of technology to be able to make money with side hustles that can be done all at home.
There's no choice. If you want a down payment for a house you have to save up as much money as your entire house cost you.
Boomer did have it easier but you are glossing over the fact that interest rates were much higher so you had to make money and put down more money on homes to make a purchase.
Lol I'll take high interest and house prices 1/50th of what they are now, over what we have today, any day. The fact is, ONE SPOUSE WORKING could pay it all off in your day, while today, TWO SPOUSES WORKING FULL TIME can't pay it all off.
So the only real advantage boomers had back then was purchasing power IMO as wages kept up with the cost of housing They didn't have the advantage of technology like millennials do or information at their fingertips.
I would gladly trade the internet for a functional homogenous high trust society.
I am an older millennial so I remember the 80s well aka pre internet 90s peak consumer age and I prefer this age because we have knowledge at our finger tips.
The 80s was great if you wanted a 12% CD though for example but it also was a period of uncertainty due to the cold war.
For the age of having a husband work and a wife to stay home which was the 1950s it requires a huge shift in society. Women were skilled in not only cooking, baking, sewing, but also plumbing and light electrical work. The men worked a job but they also had a responsibility to forgo escapism and put family first. Doing as many repairs of their home and car as possible. Saving and investing money wisely for the yearly family vacation. Consumerism wasn't a priority and you can see a glimpse of that life style in eastern Europe today.
I understand your frustration, but perhaps not wanting to slave away in a unforgiving and unrewarding system is the only logical move left to make? We are currently in a massive societal transition, and when things settle down the entire concept of 'work' and 'being productive' will fundamentally change in ways you may find difficult to predict.
Encourage your kids to start experimenting with AI and learning how to use it for their own personal projects or hobbies.
“AI is not going to replace humans, humans with AI will replace humans that don’t use AI.”
The guy in this video wearing the hat is Emad Mostaque (founder and CEO of Stability AI) and he strongly believes that the initial productivity gains from AI seen this last year will quickly turn into a catastrophic period of mass layoffs within 1-2 years.
You will find that UBI or a similar system of monthly income will likely roll out around this same time to allow people to adjust. AI will not shrink the job market in many industries, it will completely remove them. Almost any job that requires a computer. Programming will no longer be a profession, along will law, accounting, teaching, etc.
The biggest problem to prepare for will be those unable to adjust. People that define themselves with their job or profession are going to be in serious psychological trouble/depressed. There will be new ways to interact with people and cultivate meaning and purpose in life.
I’m watching this right now and it’s hitting me for the first time how…massively…AI is entering and changing our reality. It’s something I’ve paid very little attention to up until now. Fascinating. Completely scrambles and obliterates my predictions (pure speculation of course) of the future. As those two blokes discussed, it WILL either free and unlock humanity, or create an unspeakable nightmare Slave world. Thankful I’m an optimist right now. I feel like I better get to familiarizing myself with it. Where do I even begin?
Welcome to the 2020s. I’m studying for a degree in the healthcare industry which I started before the pandemic hit, but after seeing the atrocities many healthcare professionals committed during Covid, including mandating the defective mRNA vaccines and then gaslighting people who got negatively impacted by this rushed and under tested technology, I’m starting to lose faith in something that I used to have some passion about. I’m now wondering if I should even pursue a career in healthcare even if I do manage to graduate. Is all that money worth it in exchange for the sacrifice of my mental health and moral values?
R3: quarter life crisis- I do remember that time and it is hard. Part of the problem is she is not too far out of school which offers a lot of structure and there are paths and goals that are more or less defined but upon leaving school, it is not as clear.
Also, for many women, the skills for which they are rewarded for in school - straight As, being "a good girl" - are not necessarily the ones that lead to success in the work world. That is a big lesson, especially for the high achievers.
Even the question is wrong: people are not missing this magical "motivation" pixie dust. In fact, you yourself pointed out that your daughter was "motivated" and now she is not. Did her bottle of magic pixie dust run out?
No. You are just describing their behavior, not some magical "motivation" stuff that they do not have. Really what you see is that they are not moving towards a goal and a life where they can take care of themselves. You describe that as not having "motivation", but that is just one metal model of many you could use to think about the situation, and likely not the most helpful one.
People act "motivated" when they have a vision of something they want that calls to them. Everyone has something that calls to them. For your daughter it was coding, but now it is wearing dresses. For your son it is listening to the prayers of trees.
A problem is a difference between (1) the way the world is and (2) what a human wants. There are no problems out there in the world; problems only arise when a human starts wanting things.
You have a desire for your children to be other than the way they are. That is all you. They own their lives, not you. It is actually an act of aggression to pretend that you own their lives and that therefore you have the right to be disappointed in them. They own their lives, not you. Your kids do not have a problem; you do.
My mom told me and my brother she would love us no matter what, even if we were garbage collectors. (I happen to have a lot of respect for garbage collectors, but that is what she said.) My brother and I have worked our whole lives to do difficult things. No one had to "motivate" us.
From the outside I look like the most motivated person in the world: I work flat out all of the time on my startup which is quite technically challenging and I am at risk of being homeless at any time due to lack of funding. I have been doing this for almost 2 decades.
Other people see me doing this and help me for no pay, such as my very expensive lawyer to whom I pay nothing. I have an entire team of advisors most of whom have a Ph.D. from Berkeley and to whom I pay nothing. In fact they pay me: one of the people who funds me was one of the people at Berkeley who got the internet to work.
That's what being called towards a vision looks like from the outside: "that guy is so motivated I'm going to work for him for free and give him money". But to me, from the inside, it is just that I have a vision that calls to me and that I going toward no matter the circumstances.
You could try just asking your kids what calls to them. What is your daughter making right now? Could you help her crochet it? Have you tried going into the forest with your son and listening to the prayers of trees? I lived in a Zen practice place for 10 weeks once and it was one of the best things I ever did. Listening to trees can be great.
You could also point out how much it costs you to have them living with you and ask if they could contribute to the expense. Like write it down exactly in a spreadsheet so you know exactly how much it is. How much would they have to contribute before you would be ok with them just living there indefinitely?
In ancient times, that's just how people lived, communally, working together. Many people miss that very much (as your daughter said). You have two children and many, such as myself, do not. You could try just being grateful for that.
Are you grateful that they are alive? Have you tried telling them that? What if one of them killed themselves? Would you be sad? You could try telling them that. I have intervened in two suicide attempts and witnessed a third, all of people I knew personally. Have not lost anyone yet, but once you have been through that, you might complain less about people who you love.
My dad was a doctor and once substituted for a doctor on vacation who was local county medical examiner. My dad thought it would be good for my education if I went with him to pick up the (unprepared) dead bodies. I will never forget the first one, a rich guy, laying on the table while his butler puttered around nervously, not knowing what to do now that master was dead, while my dad filled out the death certificate. It took him a while.
I remember seeing blotches of purple and green on his very white face and thinking "wow, dead people are purple and green". I remember how he smelled, very, very sweet, cloyingly sweet. When I got to high school, I was the only student who know what Shakespeare meant by "the sweet smell of death".
Please stop complaining that your children are not what you wanted. If you have to, imagine that you just had to go to the morgue to identify one of their bodies, and now you are alone in your house forever without them. How do you feel? Maybe try telling your kids that feeling. If tears come to your eyes, let them.
Congratulations. Your kids are intelligent enough to quickly learn the ‘real world’ is a total scam. I’ve been in a state of severe burnout for more than 10 years but just keep plugging along because I have no choice or fallback.
Cryptocurrency and trying to breathe life into a career switch to sales is my hope.
Otherwise the present and past 10+ years have been totally worthless.
All of my friends are in the same position. Drug down by work, mentally drained.
Anyone having a good time in these years are simple minded dog loving sports watching NPC’s.
This world is not meant for me. But I’m already here so I’m trying to obtain some shred of the world I want.
But primarily my desperation is for any of my friends and my mom to have the free time to be happy and do things together on a regular basis like life was in the 90s.
It sounds like your daughter had a mini breakdown. Your son is doing some soul-searching. Bless you for your heart and the service you are giving to them right now. All is well. They will both be fine and find their way. Sometimes it takes longer than we think it should. Be patient and understand that there is a reason for everything. You don't really know if this is good or bad. In the end, like many of the moments and situations I have lived through I end up seeing God's hand in it all. Blessings and love to you and your family.
It is very difficult to motivate people. If they lack the spark to live, no one else can give it to them. Your daughter is probably depressed and anxious due to malnutrition. Your son has amotivational syndrome due to his pot smoking. Those two should get their own apartment and leave your home.
Your kids figured out how hard it is to work every day instead of sitting around doing what they are doing now.
If you dont kick them out you will be supporting them forever.
Its called tough love sit them down and talk to them give them a specific amount of time say 6 months to get jobs and their own place to live. You obviously need to explain to them that you worked your whole life and it is now their turn to work and support themselves. Let them know it is not your job to support them once they are adults. If you dont then you yourself will be missing out on your own life and money will be tight.
Definitely worth praying about. Rejecting the rat race is a good thing; doing nothing is a poor alternative.
Help them find their place. They've obviously both been burned by the system, and your guidance will be important. And time, even though it already seems like a lot. Sorry I don't have more specific advice, but I do empathize. Time will help. God bless.
"She said she felt used and unloved by her managers and coworkers, and hated coming home to an empty apartment every night."
You say a lot of interesting things in the paragraphs above. The one I found most interesting was the quote from your daughter I copied at the start of this, above. I don't know your family situation, but if you have a wife who is against you and not on the same page as you, your life can be difficult also. If you aren't married or if you are and your wife are on the same page, let the children (adults) know they have a specific amount of time to get their act together and make plans on getting a job and working, one you are going to start making them pay rent, two you are going to kick them out when the time limit is up and they are not working by that time. Otherwise they might be sponges all their lives. And your daughter shouldn't be seeking lover from her managers and coworkers, one or two might be love interests, but not all of them. She was hired to do a job, not to be adored by her managers or coworkers. A little harsh, but true.
Now, my wife wouldn't allow me to do this to with our children-that is why I stated you both need to be on the same page. But my kids, both boys have their own lives and are out of the house-we did let one of them live with us for a couple of years to save money for a house (no rent, per my wife and the stay went slightly over two years). Oh well, that was my
I am sorry to say this but almost everybody here is still brainwashed into thinking you must have work all the time. I am not saying YT or Tick Tock is a way to go (they should do something productive) but the thing you needed to do is say that everything is ok. If she left her job, ok then. She probably should have done that a long time ago if she wasn´t happy.
Maybe she needs a boy. Maybe she needs catch up in her personal life. I don´t know. But I personally had the best time in my life when I could just focus on my own projects (programmer here). Ask her about them. Or she could do something mentally easier part time to buy some food at least (eg. cashier, in warehouse). Forcing her to work (real job) because then she can afford mortgage for a maybe quarter of a house? Don´t you think it is just going to be even worse for her?
This is the transition time where things just sucks.
Here's a bit of a strategy: I have no idea if it works for you, but it worked for us, so might as well try:
your kids need a purpose.
The city and coding life is deadly. Your daughter (and son) both need to do something productive that yields result. Come spring they both should be tasked with growing food in the garden. Or if you have no garden make them each set up a green house and grow in it.
merit based household: your daughter has care products and takes long showers? Without a job? Who buys that? Your son has time to sit around and write songs? Who feeds him and leaves the heating on? If I was in your shoes, I'd turn off the water heater and turn it on only for my husband and myself. Your daughter can have a warm soft shower... After she's done something productive. Same for the son. There's wood to chop, there's basements to vacuum, there's old rickety stairs to fix... Whatever. The point is not to be mean, the point is to make them realize that they can fix stuff and achieve things, because that builds them up.
exercise and consistency. Have them learn skills that use hands, have them do things that are in their nature. Your daughter crochets? Well make her sell that stuff on etsy. Make her learn to knit, weave, and crochet 100 small octopus puppets to give out for Halloween. Your son likes to sing songs? Make him record you a Christmas Album for the entire family (after all, you gotta start somewhere. and make sure to expect him to be pitch perfect).
don't let them guilt you into being cuddly and nice. Expecting them to bring results is not a punishment, it's a gift.
I've seen my family wither from this modernity garbage, so I turned the backyard into garden, all of it. Every kid a patch and the one who grows the least gets no internet in the winter unless they make up for it with fixing the house. They're alive, determined, they up each other on skills and knowledge.. I felt bad for doing it but my kids now are happy. I hope you and your family find the strength to grow into the humans they're meant to be. Lots of good luck!
I never wanted children either - and I do feel alot like your son and daughter too minus the weird philosophical bushwa. My greatest achievement is definitely abstaining from procreating and bringing innocence into shitty ass clown world. I often wish my parents had been more careful - this grind isn't exciting at all.
OP, some tough love advice - our daughter and her wife moved on when their landlord decided to sell the house they were renting. They had worked steadily. We offered to let them move into house until another rental/sale became available. MISTAKE - all of a sudden, their work ethic was nowhere to be found. My husband and I put up with it for several months and we finally said, "We love y'all but we're hurting you by allowing you to live this way." They moved out. Miracle (sarcasm) w/in a week they both scored great jobs at a casino. If we had not put our feet down, they'd still be here allowing us to cook and clean for them.
I'm going to offer a different take than others here.
One, I don't think you should consider the two of them to have entirely the same problems. Getting high is probably your son's largest problem. While some people can function through that, a lot of people cannot. If he's not sober, you're probably not making any progress. And it is certainly not a trait that builds a strong man. Beyond that, he sounds like a young man seeking purpose. Which is the one thing your children seem to have in common.
Your daughter sounds like she bought into the lie that living life like a man can be fulfilling for a woman. For the most part, that's not true. And now she's trying to find a foundation to build up a radically different worldview. But is getting ideas from social media, which is basically condensed insanity. This may sound really sexist and misogynistic, but more than anything it sounds like she just needs a good man to be her foundation. She was smart enough to figure out that the life she was sold sucks, but doesn't seem to understand the next step and is searching. And probably not even willing to entertain the old fashioned idea of a traditional relationship as a foundation.
I would support the searching and try to guide it in subtle ways, while drawing a hard line only on toxic behaviors (like substance abuse). They both lack a foundation, and are using you as that. Leverage it to help them build their own.
I read this out loud and my 21 and 23 year old sons thought I had made a post about them (my shaman and my pot smoking empath) and their 34 year old sister. She moved home after a failed relationship and she too needed kindness and a warm loving place to raise her son. She is a licensed RN, worked for the past 10 years in ERD, which wrung her empty.
I am BLESSED to have my children living with my spouse and I. They are the younger of 5. The older 2 are late 30s early 40s and both were able to become established before inflation made it impossible to exist on the slave wages provided in a career. All 3 work with regular income (pay their way in the Family system), but it is so much easier to enjoy life in a Shared space. Our household income combined now is upwards of 20K a month and so we can eat organic home cooked meals prepared with everyone participating. Lots of laughter, wine on the weekends, new patio, dart board and pool table, pool w/spa, playground, and our 2 year old grandson who is "part of the crew".
As with all things, this too shall pass, but these particles of light came through you as "system busters". From the moment they understood that the beast system was RIGGED against them, they had the audacity to say, "Nope, hard pass" and if you are what I believe you are, a Hue Man, a BEING of Divine Light, a bridger between the old dark world and the new Light world, you will rejoice because you get to enjoy the creation part. Very shortly here, LIGHT will be flowing and as they refused to be severed from it (they will not tolerate a subhuman existence) they will naturally allow Love/God to guide them and inspire them and they will enthusiastically embrace their role as creators of something New, Better, Aligned with Love/God/Light.
I have come to be grateful everyday that I have healthy, humorous, smart, KIND, Gentle, Loving adult children who will not accept Abuse from a system that feeds off of despair. They garden, clear land, landscape, grow many things from seeds, hunt and dress animals as needed, read books, sew, and all of them are amazing cooks. We are a Family of Light and hold God's Love here, present, permeating the darkness and despair around us.
I read a lot about the Dark and the Division of the family, but heaven forbid that you have your family united under one roof, that doesn't read well on the Tic Tok and FB page. It screams FAILURE as a parent and child.
I am so glad my Children, my spouse and I are FAILURES of the beast system. We have created our own way. After all WWG1WGA!
"Our society tends to regard as a sickness any mode of thought or behavior that is inconvenient for the system and this is plausible because when an individual doesn't fit into the system it causes pain to the individual as well as problems for the system. Thus the manipulation of an individual to adjust him to the system is seen as a cure for a sickness and therefore as good."
Well said! And totally right. If you are scrapping to survive but not actually surviving why bother? I think this is why my daughter is similar to the original post. Not as old yet but the writings on the wall. I question if her seeing both parents bust ass, and I mean bust ass while they were young and still struggle has made her think "why bother?"
This is exactly why i checked out of relationships. I never saw a happy couple in my childhood. Every hated their partner in my family and friend group and i never wanted to get with someone to just fake happiness and be miserable.
Yeap. I have a friend who has a 17 year old daughter. High anxiety about life. She told her mum the reason she's stressing over exams / high grades is wanting to be a psychiatrist JUST to be able not to worry about putting food on the table. It's devastating
There is no option for balance, two spouses working full time plus is what is needed just to get the downpayment together for an entry level, very modest home.
Yep, no one does it voluntarily, there's no way to pay for a house, never mind a car and food, unless both spouses work a full time crushing job. And the boomers just sit there with their piles of money from artificially inflated house prices, going "have you tried working harder, you lazy millennials?"
Most men cannot afford to provide a home to a woman. When my grandfather got married he was a draftsman working in a project office on a big construction project. He was able to afford a ring, a wedding and to buy a home for about 2.1X his income. It was a nice semi detached house in a cul-de-sac with 3 bedrooms and a driveway. He and my grandma lived there for 50 years. This was in 1955 - there was still the last auspices of war time rationing in my country that year. I believe Bananas and certain tropical fruits and nuts were very hard to come by.
I live in a 2Mx5M tool shed I rent from a crooked Indian guy for cash. I had to do some work on it to make it habitable. Its cheaper than a room in a house share and nicer than living in my car. I drive a 17 year old car I just had to put a used engine in because the original blew up and I would be screwed if I didn't do all my own work and a good scrapyard to help me out.
I couldn't even afford a ring even if I did have a woman let alone any of the other stuff. I'm just on my own waiting until the globalists finally decide to kill us all or the race war comes.
What is insane to me is that I manage, I even manage to save something some months and I haven't gone hungry or cold. I have no idea how the normies are surviving except by loading up their credit cards.
God is protecting you, apparently. I work full-time, and my wife part-time. We rent, and probably will until the aftermath of the financial collapse settles. We get by, and even thrive a bit. We're autistic about managing our credit scores and never taking on more debt than we can handle. I look at yearly, quarterly, and monthly expenses + overhead and plan out accordingly. Thankfully, we can access really low interest debt and use it as a buffer to maintain our expenses while not suffering for want. It's like juggling a Jenga tower. But we manage.
This is it exactly. They’re demoralized by the slave system we live in. Totally normal for our generation unfortunately.
You know what tended to motivate me? It was reading stories about people that overcame tremendous odds to survive, to make it despite their difficulties.
Every time I felt like quitting, I would think of those that survived the USS Indianapolis sinking or those who were forced to built the Trans Siberian Railroad, or of Shackleton's men trapped on the frozen island who never gave up.
Even the fantasy tales of my youth motivated me, like:
John Henry said to his captain, a man ain't nothing but a man, but before I let that steam drill beat me down, oh, I'll die with this hammer in my hand.
Growing up, when ever I expressed a difficulty, my father would always say, "But you can handle it can't you", and the answer would always be yup.
I memorized things like Tennyson's Ulysses, when I was young, and Act 3 Scene I of Shakespeare's Julius Caesar.
Tennyson's Ulysses:
Come, my friends,
'Tis not too late to seek a newer world.
Push off, and sitting well in order smite
The sounding furrows; for my purpose holds
To sail beyond the sunset, and the baths
Of all the western stars, until I die.
It may be that the gulfs will wash us down;
It may be we shall touch the Happy Isles,
And see the great Achilles, whom we knew.
Though much is taken, much abides; and though
We are not now that strength which in old days
Moved earth and heaven, that which we are, we are,
One equal temper of heroic hearts,
Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.
Let them live there, but they must really help in the home. Laundry, meal planinng, cooking, yard work, put in a garden. There is a great deal they both could do that contributes to the wellbeing of the household. This is up their wheelhouse, learning productive stuff. Can your son do an oil change? Your daughter likes to crochet, she could do family mending. Expand your thinking. Sounds like your daughter wants to be a traditional wife. But she needs the skills to go with it. If they can’t work at home make them volunteer for like the local gleaners organization or another non-profit. Your house, your rules. As for you, red pill them everyday. Teach them to be patriots. Are you a person of faith? Start teaching them what will trully give them the confidence in life.
You wanna know how many parents would KILL for this opportunity you have right now?
First, tell any thoughts or neighbors or "friends" trying to whisper shame into your ear for letting your kids live at home to piss right off. Traditionally, children never left home. Traditionally, whether nomadic or stagnant, families stick together. Our bullshit modern society taught us to kick our offspring out as soon as they reach a certain number. Why? So that they can go buy more shit that they don't actually need and become bogged down and miserable like your daughter claimed.
But now... your daughter is at home and has a lot of home making skills. Cultivate that! Have her consider selling some of her hand crafts. As for your son, keep cultivating his skills, but you and Yours should see this as an opportunity to BOLSTER your household and you all need to stick together as a family to survive the system.
My wife and I live with her dad. We also work part time. We also make time to spend with family and help contribute to the household. Everyone is happy and our spirits are elevated and everyone gets along just fine. Will my wife and I get out own house? Why do we have to? We have room and board provided. If we have kids, we'll find a way to make it work.
The point is, the whole buying a house and having kids = success is really just one person's idea for success. We aren't all required to agree with that. You still have healthy relationships with your children. We get one shot at this life. Even if you believe in the concept of eternity, how you experience this life is one and done. Make memories with your kids especially since they ended up coming back. Your children seem like decent people and they don't hate you. Congratulations, you won parenthood. Now it's time to be more of a mentor.
U r 100 percent correct , best comment so far , you have the answer to life !
This should be top comment.
Pull together more. Teach them about faith.
Yes, faith is important and maybe even take them to church. God can change their attitudes
The hard part is that you must lead by example. Your sincerity and dedication to faith must be authentic. Young people have a way of seeing through things. You should start going yourself. Sharing your experience in deepening your faith.
The first job out of college sucks. It's a slap in the face to everything you learned in college basically and the living style you had. Entering large POs for 8 hours a day at a small company certainly was NOT what I expected. Needless to say, I found the "real world" extremely slow and that job didn't last long. It wasn't until I applied for a job a couple weeks later I thought I wouldn't even have a chance of getting, and that's when Accounting found me. Hey, those POs at my last place actually did something afterall. They need to be searching for Jobs. No ifs ands or buts. Get a LinkedIn account. There are so many recruiters on there. Apply apply apply. Not every company is the same. Tell your son to walk into the local music shop and ask for an application in person. It's about finding a job that they want to strive in that will benefit them to the next step. Life is not easy, it never was, nor will it ever be. That's what vacations are for and I recommend you take one if you can. It's about working towards something knowing it's helping others for your benefit as well. That is what "work" really is. It's not about "being a slave". That is the worst mentality you can have. It's about the natural life of living and what it means to be apart of making others lives better in some way. Attitude goes a long way. Once they find the right job, their lives will start to shape up. Don't let them be lazy about it.
A BIG slap in the face to the everybody gets a trophy generation.
Yeah ha, well what I meant is that most college schedules are 2-3 classes a day where you can sleep in and have time in-between to go back to your dorm/apartment and chill with friends and study or whatever. These classes teach theory and upper level management concepts you won't use in a entry level job. Only to graduate and go into work for 8 hours a day with little breaks, no friends, your asking yourself why you went to college to do basic work like entering in POs all day. On top of that, the salary expectations are way off, most kids think they'll make 80k after graduation but really start off at 40k and can barely get by. This can be tough on the psyche and does take about 2 years to transition or "get broken in" to the real world schedule of work. I know exactly how it feels.
I left college before I graduated and my brother encouraged me to go to Kelly Services (I bet they don't exist anymore. It was a temp agency.) - but any good local temp agency will do - and the good thing about temp jobs is that some of them are temp-to-hire so they can try you and you can try them before they hire you. Some temp jobs are short, some are longer, some are permanent. It might be a good thing for both your children to try different things AND since it's temp work, they can literally walk away from it if they hate it. No stress or pressure to stay.
Necessity is the mother of invention. They're only going to talk about gardening and occasionally pay for shit if you allow this behavior. Act like a head of your house... you are in charge correct?
Cook only enough for you and your wife, give them the gas/electric bill and ask them what they think is a fair portion to pay. Hand her some seeds and shovel and tell her to contribute instead of talk about it.
My best friend and I would still be living together to this day if he hadn't fallen in love. In 6 years I can count on one hand how many times he did the dishes... I swear he was allergic to doing dishes but I always had my laundry folded and on my bed whenever I'd forget and I can't count on my fingers and toes how many times he loaned me money.
You ain't gotta be perfect but you do have to give more than you receive to make the world better. They'll just keep taking instead of giving. Even at the most elemental biological growth only happens... I don't want to lift weights but my muscles grow when they're uncomfortable and ripped to shreds by me. That doesn't mean I hate my body for making it uncomfortable and testing it's capabilities it actually means I care more.
Do you want a fat gut on your lazy children? Do you want them dumb and lazy? Beat them at chess, grow a better garden and keep track of who lost at penny poker. Remind them you produced more lettuce, remind them you're eating crab and steak because you earned something by making yourself uncomfortable and they can go grill up a chicken after they pluck it... hand them the chicken and knife.
Make them uncomfortable or they're never going to grow... the art of being a parent is doing so in such a style that they can't deny you love them.
Most dedicated mothers would tell you that being a stay at home mother of children is a pretty tough assignment, one where your life is not you own.
I suspect if the daughter cannot handle work task, that she would not be able to function as a dutiful mother.
I disagree.
I see what you mean by this, but I disagree. Yes, being a stay-at-home mom means putting your children's needs first. This may sound like a "bad" thing because you won't have time to draw butterflies, take long baths, watch youtube videos all day, etc. Instead your days are filled with meaning and higher purpose. I am a stay-at-home mom of 3. I homeschool them and take them to all their extra-curriculars (dance, soccer, piano, etc.). I rarely have time for myself, but I have never been happier in my life. Funny how that is. I feel like many childless women are depressed because they lack a higher purpose. And what's the point in even trying in life if you lack any purpose?
Perhaps I used the wrong words. In saying, "You life is not your own", I was merely saying that a stay at home mother is not free to kick up her heels and do as she likes. It may be though that the things which she likes, are the things that center around the well being of her husband, and of the family, , as was the case with my mom.
I'm sure I cannot paint with words a true picture of my mother, but I will do my best.
My mother was very happy, all of her life, but more than happy, as she put it, she was content, always content. I think in her mind, being in a state of discontent put her in conflict with her faith in Jesus Christ. Sure one could fall into a state of discontent, but remaining in that state very long, was a sign of lack of faith in the promises of God obtained through knowing the word, and through prayer.
"If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you." John 15:7
She viewed "happiness" as a condition of circumstances, but true contentment as something that was independent of ones circumstances, and she lived a life that proved out her unshakable faith. I never saw it waver, not one time, not for one second, even in the most trying times, and I learned of many times when faith was the only thing that sustained her and my dad, the family though some tough times. My grandmother was the same kind of woman. Stories were told around the dinner table, so to speak, of my grandmother's faith, and my mothers.
Regrettably, it was me, more than once, that put my mother in desperate conditions where her faith was tested, and under which her faith was proven for all to see.
Example: I was in a head on collision. Doctors did not expect me to live. Yet when my mother arrived at the hospital, all were amazed at her calm and composed demeanor, her since of assurance that I would live, that all would be well.
Obviously I did live, and despite my hip being broken in 10 places, my knees cut up, and a serious concussion, after a month long hospital stay, in four months I was jump starting from a pair of crutches, off the river bank with a waters ski.
During my month long hospital stay, I had many visitors. I heard some of them speak in amazement of how my mother throughout the entire ordeal seemed never in a state of worry. Latter during my recovery, and after hearing other speak of this, I spoke to my mom about it.
After my accident, the police called my dad. My dad drove home and told my mother. My mom said when she got the news, she fell apart, the thought of her baby, I was the youngest of five, critically injured, at deaths door was more than she could handle. She told me that she prayed, told God, "Lord, this is more than I can handle, I am turning this over to you. Your will be done." And at that point she says that that piece beyond understanding described in Philippians 4:7, came over her. The tempest upon which she had been tossed becalmed as though Jesus commanded the raging storm within her, "Piece, be still".
This is only one of the examples where my mothers faith was by trial, weighed in the balance, and proved the measure of it's worth.
This is why my mom was able to find contentment in all situations, because she understood that no matter what the circumstances, when she did all she could do, the rest was in Gods hands.
What a beautiful story. Thank you for sharing.
No reason your two ADULT children can't at least work part time and contribute to the financial burden nor should they have a free pass in the house. All fine and dandy to decide adulting is too much, but that just dumps extra adulting on you and your spouse, which is not right. And yes, I have two adult children - 33 and 24
Well said!
your kids sound awesome. just love them. its a good sign that they don't feel like participating in this society.
it took me a while to get from metaphysics to Christianity, but every step in the process was necessary.
You're missing the point here. They are sponging off their mother. This is wrong for an adult. They need to get out of her house and get jobs.
In fact, the boomers have been sponging off of the generations to come, for decades. Unrepayable deficits? Mass immigration to keep the house prices going up up up? Nation-bankrupting pensions? All retired boomers owe everything they have to the as-yet unperformed labour of their grandkids. And yet, when one asks them to share the wealth....
That's a brilliant viewpoint. We all rode the merry-go-round, naively thinking it would last forever. I knew 40 years ago that something wasn't right. I swore to myself and others that I wasn't getting on the ride, but I fell for the bait and spent the next 25 years hypnotically participating. I was lucky to have had the opportunity to jump off when the merry-go-round slowed down in 2008 and I have been deprogramming myself ever since.
I have sympathy for anyone that is beginning to see through the veil. I'm starting to see homeless people as the smart ones.
I don’t blame you or any other boomer for doing what they do. I appreciate your self reflection. The problem is that the boomers had as much control over their government as we do ours unfortunately that is none. The United States has always been an oligarchy as far back as 1913? 1872?
Boomers haven't been sponging off the generations to come. Boomers have paid their dues. Many were killed off from the clot shots. Many younger people are on SS and Medicare/Medicaid because they cannot function for any reason. Kick off illegals who get welfare etc. There is plenty of money to take care of Americans.
Boomers lived it up on deficits they expected someone else to pay. Their pensions are bankrupting the nation. Many more retired on the gains their houses made under mass immigration, but the effect of this was future generations have to pay 40x as much for a house when starting out. Every one of boomers’ gains has been at the expense of future generations.
The math shows otherwise- if their pension funds and social security funds had not been plundered, if the petro/fiat dollar hadn't been artificially devalued, they would have plenty of their own money to live off of.
The pensions and social security funds were plundered by boomer retirees expecting to live it up for 20+ years without having to work. The generation that came before never had such a thing, no one did. Living within their means is boomer kryptonite.
The devaluation of the dollar was caused by money printing, which was demanded by boomers and their incessant need to spend more than they have.
I don't know how it works in other countries but I paid into the UK government pension scheme for 43 years and into my own private pension fund for at least twenty years. That money was invested (I had no say in it) and, assuming that it was invested wisely, should pay me minimum wage until I'm 100. In other words, the government and the private pension company are paying me back the capital that I lent them plus interest, which obviously should be less than the profits they made by investing my money. If they invested unwisely, and/or allowed someone to steal part of my capital, that's not my fault.
Wow that's a lot of programming to unpack. Good luck with that.
By riding the coattails of the greatest generation and screwing all us over?
Yikes! The greatest generation who gave boomers life, taught them to worship God, honest work for honest pay, save for a rainy day, reduce, recycle and reuse things, if you can't buy it in cash, you can't buy it and many more gems. My siblings and I are boomers and none have/are mooching off the system. We have worked very hard all our lives, saving until we could afford items, or down payment for items and now is the time to retire. Now people believe they should have everything they want immediately without saving or working for it. Nor, do they even know what a need is vs a want. Perhaps there are a few boomers that are taking advantage of the system, but I have not come across one yet. There are many people who are not boomers who are on social security and medicare/medicaid who are screwing the system. Then, throw the illegals into the medicare/medicaid, social security mix.
Rewind, pedes- the government institutions of daycare and indoctrination did their jobs and brainwashed generations of kids successfully to look to the government and big business for all the answers. We're simply in the dying phase of all that. Those families who stuck to God or returned to God have no problem finding motivation to be productive. There are some self-starters who do it on their own as well. But the drive to make a life for oneself starts optimally with the parents. Not too late to find Christ and start taking on missions for the family or church.
Says who and based on what?
They might not need to leave but they do need to contribute
Wow!
Your fan
:)
This isnt your failure. This is a societal failure. Their behavior I believe is because you raised them to be critical thinkers instead of drones.
I think they are the future, and I think if we all work together it can be a better future then what was planned.
Talk to them and listen. Share your awakening. Work together. Love each other.
They don’t want to prop up evil. Help them find a path of light. Turn off internet and tv. Focus locally. Move to a small town, If your not in one.
Or move to a farm/homestead. Let them see and feel the results of real labour that provides direct benefits.
Easier said than done.
End won't be for everyone.
Correct, but that is not the only path. You can sustain a large household just fine in the city.
"You NEED your own house, you NEED your own car" these are lies to perpetuate hyper consumerism.
Cities are still poison though. You can't live, grow, breathe; you're surrounded by rats and filth on many levels. If they're not going to work for money, get out someplace where they can grow and raise their food; it's the only logical solution to needing to eat.
Corporate America can do that to a youngster. Especially in I.T. and the coding industry with stiff competition from India etc. The landscape of corporate culture is not the same from 15 years ago. It is much worse in my opinion.
Also, I’m thinking tictok, youtube, etc are more dangerous than we currently even know or realize. I think the ‘enemy’ has had some of the most devious psychologists developing it as a weapon for decades. Some are more susceptible than others but there is no ignoring the dopamine hits with video games etc.
My only suggestion would be to somehow limit the internet usage or ween it down while replacing it with something healthier. No small task, i know, but a thought. Easy to say, but try to find a club, hobby, new interest for them and act on it regularly. If it is possible that you can be involved, maybe all the better depending on the situation.
If your daughter has any interest in working for herself somehow or a ‘remote’ type position, there are more resources than ever due to the double edged sword of the internet. Freelance or consulting work may be a better fit.
Maybe your kids would have to ‘earn’ their internet free time with other productive time. This will not be easy to formulate or work-thru. Prepare for a battle royale, and things might get worse b4 better. I realize they aren’t young teens so this is tough.
Figure out how to spark or encourage healthy time and interests. Do some very off-the-wall brainstorming of ideas that are waaay out of the normal for each of you.
Try looking into Andy Frisella 75-hard - book and program (free program). It isn’t for everyone that is for sure.
Just do not ever give up on them.
Actually it should be said that the IT sector has changed a lot in the last decade or so since all the Indian outsourcing came in. Not just in the US but the same thing has happened in a lot of countries. The culture became a lot more toxic and the back stabbing and the nepotism went off the scale because many of these Indian workers they have shipped in are incompetent and cover it up by causing extreme disruption in the work environment.
My mother lost her last job to outsourcing and the last few years of it were utter hell as the Indians came in, made a dogs dinner of everything and then proceeded to blame every one else but themselves so work became mostly about arse covering and deflecting unfounded allegations.
The only thing that makes India competitive is the price of developers. As for the code, it is utter garbage. I waste hours sifting through bad code in offshore PRs. Then I spend more hours explaining why security checks should never be relied on, solely in Javascript, which they try to excuse and bs their way out of fixing, resulting in me recording videos of myself hacking up the DOM and JS in less than 5 seconds, bypassing their "security".
Agreed......and your scenario is happening in many industries (tech, engineering, healthcare, military...etc) with many foreign countries. With the current ‘outsourcing’ trend, the importance of any corporate patriotism has all but vanished, mostly due to a short sighted view of the bottom line.
I didn’t mean to imply the current ‘foreign’ competition (and outsourcing) was fair, healthy, or good. Just that it has made a mess of things for a newb getting into the industry as was the case with the original post / story.
Okay, Boomer. Nevermind the fact that violent crime has just happened to go down along with the rise of videogames...
And Imma guess you're one of those correct religion types seeing as you're intimidated by platforms that allow people to speak their minds freely.
Ok boomer? Really? Do you have kids? Are you old enough? Just wondering.
It is a fact that video game designers design for dopamine hits in order to create an addictive reaction cycle / scenario.
Not sure I understand your 2nd paragraph. Did something i wrote indicate I am not for free speech? Odd - not my intent. I’m very pro 1st amendment. Not crazy about porn books in grade school being pushed on kids considered as free speech though - you?.
My point is that it is tough to raise kids when they are literally addicted to video games and phone apps. Not everyone who uses is an addict but some can certainly succumb to an unhealthy point just like anything that is designed to be addictive - drugs, sugar, pop-music, gambling, pick your poison..
I am kind of like your daughter- went to college, was excited to get a job at a big company and work my way up. I’ve worked at a huge global a bank for 11 years now, and I’ve worked my way up the ladder. All that time, I was so motivated to get the next pay raise or next better position. Once you do that for awhile, you really do see how you’re just a cog in a machine that is constantly demanding more of you than you can reasonably give. Every month, the goals and expectations get higher and higher. Boss says “wow, you did amazing this month! You completed 100 accounts, so next month I want you to complete 110.” They do this every single month, you have to push yourself harder and harder all the time. At some point, you say to yourself “why am I doing all this.” I started getting more panic attacks and feeling generally fearful of the insane goals. I empathize for sure. She will have to accept that is how the corporate world works and to find ways to live and make it bearable or leave big business altogether and do something else. I took a lower position in the company that is “easier” and less stressful to make it work and so that I can enjoy my life outside of work
I can't imagine being a young person just starting off in the world. Rent is outrageous, the prices of a car, even used, is through the roof. Groceries and goods are nuts. If you do the math for the average starting salary vs bills, it just does not compute. I held onto my first home that will be paid off in 5 years. I'm holding onto it for my boys to have an affordable place to live if they stay in the area. Right now a 3 bedroom house in my old neighborhood is renting out for $2,400.00 a month. That is insane to me.
You're right. When I got married at 29 yrs old, I was only provider, and yet we bought a house, had two cars, a child, did not want for middle class comforts, could save a little, and had some play money left over at the end of the month.
I was not what you would consider a high earner, but if you consider 55k income in 1985 had the same purchasing power as 157K today, that explains it.
I can't imagine a young person making it today in the same fashion.
they sound like patriots to me actually, who do not fit in with this modern failed society. at the same time though, patriots do not take hand-outs or freebies, we must be productive.
its hard to find good work in this particular time because of all the corruption, the forced mandates & peer pressure, but there are a few jobs that sort of "side-steps" all of that. for me, it was:
(1) auto detail, either the lot provides you an outside shop or you work privately
(2) door dash/uber, great for winter time, as most of the time spent on the job is in my car with the heat on
(3) yardwork/mowing/contract, warm weather job, similar to food delivery in that i get my job, show up with me or a couple fellow workers & just work. nobody checking in, breathing down your neck, etc.
these jobs can bring in decent money & if your children are living at home, for a time the bills could be shared or split between you all & money could be saved up for everyone involved.
there are also great benefits to helping other people who need you, rather than focusing so much on our own wealth or current state, which is why i would also recommend some type of job, even if its volunteering, where they help take care of others in need. you get so much out of helping others, it makes you feel good & if its volunteer work, they may get offered jobs along the way. who knows who you could meet & opportunities you could have by meeting people out in the world.
just remember, the Lord God PROVIDES for His people. You & your children sound like people I would like to know, ya'll aren't "drones" & we need more of that in society. We all just need a little "push" every now & then.
God Bless You!
Your daughter is unfortunately the product of a society that forces women to be second rate men slaving away in a workplace. Women were designed to be wives and mothers; they naturally find this role fulfilling. Modern society continually lies to them that there’s something bigger and better, but leaves them empty and unsatisfied as you have seen first hand.
The exact same thing is happening with your son and the fulfilling role of being a husband and father, the satisfaction of responsibility.
See if you can get both of your children to watch Dr Jordan Peterson. Not as good as the Bible, but Peterson can provide the gateway to deeper appreciation of God’s divine wisdom.
I second this! Also have her watch/listen to Stefan Molyneux. When I was an aimless young woman, watching his podcasts awakened me to the lies of feminism. I am in my 30's now. I'm married with children and I stay-at-home to homeschool them. I have found a higher purpose and I couldn't be happier. Sounds like the daughter is lacking real meaning to her life and that's something I used to struggle with too.
https://freedomain.com/
If it were my kids I would: 1 start by making them pay affordable but not cheap rent. They then at least have to get some job or find somewhere where they will pay even more rent 2 get them out of any counselors or into an actual good psychologist who doesn’t do bullshit and give them the mental health outs. 3 show them that it’s completely possible to live a successful life without high stress. Money isn’t worth everything. Smaller house, cheaper area if you are in an expensive big city, smaller expenses, a job that is part remote, etc. 4 make them serve others. Happiness comes from within and serving people is one of the best ways to spark that. Hey Jenny if you want to stay rent free you need to volunteer at the soup kitchen 1 hour a day and see what it’s like to really struggle. Something like that.
I’m in Alabama and you can still have a good job and live a great life without insane taxes or commutes.
Also one of my favorite life lessons is CHOOSE YOUR HARD. It’s hard to be poor it’s hard to be rich - I’d rather have problems with money than without.
It’s hard to be married it’s hard to be single but at least married you have company and share your struggles. But to each their own.
Ehhh, your looking at this wrong. They've actually found the answer: disconnect. Society and societal success is a soul sucking pursuit that leads to early death and misery.
That dosen't mean they don't need to earn their keep. Let them do what they want, but don't let them take advantage of you or your good graces. Charge them rent. They should be buying their own food, etc. If you don't want them living with you, perhaps they can move out and get a place together.
You're making it too comfortable for them, and that's causing more harm than good. People just go from womb to womb. It's part of our nature.
Encourage your kids to learn a trade.
Yes. I wish i did that instead of college. Especially nowadays where you get into mass debt just to be taught to hate your own culture and history.
Everyone will always need trades.
There's no way to save them. What they want is the lifestyle you boomers enjoyed. They want a house that costs 5 years of one spouse's salary. They want one spouse staying home to keep house and raise the kids. They want a car or two, a vacation or two a year, and a chance at actually retiring.
The best they can hope for is a house that costs 30 years of two spouses' salary. Neither spouse may stay home, both must work a soul-crushing job 40+ hours a week, and so the housework falls by the wayside. A car these days costs as much as a house did when you were young. All jobs today basically expect that you work through your vacation even if you're legally entitled to it. Aside from that, most jobs also expect that you work when you're not working by answering emails etc.
The solution might have been for your generation to live within their means, but they didn't. They racked up unrepayable deficits for decades, invited the entire third world to come here so the pensions don't collapse. Mass immigration also hyperinflated the cost of housing (which boomers have been riding high on) while suppressing the price of labour (making it impossible for subsequent generations to save enough to buy in).
If people from your generation found themselves in the hopeless dire straits today's youth are in, they'd opt out as well.
While that is partially true it is not exactly true in all of the western world. I do agree that younger generations have it tougher but since they have time on their side they can chase and live the dream at some point.
Millennials are a good example of being hit with multiple plandemics and still are rising in home ownership and they haven't even inherited if any of their homes from their parents or grand parents yet aka baby boomers.
Time solves a lot of problems but in the mean time what matters is that you stay focused in the short term.
"Home ownership" to a millennial means being saddled with a mortgage being worth 2 spouses' full time work for 30 years. It's an impossible-to-repay burden that demands 80+ hours each week of full time work.
"Home ownership" to a boomer meant a 5 year mortgage that one spouse working could pay off.
Millennials are also a generation that save more relative to their age bracket. And they have the aid of technology to be able to make money with side hustles that can be done all at home.
Boomer did have it easier but you are glossing over the fact that interest rates were much higher so you had to make money and put down more money on homes to make a purchase.
So the only real advantage boomers had back then was purchasing power IMO as wages kept up with the cost of housing They didn't have the advantage of technology like millennials do or information at their fingertips.
There's no choice. If you want a down payment for a house you have to save up as much money as your entire house cost you.
Lol I'll take high interest and house prices 1/50th of what they are now, over what we have today, any day. The fact is, ONE SPOUSE WORKING could pay it all off in your day, while today, TWO SPOUSES WORKING FULL TIME can't pay it all off.
I would gladly trade the internet for a functional homogenous high trust society.
I am an older millennial so I remember the 80s well aka pre internet 90s peak consumer age and I prefer this age because we have knowledge at our finger tips.
The 80s was great if you wanted a 12% CD though for example but it also was a period of uncertainty due to the cold war.
For the age of having a husband work and a wife to stay home which was the 1950s it requires a huge shift in society. Women were skilled in not only cooking, baking, sewing, but also plumbing and light electrical work. The men worked a job but they also had a responsibility to forgo escapism and put family first. Doing as many repairs of their home and car as possible. Saving and investing money wisely for the yearly family vacation. Consumerism wasn't a priority and you can see a glimpse of that life style in eastern Europe today.
I understand your frustration, but perhaps not wanting to slave away in a unforgiving and unrewarding system is the only logical move left to make? We are currently in a massive societal transition, and when things settle down the entire concept of 'work' and 'being productive' will fundamentally change in ways you may find difficult to predict.
I highly recommend watching this video regarding the next 3 year timeline of AI rollout: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Se91Pn3xxSs
Encourage your kids to start experimenting with AI and learning how to use it for their own personal projects or hobbies.
The guy in this video wearing the hat is Emad Mostaque (founder and CEO of Stability AI) and he strongly believes that the initial productivity gains from AI seen this last year will quickly turn into a catastrophic period of mass layoffs within 1-2 years.
You will find that UBI or a similar system of monthly income will likely roll out around this same time to allow people to adjust. AI will not shrink the job market in many industries, it will completely remove them. Almost any job that requires a computer. Programming will no longer be a profession, along will law, accounting, teaching, etc.
The biggest problem to prepare for will be those unable to adjust. People that define themselves with their job or profession are going to be in serious psychological trouble/depressed. There will be new ways to interact with people and cultivate meaning and purpose in life.
I’m watching this right now and it’s hitting me for the first time how…massively…AI is entering and changing our reality. It’s something I’ve paid very little attention to up until now. Fascinating. Completely scrambles and obliterates my predictions (pure speculation of course) of the future. As those two blokes discussed, it WILL either free and unlock humanity, or create an unspeakable nightmare Slave world. Thankful I’m an optimist right now. I feel like I better get to familiarizing myself with it. Where do I even begin?
Welcome to the 2020s. I’m studying for a degree in the healthcare industry which I started before the pandemic hit, but after seeing the atrocities many healthcare professionals committed during Covid, including mandating the defective mRNA vaccines and then gaslighting people who got negatively impacted by this rushed and under tested technology, I’m starting to lose faith in something that I used to have some passion about. I’m now wondering if I should even pursue a career in healthcare even if I do manage to graduate. Is all that money worth it in exchange for the sacrifice of my mental health and moral values?
Hi Red Pill Boomer - I don't typically like to dish out thoughts on other people's lives, but since you've asked...
It sounds like your daughter may be having a quarter life crisis. Very common.
She had worked her whole life towards a goal, and then when she got it - what now?
More than anything, she came to realize that life alone in an apartment is not meaningful. Even if she had a "dream job."
The one thing she thought would fulfill her didn't. Now she's floating in aimlessness.
It's wonderful that she has your home to crash back into, but it's true that she does have to have an aim.
She must cast a vision for what her future could be. What future does she WANT to aim for that's bigger and better than her present, or her past?
And truly discovering what it is that she wants out of life.
It's not being in software.
Is it starting a family?
She simply needs to find herself. And there's likely a lot of pain - thus the endless scrolling in an effort to numb the pain.
She's got a lot of inner-work to do. But once she figures it out, her little brother can witness that and follow in her footsteps. <3
R3: quarter life crisis- I do remember that time and it is hard. Part of the problem is she is not too far out of school which offers a lot of structure and there are paths and goals that are more or less defined but upon leaving school, it is not as clear.
Also, for many women, the skills for which they are rewarded for in school - straight As, being "a good girl" - are not necessarily the ones that lead to success in the work world. That is a big lesson, especially for the high achievers.
Even the question is wrong: people are not missing this magical "motivation" pixie dust. In fact, you yourself pointed out that your daughter was "motivated" and now she is not. Did her bottle of magic pixie dust run out?
No. You are just describing their behavior, not some magical "motivation" stuff that they do not have. Really what you see is that they are not moving towards a goal and a life where they can take care of themselves. You describe that as not having "motivation", but that is just one metal model of many you could use to think about the situation, and likely not the most helpful one.
People act "motivated" when they have a vision of something they want that calls to them. Everyone has something that calls to them. For your daughter it was coding, but now it is wearing dresses. For your son it is listening to the prayers of trees.
A problem is a difference between (1) the way the world is and (2) what a human wants. There are no problems out there in the world; problems only arise when a human starts wanting things.
You have a desire for your children to be other than the way they are. That is all you. They own their lives, not you. It is actually an act of aggression to pretend that you own their lives and that therefore you have the right to be disappointed in them. They own their lives, not you. Your kids do not have a problem; you do.
My mom told me and my brother she would love us no matter what, even if we were garbage collectors. (I happen to have a lot of respect for garbage collectors, but that is what she said.) My brother and I have worked our whole lives to do difficult things. No one had to "motivate" us.
From the outside I look like the most motivated person in the world: I work flat out all of the time on my startup which is quite technically challenging and I am at risk of being homeless at any time due to lack of funding. I have been doing this for almost 2 decades.
Other people see me doing this and help me for no pay, such as my very expensive lawyer to whom I pay nothing. I have an entire team of advisors most of whom have a Ph.D. from Berkeley and to whom I pay nothing. In fact they pay me: one of the people who funds me was one of the people at Berkeley who got the internet to work.
That's what being called towards a vision looks like from the outside: "that guy is so motivated I'm going to work for him for free and give him money". But to me, from the inside, it is just that I have a vision that calls to me and that I going toward no matter the circumstances.
You could try just asking your kids what calls to them. What is your daughter making right now? Could you help her crochet it? Have you tried going into the forest with your son and listening to the prayers of trees? I lived in a Zen practice place for 10 weeks once and it was one of the best things I ever did. Listening to trees can be great.
You could also point out how much it costs you to have them living with you and ask if they could contribute to the expense. Like write it down exactly in a spreadsheet so you know exactly how much it is. How much would they have to contribute before you would be ok with them just living there indefinitely?
In ancient times, that's just how people lived, communally, working together. Many people miss that very much (as your daughter said). You have two children and many, such as myself, do not. You could try just being grateful for that.
Are you grateful that they are alive? Have you tried telling them that? What if one of them killed themselves? Would you be sad? You could try telling them that. I have intervened in two suicide attempts and witnessed a third, all of people I knew personally. Have not lost anyone yet, but once you have been through that, you might complain less about people who you love.
My dad was a doctor and once substituted for a doctor on vacation who was local county medical examiner. My dad thought it would be good for my education if I went with him to pick up the (unprepared) dead bodies. I will never forget the first one, a rich guy, laying on the table while his butler puttered around nervously, not knowing what to do now that master was dead, while my dad filled out the death certificate. It took him a while.
I remember seeing blotches of purple and green on his very white face and thinking "wow, dead people are purple and green". I remember how he smelled, very, very sweet, cloyingly sweet. When I got to high school, I was the only student who know what Shakespeare meant by "the sweet smell of death".
Please stop complaining that your children are not what you wanted. If you have to, imagine that you just had to go to the morgue to identify one of their bodies, and now you are alone in your house forever without them. How do you feel? Maybe try telling your kids that feeling. If tears come to your eyes, let them.
Nice response.
here in AZ you have to kill yourself at work just to keep a leaky roof over your head. I am sure it is absolutely demoralizing to our children.
I'm 32 and I feel the same way as your kids. Everyone says live your life cos life is too short but i just look around and feel life is too long.
I cant imagine doing this for another 30/40 years.
I think we are all barely hanging on waiting for the plan to finish up.
Congratulations. Your kids are intelligent enough to quickly learn the ‘real world’ is a total scam. I’ve been in a state of severe burnout for more than 10 years but just keep plugging along because I have no choice or fallback.
Cryptocurrency and trying to breathe life into a career switch to sales is my hope.
Otherwise the present and past 10+ years have been totally worthless.
All of my friends are in the same position. Drug down by work, mentally drained.
Anyone having a good time in these years are simple minded dog loving sports watching NPC’s.
This world is not meant for me. But I’m already here so I’m trying to obtain some shred of the world I want.
But primarily my desperation is for any of my friends and my mom to have the free time to be happy and do things together on a regular basis like life was in the 90s.
It sounds like your daughter had a mini breakdown. Your son is doing some soul-searching. Bless you for your heart and the service you are giving to them right now. All is well. They will both be fine and find their way. Sometimes it takes longer than we think it should. Be patient and understand that there is a reason for everything. You don't really know if this is good or bad. In the end, like many of the moments and situations I have lived through I end up seeing God's hand in it all. Blessings and love to you and your family.
It is very difficult to motivate people. If they lack the spark to live, no one else can give it to them. Your daughter is probably depressed and anxious due to malnutrition. Your son has amotivational syndrome due to his pot smoking. Those two should get their own apartment and leave your home.
Your kids figured out how hard it is to work every day instead of sitting around doing what they are doing now.
If you dont kick them out you will be supporting them forever.
Its called tough love sit them down and talk to them give them a specific amount of time say 6 months to get jobs and their own place to live. You obviously need to explain to them that you worked your whole life and it is now their turn to work and support themselves. Let them know it is not your job to support them once they are adults. If you dont then you yourself will be missing out on your own life and money will be tight.
Prayers sent for your kids.
Definitely worth praying about. Rejecting the rat race is a good thing; doing nothing is a poor alternative.
Help them find their place. They've obviously both been burned by the system, and your guidance will be important. And time, even though it already seems like a lot. Sorry I don't have more specific advice, but I do empathize. Time will help. God bless.
"She said she felt used and unloved by her managers and coworkers, and hated coming home to an empty apartment every night."
You say a lot of interesting things in the paragraphs above. The one I found most interesting was the quote from your daughter I copied at the start of this, above. I don't know your family situation, but if you have a wife who is against you and not on the same page as you, your life can be difficult also. If you aren't married or if you are and your wife are on the same page, let the children (adults) know they have a specific amount of time to get their act together and make plans on getting a job and working, one you are going to start making them pay rent, two you are going to kick them out when the time limit is up and they are not working by that time. Otherwise they might be sponges all their lives. And your daughter shouldn't be seeking lover from her managers and coworkers, one or two might be love interests, but not all of them. She was hired to do a job, not to be adored by her managers or coworkers. A little harsh, but true.
Now, my wife wouldn't allow me to do this to with our children-that is why I stated you both need to be on the same page. But my kids, both boys have their own lives and are out of the house-we did let one of them live with us for a couple of years to save money for a house (no rent, per my wife and the stay went slightly over two years). Oh well, that was my
I am sorry to say this but almost everybody here is still brainwashed into thinking you must have work all the time. I am not saying YT or Tick Tock is a way to go (they should do something productive) but the thing you needed to do is say that everything is ok. If she left her job, ok then. She probably should have done that a long time ago if she wasn´t happy.
Maybe she needs a boy. Maybe she needs catch up in her personal life. I don´t know. But I personally had the best time in my life when I could just focus on my own projects (programmer here). Ask her about them. Or she could do something mentally easier part time to buy some food at least (eg. cashier, in warehouse). Forcing her to work (real job) because then she can afford mortgage for a maybe quarter of a house? Don´t you think it is just going to be even worse for her?
This is the transition time where things just sucks.
The three of you are being surrounded by love and prayer. God's will be done.
I’m at work rn,
so i have little time to answer until my next break.
but it sounds like your daughter is actually headed in the “right” direction; being a Feminine Woman.
Her past self sounds like “3rd-Wave-Feminis-I’m-a-Strong-Independent-Woman-Who-Don’t-Need-No-Man.”
The Illuminati really messed up the world man.
Here's a bit of a strategy: I have no idea if it works for you, but it worked for us, so might as well try:
I've seen my family wither from this modernity garbage, so I turned the backyard into garden, all of it. Every kid a patch and the one who grows the least gets no internet in the winter unless they make up for it with fixing the house. They're alive, determined, they up each other on skills and knowledge.. I felt bad for doing it but my kids now are happy. I hope you and your family find the strength to grow into the humans they're meant to be. Lots of good luck!
I never wanted children either - and I do feel alot like your son and daughter too minus the weird philosophical bushwa. My greatest achievement is definitely abstaining from procreating and bringing innocence into shitty ass clown world. I often wish my parents had been more careful - this grind isn't exciting at all.
OP, some tough love advice - our daughter and her wife moved on when their landlord decided to sell the house they were renting. They had worked steadily. We offered to let them move into house until another rental/sale became available. MISTAKE - all of a sudden, their work ethic was nowhere to be found. My husband and I put up with it for several months and we finally said, "We love y'all but we're hurting you by allowing you to live this way." They moved out. Miracle (sarcasm) w/in a week they both scored great jobs at a casino. If we had not put our feet down, they'd still be here allowing us to cook and clean for them.
I'm going to offer a different take than others here.
One, I don't think you should consider the two of them to have entirely the same problems. Getting high is probably your son's largest problem. While some people can function through that, a lot of people cannot. If he's not sober, you're probably not making any progress. And it is certainly not a trait that builds a strong man. Beyond that, he sounds like a young man seeking purpose. Which is the one thing your children seem to have in common.
Your daughter sounds like she bought into the lie that living life like a man can be fulfilling for a woman. For the most part, that's not true. And now she's trying to find a foundation to build up a radically different worldview. But is getting ideas from social media, which is basically condensed insanity. This may sound really sexist and misogynistic, but more than anything it sounds like she just needs a good man to be her foundation. She was smart enough to figure out that the life she was sold sucks, but doesn't seem to understand the next step and is searching. And probably not even willing to entertain the old fashioned idea of a traditional relationship as a foundation.
I would support the searching and try to guide it in subtle ways, while drawing a hard line only on toxic behaviors (like substance abuse). They both lack a foundation, and are using you as that. Leverage it to help them build their own.
This is what happens to the "everyone gets a trophy" generation.
LMAO
I read this out loud and my 21 and 23 year old sons thought I had made a post about them (my shaman and my pot smoking empath) and their 34 year old sister. She moved home after a failed relationship and she too needed kindness and a warm loving place to raise her son. She is a licensed RN, worked for the past 10 years in ERD, which wrung her empty. I am BLESSED to have my children living with my spouse and I. They are the younger of 5. The older 2 are late 30s early 40s and both were able to become established before inflation made it impossible to exist on the slave wages provided in a career. All 3 work with regular income (pay their way in the Family system), but it is so much easier to enjoy life in a Shared space. Our household income combined now is upwards of 20K a month and so we can eat organic home cooked meals prepared with everyone participating. Lots of laughter, wine on the weekends, new patio, dart board and pool table, pool w/spa, playground, and our 2 year old grandson who is "part of the crew".
As with all things, this too shall pass, but these particles of light came through you as "system busters". From the moment they understood that the beast system was RIGGED against them, they had the audacity to say, "Nope, hard pass" and if you are what I believe you are, a Hue Man, a BEING of Divine Light, a bridger between the old dark world and the new Light world, you will rejoice because you get to enjoy the creation part. Very shortly here, LIGHT will be flowing and as they refused to be severed from it (they will not tolerate a subhuman existence) they will naturally allow Love/God to guide them and inspire them and they will enthusiastically embrace their role as creators of something New, Better, Aligned with Love/God/Light.
I have come to be grateful everyday that I have healthy, humorous, smart, KIND, Gentle, Loving adult children who will not accept Abuse from a system that feeds off of despair. They garden, clear land, landscape, grow many things from seeds, hunt and dress animals as needed, read books, sew, and all of them are amazing cooks. We are a Family of Light and hold God's Love here, present, permeating the darkness and despair around us.
I read a lot about the Dark and the Division of the family, but heaven forbid that you have your family united under one roof, that doesn't read well on the Tic Tok and FB page. It screams FAILURE as a parent and child. I am so glad my Children, my spouse and I are FAILURES of the beast system. We have created our own way. After all WWG1WGA!
Here's a unabomber quote to dwell on...
"Our society tends to regard as a sickness any mode of thought or behavior that is inconvenient for the system and this is plausible because when an individual doesn't fit into the system it causes pain to the individual as well as problems for the system. Thus the manipulation of an individual to adjust him to the system is seen as a cure for a sickness and therefore as good."